How to completely disable the VDC

Felix 808 · 01-16-2014, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

I am positive that a momentary power interupt in the yaw sensors line is all that is required. for those with a switch try it out start the car, flip your yaw switch till the lights go out, then flip it back on your tcs will still be dead.

Hmm, that would seems about right when looking at it in a safety aspect. If the sensor was able to go in & out (it it became flakey) it could create unpridictable & unpleasent handling situations. I have not wired mine up, but I think you have it right in this thinking

Mitco39 · 01-16-2014, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z&I

Great Feedbacks and Inputs !

Wasn't able to do the burn out tho because of the ABLS -therefore it didn't improve my 60' time at all...
The available traction just wasn't there and when the Race Logic kicked in just off the line the car bogged and lost momentum.
My overall ET would have even better with a quicker 60'

If you can find a work around for the Brake Lights that would be the PERFECT solution!

Bob

Bob, I know what you mean about the RL falling on its face, there is a very fine line between the perfect amount of slip and not enough causing the car to fall on itself and kill your 60'.

Also I did some digging through the FSM for you and found out (in theory) how to bypass the brake switch while still keeping your lights.

Its a bit hard to see but you essentially want to cut the wire going from your fuse block to your ABS controller. This will kill and brake signal going to your CanBus but yet still let your brake lights function as they should.

Again hard to see but the ABS connector is E41 and its pin 30 with a SB color of wire. Knowing first hand how hard it is to get to the abs connector I would probably look at the fuse block end of things (pin 1F of E103).

Hope this helps! I might do the same thing come summer.

Mitch

wstar · 01-16-2014, 12:24 PM

Yeah not to mention pretty much every failure mode on this car that's documented requires a restart (shut off car and turn ignition back on) to clear it, so it would make sense that the yaw fault does too.

I do wish there was a way to get rid of the brake/throttle interlock without losing ABS entirely.

Mitco39 · 01-16-2014, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Yeah not to mention pretty much every failure mode on this car that's documented requires a restart (shut off car and turn ignition back on) to clear it, so it would make sense that the yaw fault does too.

I do wish there was a way to get rid of the brake/throttle interlock without losing ABS entirely.

Maybe ECUTEK will have this feature? I would imagine its just a simple programming change.

wstar · 01-16-2014, 12:25 PM

BTW, "SB" is Sky Blue (weird naming).

wstar · 01-16-2014, 12:40 PM

That pin 1F looks easy to find on the fuse block. I think this weekend I might cut that and run it to a dash panel switch for ABS ON/OFF, then I can experiment with the difference switching it on for some sessions and off for others. I don't drag race, but I am trying to learn to left-foot-brake to ease my brake/throttle transitions. The downside is no ABS to protect me from flat-spotting tires, but the upside would be not having the throttle limiter interfering just because I still have some light left-foot pressure on the brake pedal.

Z&I · 01-16-2014, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Yeah not to mention pretty much every failure mode on this car that's documented requires a restart (shut off car and turn ignition back on) to clear it, so it would make sense that the yaw fault does too.

I do wish there was a way to get rid of the brake/throttle interlock without losing ABS entirely.

I do believe that the UpRev tune (which I have) has a toggle in their software to disable the brake/throttle interlock ...
Contacted them directly and they said that toggling off this interlock will cause the car to respond 'almost' like pulling the fuse, but weren't any more specific than that.

I was led to believe that the ABS is independant of the ABLS and is never turned off.

Anybody know for sure ???

Yet another possibility emerges !!!

We Will get to the bottom of this ...

Bob

Z&I · 01-16-2014, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39

Bob, I know what you mean about the RL falling on its face, there is a very fine line between the perfect amount of slip and not enough causing the car to fall on itself and kill your 60'.

Also I did some digging through the FSM for you and found out (in theory) how to bypass the brake switch while still keeping your lights.

Its a bit hard to see but you essentially want to cut the wire going from your fuse block to your ABS controller. This will kill and brake signal going to your CanBus but yet still let your brake lights function as they should.

Again hard to see but the ABS connector is E41 and its pin 30 with a SB color of wire. Knowing first hand how hard it is to get to the abs connector I would probably look at the fuse block end of things (pin 1F of E103).

