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First Problem With my 370Z

Originally Posted by Sh0velMan Yeah, if it's cementite formation, it actually alters the metal of the rotor... simply turning them down a few thousandths to re-surface them won't really suffice.

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Old 04-03-2013, 07:52 AM   #46 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sh0velMan View Post
Yeah, if it's cementite formation, it actually alters the metal of the rotor... simply turning them down a few thousandths to re-surface them won't really suffice. You have to take off a LOT of material to get rid of it, usually resulting in the rotor being out of spec.

I would just get the cheapest rotors you can find and pair them with the most aggressive Carbotech or CL pad you can stomach and call it a day.
Why do you choose these pads over others? I'm asking because it seems there was some testing here on your part...which is worth a lot of time and $.
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Old 04-03-2013, 08:01 AM   #47 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Coon-azz View Post
Why do you choose these pads over others? I'm asking because it seems there was some testing here on your part...which is worth a lot of time and $.
They are non-transfer pads. Not possible to create cementite with a non transfer pad.

You can still WARP them, but it's a helluva lot harder to WARP a rotor than most people think. Almost always involves heavy braking a followed by a temperature shock, like racing to the car wash and immediately dousing the entire rotor in water. lol (Rainwater won't do this, as it'll be constantly sprayed, not nearly-submerged instantly like in a car wash scenario)
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Old 04-03-2013, 08:33 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sh0velMan View Post
They are non-transfer pads. Not possible to create cementite with a non transfer pad.
Carbotech pads do require bedding/create a transfer layer!
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Old 04-03-2013, 09:03 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Carbotech pads do require bedding/create a transfer layer!
o rly.

Well then scratch that.

RC5+ or RC6 from CL then.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:17 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Sh0velMan View Post
o rly.

Well then scratch that.

RC5+ or RC6 from CL then.
ok...researching...thanks
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:56 PM   #51 (permalink)
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For all you "Warped rotors" guys:

-Warped- Brake Disc and Other Myths
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Old 04-05-2013, 09:19 AM   #52 (permalink)
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I'm kind of on the fence about warp, I just know that in the old days, when all the auto parts houses would turn the rotor, when we clamped the rotor to the lathe and just rotated the rotor against the lathe bit there would indeed be an uneven surface. Thinking back none of us questioned the "trueness" of the lathe, the trueness of the rotor mounting face, we just turned the rotor until the high spots were gone and put it back on the car and the problem was solved. Usually we saw rotors that were ran several years on the metal face of the worn out pad by drivers that had no idea what the noise was but they KNEW it would cost them money so they just kept on going, haha.
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Old 04-05-2013, 09:28 AM   #53 (permalink)
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I'm kind of on the fence about warp, I just know that in the old days, when all the auto parts houses would turn the rotor, when we clamped the rotor to the lathe and just rotated the rotor against the lathe bit there would indeed be an uneven surface. Thinking back none of us questioned the "trueness" of the lathe, the trueness of the rotor mounting face, we just turned the rotor until the high spots were gone and put it back on the car and the problem was solved. Usually we saw rotors that were ran several years on the metal face of the worn out pad by drivers that had no idea what the noise was but they KNEW it would cost them money so they just kept on going, haha.

The pulsation and loss of braking power is definitely caused by high spots on the friction surface, but that's not necessarily caused by warpage.

You would have to measure both sides of the rotor's change in position relative to the mounting hub in real time. If one side sticks out 2mm and the other is recessed 2mm at the same spot, then chances are the rotor is warped. If both sides stick out, or only one side sticks out, chances are it's cementite formation causing the hardness of the rotor material to increase so that it wears at a different rate than the surrounding metal. This causes the condition to gradually worsen over a period of time, making it "sneak up" on the driver in most cases.

