The car most enthusiasts still sleep on

UNKNOWN_370

I'll admit that too many forum threads go overboard with "On paper" stats as a measurement of a sports car being good. Really, on paper stats don't prove much in that area.

But when it comes to car companies meeting a performance goal. Those on paper stats mean a lot before you purchase. To me, the on paper stats help me determine if the car is worth spending the money.

I'm pretty sure the on paper stats of a stock mustang 5.0 having the capability of pulling a 12.6 second quarter mile with a foot of roll out sold a crap load of them. Yet on drag tracks, most STOCK 5.0's I've seen get 12.9/13.2 range.

On paper stats sell cars.

shadoquad

Paper stats are pretty much worthless numbers to satisfy some preconception on the part of a buyer. Some people need hp, some need light weight, others need skidpad, 0-60, mpg, etc...

Even speed is overrated if you're not enjoying yourself. Fastest does not always mean funnest, and most owners of performance cars won't track their cars, let alone push those limits on public streets (which is not where they should be tested anyway).

UNKNOWN_370

You're kinda rehashing what im saying but putting more value on another part of what I'm saying than the other. Then devaluing on paper stats. I guarantee you, if the Z was a fun azz car that the top speed was 110mph and the quarter mile was achieved in 15.4 seconds? Would you have paid $40k for your Z in 2009/10??? lol YES or NO????

Most don't think a LOADED BRZ is worth $30k. But @ 25k it would be better priced. Do you think its because its on paper stats don't add up to other $30k cars or... Because it's not fun enough to drive @ the 30k price point. Reviewers say its the most fun car since the porsche 911.

I think most don't like the $30k price based on comparable cars in the price range. Those comparos come from on paper stats... Sorry but its true.

shadoquad

I paid 30k for my z in 2010 and don't regret it for a second. The BRZ, Miata, and Exige are all cars that can deliver lightweight thrills with little power. I respect them all.

If all you care about is stats, you're limiting yourself.

UNKNOWN_370

Ok you bought a base Z in 09. Great. Would you pay corvette prices for a car like the BRZ. If not? Why?

You will avoid answering that question because it negates your futile argument. It would be unrealistic to buy a BRZ when theres a corvette that may not hailed as being as fun as a BRZ... BUT WE KNOW, from what we read. We would find the corvette waaaaay more fun. and stats play a role... I wouldn't pay $60k for the hype of BRZ fun based on the cars inability to perform on paper and against anything in the $60k range
stats not all i care about.........But you're missing the point of the importance of stats....................... The point is, stats will determine what you are willing to shell out for a sports car. If stats were everything? I'd be in a mustang GT or 302 BOSS... Don't you think?
Dollar for dollar the mustang offers more, but i prefer the Z in terms of fun. But the Z is much more engineered than a mustang. So I see why the inferior performing Z can be worth the same as a more powerful mustang.
Would you pay $43k for a miata? Miatas are fun.

Back on topic now....

shadoquad

I'd buy a Lotus Elise, and they're Vette money for half the stats.

And BRZ/FRS are selling quite well in spite of your argument.

I didn't avoid your question. A 43,000 dollar Miata doesn't exist, but performance alone isn't the reason. The car isn't worth that much. It's not all paper stats. It's also plastic materials, versatility, lack of gadgetry.

You're terrible to argue with, because you can never cede a single point. Do people pay vette money for Z's? Ask anyone with a fully loaded roadster or Nismo, I guess. With incentives, they could have afforded a base vette, if it was all about stats. And you bring up the boss mustang, which supports my argument. That car is much faster than a Nismo Z on paper and costs the same.

If the BRZ was nice enough, people would pay 60. But it's not. It's a Subaru with a plastic interior.

But yes, let's get back to the topic of the Hyundai, which has nice paper stats, although I'd still want an Infiniti G37s.

b1adesofcha0s

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UNKNOWN_370

With the miata not existing. Isnt my point. The point is a miata isnt 43k for a reason. it wouldnt maatch up against sports cars in that area. Its stats wont allow it. The lotus may be very different from a vette, but has a performance set unique to its price range and still has performance stats in the range of a cayman. so it makes sense for a lotus to be in that price range with a vette. Lotus's are extremely lightweight and have no weight competitor in the price range.

Coming from a G37s, id rather have one too. But it doesnt mean the hyundai doesn't meet what i condier a competitive criteria for its price range. considering a Rspec 3.8 is 29k and a G37s is $47k you are paying greatly for your preferences. that being said, theres not much more performance for an 18k deficit in a G. At least not $18k worth

daisuke149

Not sure if the Z is over engineered compared to the stang. go drive them both and you'll see.

And your arguement is invalid. Fun doesnt = price. My versa is hella fun. but i wouldnt have paid more than 15k for it new. Which is why despite the fun the BRZ is still over priced at 25k. And its not because of stats on paper, its because of how it feels when i have to drive it everyday.

The reviewers etc who love that car all do so because they have open roads and tracks.. tell someone in a city to review it and see the difference. And yes that matters because despite what we all like to believe, we dont live on race tracks.

FairladyZ

thats why the brz does so well