[OFFICIAL] Discussion for the next new Nissan 400Z Z35?

TKP-Zeto · 02-05-2017, 06:23 AM

The guys at stillen have been messing around with the new engine in the Q60 red sport... claim that is actually UNDER-rated.

If that's the case, if it gets transplanted to the next Z35 it sounds promising.

I was afraid a smaller block with the twin scrolls between the V's and the integrated water to air intercooler might be more expensive to upgrade or have a lower max potential than getting a current 3.7L and just tossing on bolt-ons and a tune.

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-05-2017, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaeMaestro

See, now your seeing the truths me not dreaming of the concepts. You let yourself down a little there!

Well anyways my prediction is the base z will weigh 3,2xx so they can say it's lighter an have nice looking stats.

If Nissan is looking to use the Q60 platform? And the literally make it with that garbage azz New World Order Steering System. Don't expect a lighter car. That would mean more gratuitous use of carbon fiber. If that happens? It'll only happen in a Nismo. N it'll still weigh more because Nissan's Nismo body bracing weighs 88 lbs. So you gain and lose keeping the Z heavy.

That NWO PS4 steering has a heavy azz manual override steering column interlock further adding weight. Then factor in the numb steering, electronic handbrake, and other stupidities like hybrid batteries on certain models. The Z will probably be between 3,400lbs and 3,600lbs.

They'll say our base model is 53lbs lighter than our outgoing Nismo model yet out powers and out handles it on paper. It will just be a numb feeling appliance where excitement will be on the seat of the pants verses the visceral nature of the current Z. People will talk about how THE Z34 & 135 & EVO X were the last of the visceral analog cars and how the digital world has dulled cars.

But then you'll have your mainstream CORPORATE media mags telling you it feels great, just go with it. Our government needs all that tracking information in your cars that dull the feel of driving. So they can keep record of where you're going, how fast you get there, how many g's you take a turn, whose house u park in front of.. what stores you park in front of and all those useless info-tracking that means nothing. Cars are getting soulless as we get closer to living the movie Equilibrium.

If I'm a buy an electronic car? I'm gonna get the best out there.... Porsche, Alfa Romeo, Mercedes. I'm not buying a PS4 on wheels from a company that couldn't even address a CSC failure properly.

Stick to being as close to analog as possible Nissan or it's goodbye from me. I rather spend double.

This company gets more disappointing by the day. EV this.... electronic that. Visceral is being written out if the dictionary. Fvckin NWO is killing the auto industry. Nothing is sacred anymore.

Rant Over.

ThaeMaestro · 02-05-2017, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

If Nissan is looking to use the Q60 platform? And the literally make it with that garbage azz New World Order Steering System. Don't expect a lighter car. That would mean more gratuitous use of carbon fiber. If that happens? It'll only happen in a Nismo. N it'll still weigh more because Nissan's Nismo body bracing weighs 88 lbs. So you gain and lose keeping the Z heavy.

That NWO PS4 steering has a heavy azz manual override steering column interlock further adding weight. Then factor in the numb steering, electronic handbrake, and other stupidities like hybrid batteries on certain models. The Z will probably be between 3,400lbs and 3,600lbs.

They'll say our base model is 53lbs lighter than our outgoing Nismo model yet out powers and out handles it on paper. It will just be a numb feeling appliance where excitement will be on the seat of the pants verses the visceral nature of the current Z. People will talk about how THE Z34 & 135 & EVO X were the last of the visceral analog cars and how the digital world has dulled cars.

But then you'll have your mainstream CORPORATE media mags telling you it feels great, just go with it. Our government needs all that tracking information in your cars that dull the feel of driving. So they can keep record of where you're going, how fast you get there, how many g's you take a turn, whose house u park in front of.. what stores you park in front of and all those useless info-tracking that means nothing. Cars are getting soulless as we get closer to living the movie Equilibrium.