Hope this helps! I might do the same thing come summer.

Mitch

Thanks Much Mitch ...
Will download the pictures and bring up the contrast and resolution in PhotoShop.

Ideally I would want to keep the ABS and Brake Lights but lose the ABLS and VDC.

Hard to tell or predict without actually doing it - but do you foresee this happening ?

I'm looking in to the suspension/weight transfer, camber/alignment and tire pressure to get it to hook up better.

Great job on the research you did ... The shop is either going to love me or hate me when this is all figured out !!!

Bob

Z&I · 01-16-2014, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

its not the abls that wont let you do a burnout thats the ecu, if it recieves a brake and gas input at the same time it limits throttle to 10%. It's also known as anti runaway toyota mode. pulling the brake fuse completely kills abs you will have no antilock function, the brake light wire is what tells the ecu when you hit the brakes, so if you pull the fuse it has no way of knowing you are depressing the brakes so the entire abs system is down. Also I am positive that a momentary power interupt in the yaw sensors line is all that is required. for those with a switch try it out start the car, flip your yaw switch till the lights go out, then flip it back on your tcs will still be dead.

Thanks ... I wasn't aware that pulling the fuse (or intercepting it) would kill the ABS ...

I was led to believe that the ABS was an independent function seperate from the ABLS and VDC.

If it isn't : then I need to rethink how to reconfigure my car.

I'm not doing a Brake and Gas burnout ... I'm using a Line Lock controlled by a momentary switch/relay to engage only the front brakes for the burnout.

Tried to do the Brake/Gas burnout - the throttle did get real weak and the rear brakes pulsed repeatedly.

Ideally I would like to be able to disable the VDC and ABLS and let the Race Logic alone control the traction for normal driving...still retaining the ABS and Brake Lights.

Is this configuration even possible with the 370?
It would be GREAT if it was...

In the early days it would be a simple wiring solution ... but with todays cars and computers ... eh ???? who knows what to expect !!!

Bob

Mitco39 · 01-16-2014, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z&I

Thanks Much Mitch ...
Will download the pictures and bring up the contrast and resolution in PhotoShop.

Ideally I would want to keep the ABS and Brake Lights but lose the ABLS and VDC.

Hard to tell or predict without actually doing it - but do you foresee this happening ?

I'm looking in to the suspension/weight transfer, camber/alignment and tire pressure to get it to hook up better.

Great job on the research you did ... The shop is either going to love me or hate me when this is all figured out !!!

Bob

Bob,

The exact pages in the FSM is EXL-91, BRC-76, BRC-77.

I would bet that the ABS would be disabled as this is what occurs when pulling the fuse for the whole circuit.

wstar · 01-16-2014, 02:18 PM

To clear up some confusion in the past two posts:

VDC and ABLS are sub-functions of the ABS controller. Disconnecting the Yaw sensor kills VDC and ABLS, but not ABS. Pulling the brake light fuse kills the brake lights and also kills power to the whole ABS controller, killing VDC, ABLS, and ABS. Cutting the Sky Blue wire to pin 1F on the fuse box would also kill the ABS controller (dead ABS, ABLS, VDC), but not the brake lights.

Z&I · 01-16-2014, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

To clear up some confusion in the past two posts:

VDC and ABLS are sub-functions of the ABS controller. Disconnecting the Yaw sensor kills VDC and ABLS, but not ABS. Pulling the brake light fuse kills the brake lights and also kills power to the whole ABS controller, killing VDC, ABLS, and ABS. Cutting the Sky Blue wire to pin 1F on the fuse box would also kill the ABS controller (dead ABS, ABLS, VDC), but not the brake lights.

So it sounds like all I need to do is intercept the Yaw Sensor only...

Definitely kills the VDC and ABLS but not the ABS ? ... both warning lights are then illuminated to confirm ?
Which wire would you recommend for the proposed surgery ?

OR ... Intercept the Sky Bue wire to pin 1F at the Fuse Box on drivers side kickplate?

Decisions Decisions - I think you just may have hit on the solution for me

Need to check back with the shop to find out how the Race Logic fits in to the equation.
Still need that to work ...

Thanks !
Bob

BGTV8 · 01-16-2014, 02:56 PM

Hmmm .....

