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How I have scored invoice pricing with 3.99% APR on my 370Z?

Originally Posted by GT-R man I have noticed that on this forum unless you hear something that you agree with people dont seem to take it as a learning experience,

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Old 03-11-2009, 10:22 AM   #76 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by GT-R man View Post
I have noticed that on this forum unless you hear something that you agree with people dont seem to take it as a learning experience, and SUBTURD is right dealers are numbering their days... and same to buyers.... because once the little dealers go broke and only the large ones are left... they will reign over their region, either new cars will become automated where you put in a price like on ebay and hope they accept the offer "best case scenario for all buyers" or they will have rediculous prices and make is so hard for customers to buy cars at reasonable prices that customer will buy mostly used cars.

but regardless of what happens the way it is now is going to change either completly eliminating my job or giving me a raise... either way customers will still not like to buy cars because customers hate to negotiate...
I have to disagree completely.
With the introduction of mass media, internet, etc. People have become more aware of better deals, how to negotiate, and where to look. I am still shocked at the number of people still going to a dealer and taking the first deal (good for a dealership), but those days are numbered with how quickly people have instant access. Instead of having to go to 10 dealerships and haggle, then go home and find reviews, books, or friends; now people can spend ten minutes, or more, online and access best interest rate, invoice price (fair market value for your region), etc.

The idea of haggling will soon die, and either dealerships will embrace this new customer awareness or not be around anymore.
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:16 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by GT-R man View Post
I have noticed that on this forum unless you hear something that you agree with people dont seem to take it as a learning experience, and SUBTURD is right dealers are numbering their days... and same to buyers.... because once the little dealers go broke and only the large ones are left... they will reign over their region, either new cars will become automated where you put in a price like on ebay and hope they accept the offer "best case scenario for all buyers" or they will have rediculous prices and make is so hard for customers to buy cars at reasonable prices that customer will buy mostly used cars.

but regardless of what happens the way it is now is going to change either completly eliminating my job or giving me a raise... either way customers will still not like to buy cars because customers hate to negotiate...
GT-R Man: No one will ever accuse you of putting forth an intelligent counter-arguement, lol. However, your incoherent ramblings are both ammusing and blissfully free of logic.

Here's the point. The paradigm has shifted, the model changed. If you understood the rudimentary basics of 'supply and demand' and the economics of 'volume' you will see that the Carmax, 'no-haggle' model is indeed the future.

Cars are essentially large and expensive appliances. We are not dealing here with diamonds or some other precious commodity that requires a specific expertise to determine price and quality.

Carmax treats cars the way Best Buy treats TV's. Because of volume sales, we the consumer get an immediate bottom line with all the same warranties, options, etc, as the dealers would like to offer.

"or they will have rediculous prices and make is so hard for customers to buy cars at reasonable prices that customer will buy mostly used cars."

This will never happen. Again, were dealing with volume. The trend will be to eliminate your job. In addition, the internet has given us complete transparency to your once "secret knowledge" and now anyone with a computer can find out the true costs and 'hidden' incentives of the product.

Although I can appreciate a good "negotiation", most people really don't have time in their day to argue with some sweaty, half-wit a**hole, who generally knows alot less about the car then they do. I have found this to be a most common experience.

So in the end I suppose we are not being "man" enough in your eyes by not wanting to face the 'big, bad car dealer.' In truth, its far less dramatic. We all have better things to do rather then subjugate oursleves to some antiquated form of bartering for an expensive appliance when we can skip all that headache and infact almost always get a better price by not coming in at all and doing all the 'negotiating' right here, on the computer.

Eventually, there will be no need for the 'car salesman' and we can just deal directly with the manufacturer via an automated, internet-based system and have the car delivered, to spec, right to our front door.
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:33 PM   #78 (permalink)
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GT-R Man: No one will ever accuse you of putting forth an intelligent counter-arguement, lol. However, your incoherent ramblings are both ammusing and blissfully free of logic.

Here's the point. The paradigm has shifted, the model changed. If you understood the rudimentary basics of 'supply and demand' and the economics of 'volume' you will see that the Carmax, 'no-haggle' model is indeed the future.

Cars are essentially large and expensive appliances. We are not dealing here with diamonds or some other precious commodity that requires a specific expertise to determine price and quality.

Carmax treats cars the way Best Buy treats TV's. Because of volume sales, we the consumer get an immediate bottom line with all the same warranties, options, etc, as the dealers would like to offer.

"or they will have rediculous prices and make is so hard for customers to buy cars at reasonable prices that customer will buy mostly used cars."

This will never happen. Again, were dealing with volume. The trend will be to eliminate your job. In addition, the internet has given us complete transparency to your once "secret knowledge" and now anyone with a computer can find out the true costs and 'hidden' incentives of the product.

Although I can appreciate a good "negotiation", most people really don't have time in their day to argue with some sweaty, half-wit a**hole, who generally knows alot less about the car then they do. I have found this to be a most common experience.

So in the end I suppose we are not being "man" enough in your eyes by not wanting to face the 'big, bad car dealer.' In truth, its far less dramatic. We all have better things to do rather then subjugate oursleves to some antiquated form of bartering for an expensive appliance when we can skip all that headache and infact almost always get a better price by not coming in at all and doing all the 'negotiating' right here, on the computer.

Eventually, there will be no need for the 'car salesman' and we can just deal directly with the manufacturer via an automated, internet-based system and have the car delivered, to spec, right to our front door.