If I'm a buy an electronic car? I'm gonna get the best out there.... Porsche, Alfa Romeo, Mercedes. I'm not buying a PS4 on wheels from a company that couldn't even address a CSC failure properly.

Stick to being as close to analog as possible Nissan or it's goodbye from me. I rather spend double.

This company gets more disappointing by the day. EV this.... electronic that. Visceral is being written out if the dictionary. Fvckin NWO is killing the auto industry. Nothing is sacred anymore.

Rant Over.

Damn, "zero to a hundred ***** real quick".

Aluminum is the current light weight material they will use. Carbon is still to expensive. We don't know till we see it. But yes I do agree that we have lost an age of analog cars. But I see that as a good thing. Instead of looking forward, I'll keep looking back. There are plenty of cars that just keep getting cheaper that I have wanted over the years!

"That's all I have to say about that" -forest gump-

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-05-2017, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaeMaestro

Damn, "zero to a hundred ***** real quick".

Aluminum is the current light weight material they will use. Carbon is still to expensive. We don't know till we see it. But yes I do agree that we have lost an age of analog cars. But I see that as a good thing. Instead of looking forward, I'll keep looking back. There are plenty of cars that just keep getting cheaper that I have wanted over the years!

"That's all I have to say about that" -forest gump-

Since you like looking back.... here.

The 1999 Nissan Z Concept Was A*Fascinating First Draft*

We already have a carbon fiber drive shaft and radiator housing. It's not unfathomable that Nissan does some in-house carbon fiber to double up or triple the amount in the next gen. Nissan didn't use more aluminium in the Q60. They used more high tensile steel to reduce weight. They still failed at reducing weight. A good portion of the Z and Q are made of aluminum. We all know this....

My point still stands.... by evading all their original hype. A lighter Z will be a challenge unless they compare the upcoming z base to the new Nismo model. The current Q is over 800lbs. There's no way to get more than 400lbs weight reduction without doing radical **** on the Chassis. That's all I'm saying. That's why I was hoping on the modular chassis.

Xhilr8n! · 02-05-2017, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

If Nissan is looking to use the Q60 platform? And the literally make it with that garbage azz New World Order Steering System. Don't expect a lighter car. That would mean more gratuitous use of carbon fiber. If that happens? It'll only happen in a Nismo. N it'll still weigh more because Nissan's Nismo body bracing weighs 88 lbs. So you gain and lose keeping the Z heavy.

That NWO PS4 steering has a heavy azz manual override steering column interlock further adding weight. Then factor in the numb steering, electronic handbrake, and other stupidities like hybrid batteries on certain models. The Z will probably be between 3,400lbs and 3,600lbs.

They'll say our base model is 53lbs lighter than our outgoing Nismo model yet out powers and out handles it on paper. It will just be a numb feeling appliance where excitement will be on the seat of the pants verses the visceral nature of the current Z. People will talk about how THE Z34 & 135 & EVO X were the last of the visceral analog cars and how the digital world has dulled cars.

But then you'll have your mainstream CORPORATE media mags telling you it feels great, just go with it. Our government needs all that tracking information in your cars that dull the feel of driving. So they can keep record of where you're going, how fast you get there, how many g's you take a turn, whose house u park in front of.. what stores you park in front of and all those useless info-tracking that means nothing. Cars are getting soulless as we get closer to living the movie Equilibrium.

If I'm a buy an electronic car? I'm gonna get the best out there.... Porsche, Alfa Romeo, Mercedes. I'm not buying a PS4 on wheels from a company that couldn't even address a CSC failure properly.

Stick to being as close to analog as possible Nissan or it's goodbye from me. I rather spend double.

This company gets more disappointing by the day. EV this.... electronic that. Visceral is being written out if the dictionary. Fvckin NWO is killing the auto industry. Nothing is sacred anymore.

Rant Over.

Nice rant. You are either of my generation or just simple like me.

Ever drive a Lotus?

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-06-2017, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhilr8n!