Richard Bendell at Motec Research in Melbourne tells me that they will have a 370Z in the lab in Feb with the objective of engineering the new Motec century-series ECU as a plug replacement for the 370Z (same as they recently completed for the R35 GTR).

He tells me that this opens all options for control of the chassis and engine ... so I will be watching the development closely.

There are 100-series ECU's for the R35 and the FR/BRZ twins and I hope, soon, the Z34

The MoTeC website says ......

No rewiring is necessary with the optional loom, which plugs into the stock wiring harness using the original sensors and fuel system. All original functions are maintained, with the exception of Cruise Control.

Works with all of the stock component, including:

Power steering
ABS
Stability control
Air conditioner
Dashboard

Adds powerful extra capabilities, including:

Turbo or supercharger control
Launch control
Traction control
Gear Shift ignition cutting

This should all be for not much more than the cost of the Race Logic box.

Alstann · 01-16-2014, 03:14 PM

Mmmmmm...Motec.

I'd sell my left and half of my right testes to have Motec in my car. It's some serious race stuff, bar none.

1slow370 · 01-16-2014, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alstann

Mmmmmm...Motec.

I'd sell my left and half of my right testes to have Motec in my car. It's some serious race stuff, bar none.

gonna cost more than that throw in a kidney and half your liver and it might happen

01-16-2014, 12:24 PM	#48 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	Yeah not to mention pretty much every failure mode on this car that's documented requires a restart (shut off car and turn ignition back on) to clear it, so it would make sense that the yaw fault does too. I do wish there was a way to get rid of the brake/throttle interlock without losing ABS entirely. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

01-16-2014, 12:25 PM	#50 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	BTW, "SB" is Sky Blue (weird naming). Mitco39 likes this. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

01-16-2014, 12:40 PM	#51 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	That pin 1F looks easy to find on the fuse block. I think this weekend I might cut that and run it to a dash panel switch for ABS ON/OFF, then I can experiment with the difference switching it on for some sessions and off for others. I don't drag race, but I am trying to learn to left-foot-brake to ease my brake/throttle transitions. The downside is no ABS to protect me from flat-spotting tires, but the upside would be not having the throttle limiter interfering just because I still have some light left-foot pressure on the brake pedal. dimitarm likes this. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

01-16-2014, 02:18 PM	#56 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	To clear up some confusion in the past two posts: VDC and ABLS are sub-functions of the ABS controller. Disconnecting the Yaw sensor kills VDC and ABLS, but not ABS. Pulling the brake light fuse kills the brake lights and also kills power to the whole ABS controller, killing VDC, ABLS, and ABS. Cutting the Sky Blue wire to pin 1F on the fuse box would also kill the ABS controller (dead ABS, ABLS, VDC), but not the brake lights. Z&I likes this. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

01-16-2014, 02:56 PM	#58 (permalink)
BGTV8 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: 03350 Australia Posts: 1,503 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 29907	Hmmm ..... Richard Bendell at Motec Research in Melbourne tells me that they will have a 370Z in the lab in Feb with the objective of engineering the new Motec century-series ECU as a plug replacement for the 370Z (same as they recently completed for the R35 GTR). He tells me that this opens all options for control of the chassis and engine ... so I will be watching the development closely. There are 100-series ECU's for the R35 and the FR/BRZ twins and I hope, soon, the Z34 The MoTeC website says ...... No rewiring is necessary with the optional loom, which plugs into the stock wiring harness using the original sensors and fuel system. All original functions are maintained, with the exception of Cruise Control. Works with all of the stock component, including: Power steering ABS Stability control Air conditioner Dashboard Adds powerful extra capabilities, including: Turbo or supercharger control Launch control Traction control Gear Shift ignition cutting This should all be for not much more than the cost of the Race Logic box. GaleForce and Rusty like this.

01-16-2014, 03:14 PM	#59 (permalink)
Alstann Track Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: South Florida Posts: 882 Drives: 12 PW 370z 6MT Sport Rep Power: 14	Mmmmmm...Motec. I'd sell my left and half of my right testes to have Motec in my car. It's some serious race stuff, bar none. Z&I likes this. __________________ 2012 Pearl White 370Z GReddy Twin Turbo

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