Very well put
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Old 03-12-2009, 02:50 PM   #79 (permalink)
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Subterfuge - the only way you could have closed out your post better is by saying, "Bickety bam, beotch"
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Old 03-12-2009, 04:12 PM   #80 (permalink)
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Subterfuge - the only way you could have closed out your post better is by saying, "Bickety bam, beotch"
LOL . . . Indeed. Thanks guys, just trying to keep it interesting.
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Old 03-12-2009, 04:36 PM   #81 (permalink)
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out of curiosity where do you guys think dealers make money? Like seriously if you guys can make any sense in what you say I will delete my account from this forum...
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Old 03-12-2009, 04:59 PM   #82 (permalink)
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out of curiosity where do you guys think dealers make money? Like seriously if you guys can make any sense in what you say I will delete my account from this forum...
Kickbacks, rebates, financing, "undercar protection", extended warranties....shall I go on?
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:15 PM   #83 (permalink)
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servicing. dont forget servicing. 90+ dollar oil changes and inspections can add up nicely.
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:43 PM   #84 (permalink)
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Kickbacks, rebates, financing, "undercar protection", extended warranties....shall I go on?
Might as well go on because you dont know the least about car dealers mr know it all... how can you say that dealers make money from kick backs which by the way are called hold back... which is money that a dealer does not see for another 3 months after you purchase, which is there to reward dealers for volume sales and its not much mayb 1-2% the value of the car which most cases they give that money away to make a lot of deals... rebates are you kiding me thats a joke... dealers making money on rebates haha.... in case you havent read anything anywhere, that money goes strickly to customers.... undercar protection? another funny one.. for someone that shops as hard as you do you buying under car protection is lame and hypocritical... If everyone would to read all of this posts on this forums and base this info for buying cars dealers would simply say no and good luck to all...

What kind of profit do you think dealers make when you buy a car??

$200-500
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:46 PM   #85 (permalink)
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what kind of profit do you think dealers make when you buy a car??

$200-500
hahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:49 PM   #86 (permalink)
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servicing. dont forget servicing. 90+ dollar oil changes and inspections can add up nicely.
90+ oil change and inspection what is your dealer using space shuttle fluids and refueling?

$29.99 oil and filter change with with 40point inspection+ free nitrogen refill if you are a previous customer....
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:50 PM   #87 (permalink)
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I am serious if some one can tell me what they really believe in is correct i will delete my account

PS forum admins do not count
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Old 03-12-2009, 06:07 PM   #88 (permalink)
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What kind of profit do you think dealers make when you buy a car??

$200-500
You asked a question, and I gave you an answer. How does that make me a know-it-all? Did I claim to know all the ins-and-outs of being a car salesman? NO

You say $2-500 on a sale? You may be right about a single sale in a week's time....I'm in the wholesale business, and I know how that shi* works. One customer beats us down so much, that we barely make a profit on a sale. Another 2 walk in, and they have a higher price point. They pay and move on. We get volume and profit sales, and they both add up to make us a multi-billion dollar business.

On top of selling cars, you guys sell all the little things, as well as service (mentioned above). Do you get customers that haggle you down, or come in demanding the bottom dollar? Sure, but you also get people that either don't care, or are too stupid to read between the lines....THAT'S how you make money. Now is that better, or do you have some kind of snappy comeback for that too?
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Old 03-12-2009, 06:12 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by GT-R man View Post
Might as well go on because you dont know the least about car dealers mr know it all... how can you say that dealers make money from kick backs which by the way are called hold back... which is money that a dealer does not see for another 3 months after you purchase, which is there to reward dealers for volume sales and its not much mayb 1-2% the value of the car which most cases they give that money away to make a lot of deals... rebates are you kiding me thats a joke... dealers making money on rebates haha.... in case you havent read anything anywhere, that money goes strickly to customers.... undercar protection? another funny one.. for someone that shops as hard as you do you buying under car protection is lame and hypocritical... If everyone would to read all of this posts on this forums and base this info for buying cars dealers would simply say no and good luck to all...

What kind of profit do you think dealers make when you buy a car??

$200-500

It sounds like you hate your job and should seriously consider a career change. You wouldn't be this angry for no apparent reason, and going back to your first post, it all makes ZERO sense. Trying to put a dollar value on AK's downtime as if he'd be working is completely insane, not to mention guesstimating what he earns in the first place. He obviously has a passion for this car, look at all the time he puts in on this website -- how can you criticize him for taking a tiny percentage of that time to make sure he's being smart with his money? Seriously, change careers, cus this is obviously the wrong one for you.

*picks the perfect time to make first post*
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Old 03-12-2009, 08:00 PM   #90 (permalink)
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out of curiosity where do you guys think dealers make money? Like seriously if you guys can make any sense in what you say I will delete my account from this forum...
I will answer your question seriously:
~Service department
~Extended warranties
~Rebates (Manufacturer give rebates, but dealership does not always have to extend to customer)
~Financing

Dealers usually get the car for about 3-4% below invoice, more with rebates from manufacturer, but of course this is on the average car which is currently about 23-25,000USD. Not really sure on premium cars (40+) or super cheap (<15), but dealerships will on average make more than 200USD on a car, probably 650 or more.

Then again, with the market in its decline and everyone looking to cut corners, we could see some prices slashed in hopes to bring in buyers. Which would cut "profit" for the dealership greatly as they just try to move inventory.
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