Nice rant. You are either of my generation or just simple like me.

Ever drive a Lotus?

Born in 73
I've been recommended to drive the Evora 400. I respect them but they haven't visually appealed to me. I should at least get in a solo teat drive of one.

RicerX · 02-06-2017, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

If Nissan is looking to use the Q60 platform? And the literally make it with that garbage azz New World Order Steering System. Don't expect a lighter car. That would mean more gratuitous use of carbon fiber. If that happens? It'll only happen in a Nismo. N it'll still weigh more because Nissan's Nismo body bracing weighs 88 lbs. So you gain and lose keeping the Z heavy.

That NWO PS4 steering has a heavy azz manual override steering column interlock further adding weight. Then factor in the numb steering, electronic handbrake, and other stupidities like hybrid batteries on certain models. The Z will probably be between 3,400lbs and 3,600lbs.

They'll say our base model is 53lbs lighter than our outgoing Nismo model yet out powers and out handles it on paper. It will just be a numb feeling appliance where excitement will be on the seat of the pants verses the visceral nature of the current Z. People will talk about how THE Z34 & 135 & EVO X were the last of the visceral analog cars and how the digital world has dulled cars.

Stick to being as close to analog as possible Nissan or it's goodbye from me. I rather spend double.

This company gets more disappointing by the day. EV this.... electronic that. Visceral is being written out if the dictionary. Fvckin NWO is killing the auto industry. Nothing is sacred anymore.

Rant Over.

While I enjoyed your rant, let me help you

The Q50 3.7L came into being with the same wheelbase as the outgoing G37 while being a couple inches longer (junk in the trunk and longer hood). It's a lower and wider car than the G37 and still barely managed to weigh within punching distance of the G by a few pounds (I believe its within 50lbs trim to trim). The platform is improved in rigidity over the one that underpins the current 370Z as well.

The Q50 also offers a NON SORCERER version of a steering system. It's electronically assisted power steering, but it's a real steering column and everything - that's how I ordered mine. A stripper Q50S RWD - no spare or anything. No goofy steering - just a regular *** rack and pinion setup. This is the base option for all Q cars - the Direct Adaptive Steering is optional. The auto mags would have you think otherwise since none of them apparently have the balls to ask for a Q50 without that system equipped, and then they **** on the car for having it equipped and not liking it. Motor Trend pissed me off with that review, but I digress.

On to the weight stuff - The Q50S RWD with no nav or tech weighs 3666 pounds with the cast Enkei 19s and run flats. That wheel and tire combination is 62lbs. 30lbs of that is the run flat tires (THEY SUCK). Swap to Michelin PSS and lose 5lbs per corner just with tires. Switch to the optional Rays wheel package on the 2015? Drop another 10lbs per corner. There's 60lbs in weight savings with just wheels and tires, and this particular setup you can expect to see equipped on a next gen Z's sport package. (to give you further perspective, the Q50S RWD pulled 0.86g on the skidpad with the Enkeis and Dunlop runflats equipped, and turned around to 0.95g on the skidpad with only adding the Rays wheel package... the chassis is exceptionally capable on this car).

A lot of the specs you see from the Q60 are the AWD version (extra weight), with all the tech bits we won't see in the Z. None of the current Q50/60 cars offer a forged lightweight wheel. They all have leather seating with climate control and multiple points of adjustment. All have sunroofs (most of the time, that's another 50lbs). All have more sound-deadening materials than you'll see in a Z (hell, drive a G37 and drive a 370Z right after and you can tell that difference). The Q50 has something silly like 10 or 12 speakers in the Bose system that's in it with an amplifier mounted into the rear deck. They both have that crazy InTouch system that adds serious weight, but I don't know if I can discount that as being unavailable in the next Z as some buyers want all that tech. (though mine is hilariously overdone since I don't have Nav)

Bottom line, I really don't see a 3300-ish lb version of the next gen Z to be outside of the realm of possibility. The VR30 with its turbos mounted is only 18lbs heavier than the VQ37... the absence of a lot of plush in the Q cars can make up significant ground quickly. In this light, it's gonna be ok. I promise!