Truly warped rotors are usually obvious almost immediately and don't "sneak up" on the driver. One minute they're fine, the next minute there's a pronounced pulsation in the pedal.
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Old 04-05-2013, 09:29 AM   #54 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Fishey View Post

http://www.bonedaddy.net/Fishey/IMG_0027%20(Medium).JPG

Warped Rotor.. I have seen it many times.

Sometimes its pad transfer sometimes it is not. Usually if the rotor looks "blue" its pad transfer. If the rotor looks normal silver usually a physically warped rotor. It is extremely extremely rare that a warped rotor would happen on a car that didn't have a caliper issue. I would say 99% of real warped rotors there is a problem in the caliper or brake system that causes the condition. Hope that helps.

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Old 04-05-2013, 09:32 AM   #55 (permalink)
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Right, we weren't into Analysis in those days, we were just trying to get rid of the symptom, get the pulsing, juddering to stop, and get the car safe again for "Mom, or Grandma" and move on to the next customer.
In hindsight it probably was Cementite but no one knew anything about that in my circle of friends, we either replaced the rotor if too thin, or we turned it, and if the pads were over 1/2 gone, we changed them too, and 99% of the time we never heard from that person again.
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Old 05-09-2013, 09:25 AM   #56 (permalink)
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Update:

-Shaking again at 17,000 miles. Rotors turned. Shake gone. Original Potenza's also replaced at this time with Michelin PSS.
-Shaking again at 20,XXX miles. Replaced front rotors with Z1 motorsports slotted rotors. Still shaking, but better. Brake-pads shaved, shake gone.
-Shaking again, ever so slightly, 300 miles later. Ordered StopTech Street Performance pads.

"Sport Brakes".Shittiest factory brake upgrade. Ever. In the history of shitty wannabe OEM performance part options.

Number of Nissans I will own once I trade this vehicle in, whenever that may be?

ZERO. NONE. Nice interior, great lines, but that's where the product ceases to deliver.

I really hope this solves the issue.

FYI, before they shaved the pads (20,XXX miles) , they had 8mm remaining per vehicle inspection (both front and rear, all 4 pads, listed at 8mm). Dunno what they come with from the factory.

Next move:

Drive the car until trade-in breaks even and get back into a real sports car, or a Cherokee SRT, as I am going to need some ground clearance and AWD would really be nice, where I'm moving.

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Old 05-09-2013, 09:59 AM   #57 (permalink)
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You don't think driving style plays into this? The only time I've had a problem with the wheel shaking under braking in ~47,000 miles was when my rotors were cracked or I got off the track hot and parked too soon.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:11 AM   #58 (permalink)
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Judging from the lack of posts from other people about this, it is either driving style, a one-off problem with the car, or (my guess) the dealer doing the repairs is somehow screwing up the job. OP, have you tried another dealer?
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:12 AM   #59 (permalink)
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You don't think driving style plays into this? The only time I've had a problem with the wheel shaking under braking in ~47,000 miles was when my rotors were cracked or I got off the track hot and parked too soon.
If it does, then my Mustang 5.0 (yeah, the 80's 5.0...), WS.6, Z06, and the rental Kia I had for a month (while my 370Z was repaired from an accident when another driver lost control of their SUV) are all a lot better able to handle my daily driving than a 370Z/Sport is.

If my driving style is causing this issue, I'll just get into a real car and be done with it, because if I can get 17,000 miles out of 140 treadwear tires on the street and fry the brakes mutiple times and "it's user related", well, the brakes are ****. Simple as that.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:13 AM   #60 (permalink)
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Judging from the lack of posts from other people about this, it is either driving style, a one-off problem with the car, or (my guess) the dealer doing the repairs is somehow screwing up the job. OP, have you tried another dealer?
What is there to screw up? The problem was solved for 7,000 miles the first time, 3,000 miles the second, and I can feel it starting to come back after a few hundred, now. Slotted rotors heat brake pads up faster than normal blanks. I think the SPORT pads from Nissan may just be total junk, or I got a bad set, or something.
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