RicerX · 02-06-2017, 10:00 AM

I'm still dying laughing at "New World Order Steering System". That's probably the best possible description for it.

ThaeMaestro · 02-06-2017, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

We already have a carbon fiber drive shaft and radiator housing. It's not unfathomable that Nissan does some in-house carbon fiber to double up or triple the amount in the next gen. .... ....

My point still stands.... by evading all their original hype. A lighter Z will be a challenge ...

first off its crazy talk to think that just because we have a couple pieces of carbon to think nissan will triple the amount they use for the new models.

ive been on this thread for a while now just now and again and i think youre the only one who thought the z was going t be crazy light (i cant quote you on this one but you had by far the lightest predictions if i remember correctly) because of some juke they had "made".

i even think i told you before, dont let yourself down by thinking they will build something as amazing as you invisioned. i dont think anyone bought into the hype like you did.

but,

we will see!

Xhilr8n! · 02-06-2017, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

Born in 73
I've been recommended to drive the Evora 400. I respect them but they haven't visually appealed to me. I should at least get in a solo teat drive of one.

I don't care for the front end of the 400 myself, our first gen S is much better to my eyes. But these cars look much better in the flesh than any photo can capture.

But you ought to see if it addresses your automotive desires.

Edit: don't get me wrong guys, lovin' the Z. But just not comparable. Z much more like an F-Type.

pulpz · 02-06-2017, 05:10 PM

Nissan is WAY over due on bringing the next gen Z to market. The likelihood of it being FI and moving up market pushed me to move on to a cayman gts.

And frankly, I think folks will look back at the 370Z as the Z car to have given its value, performance, and NA setup. I think its the best Z car next to the 240.

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-06-2017, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RicerX

While I enjoyed your rant, let me help you

The Q50 3.7L came into being with the same wheelbase as the outgoing G37 while being a couple inches longer (junk in the trunk and longer hood). It's a lower and wider car than the G37 and still barely managed to weigh within punching distance of the G by a few pounds (I believe its within 50lbs trim to trim). The platform is improved in rigidity over the one that underpins the current 370Z as well.

The Q50 also offers a NON SORCERER version of a steering system. It's electronically assisted power steering, but it's a real steering column and everything - that's how I ordered mine. A stripper Q50S RWD - no spare or anything. No goofy steering - just a regular *** rack and pinion setup. This is the base option for all Q cars - the Direct Adaptive Steering is optional. The auto mags would have you think otherwise since none of them apparently have the balls to ask for a Q50 without that system equipped, and then they **** on the car for having it equipped and not liking it. Motor Trend pissed me off with that review, but I digress.

On to the weight stuff - The Q50S RWD with no nav or tech weighs 3666 pounds with the cast Enkei 19s and run flats. That wheel and tire combination is 62lbs. 30lbs of that is the run flat tires (THEY SUCK). Swap to Michelin PSS and lose 5lbs per corner just with tires. Switch to the optional Rays wheel package on the 2015? Drop another 10lbs per corner. There's 60lbs in weight savings with just wheels and tires, and this particular setup you can expect to see equipped on a next gen Z's sport package. (to give you further perspective, the Q50S RWD pulled 0.86g on the skidpad with the Enkeis and Dunlop runflats equipped, and turned around to 0.95g on the skidpad with only adding the Rays wheel package... the chassis is exceptionally capable on this car).

A lot of the specs you see from the Q60 are the AWD version (extra weight), with all the tech bits we won't see in the Z. None of the current Q50/60 cars offer a forged lightweight wheel. They all have leather seating with climate control and multiple points of adjustment. All have sunroofs (most of the time, that's another 50lbs). All have more sound-deadening materials than you'll see in a Z (hell, drive a G37 and drive a 370Z right after and you can tell that difference). The Q50 has something silly like 10 or 12 speakers in the Bose system that's in it with an amplifier mounted into the rear deck. They both have that crazy InTouch system that adds serious weight, but I don't know if I can discount that as being unavailable in the next Z as some buyers want all that tech. (though mine is hilariously overdone since I don't have Nav)

Bottom line, I really don't see a 3300-ish lb version of the next gen Z to be outside of the realm of possibility. The VR30 with its turbos mounted is only 18lbs heavier than the VQ37... the absence of a lot of plush in the Q cars can make up significant ground quickly. In this light, it's gonna be ok. I promise!

Thanks for the update on the weight.... I kept googling that effing car & it kept giving me 3,853 so I took it as word. But I know you wouldn't steer me wrong. Trust you over google. LMFAO.

That said.... I hope that is the case. We'd be at 3,666 - 400. 3,266. That would be roughly the same weight as a base. Throw in sport package n it'll prolly weigh 3,000. N for flappy paddle guys about 3,020lbs.... I guess with the engine we have that would be acceptable...

I guess I did believe the hidden hype about them separating the chassis and making the Z it's own car. And considering the grip Z was a 2500lb chassis and body with a 300HP turbo 4. I thought what perfect numbers for a Z. And considering that we're in year 8.5 I expected that by year 10 we'd get something revolutionary.

Maybe the Z has potential to be good? I don't know. But Nissan just been steadily pissing me off the last 12 months. The Q with no LSD. E-E-Brakes in sports cars and disconnected steering. I'm tight.

I hate mustangs. Check my track record on mustang. But I respect they kept the drift friendly handbrake on mustangs. The 2 series as well. But those aren't PROPER sports cars. The Z is...

Back in 09. We had droves of members crying like babies that the Z couldn't compare to a BMW in materials in technology. That's not what the Z is.... while I wish they updated the Z touch materials over time to reflect the times and I wish the stereo were better. I don't feel most creature comforts are necessary. I wouldn't even bitch about the stereo if they didn't make you drive off the lot after spending $35+k with the shyttiest sounding exhaust on a sports car.

I love this car. N I contemplate updating my 11 for a 17 Nismo before this platform disappears. But I had hopes that Nissan would follow the same philosophy as AMG GTS with hydraulic steering. (Though they dropped the ball on e brake). Keep the experience pure. I'm so tired of all these cars. I mean I enjoy test driving them. But they all feel, uncommunicative. N I really don't like that seat of the pants only experience. It bugs me. That's not what I pay money for.

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-06-2017, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThaeMaestro

first off its crazy talk to think that just because we have a couple pieces of carbon to think nissan will triple the amount they use for the new models.

ive been on this thread for a while now just now and again and i think youre the only one who thought the z was going t be crazy light (i cant quote you on this one but you had by far the lightest predictions if i remember correctly) because of some juke they had "made".

i even think i told you before, dont let yourself down by thinking they will build something as amazing as you invisioned. i dont think anyone bought into the hype like you did.

but,

we will see!

Crazy talk???? Chevy did it on the vette!!! The vette debuted at $53,000 and I stated it for the Nismo. Which will be about $50,000. So where in your brilliance is it unfathomable for Nissan to create in house carbon fiber?

Secondly.... Yeah I believed their hype cuz that wasn't a rumor. That was Nissan talking smack in 2011:12 about new platforms for the Z. Just like they said. YOU WILL SEE THE IDX. I tend to believe companies when you assume they're trying to be competitive.

On the weight. Ricer X came to me with FACTS and he has some seriously valid points. But I'm also disappointed at 5 years of Nissan not ever having anything solid but the two things they did claim to be solid they didn't.

FPenvy · 02-06-2017, 07:43 PM

Did I miss anything good while I was on my "vacation"?

UNKNOWN_370 · 02-06-2017, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy

Did I miss anything good while I was on my "vacation"?

A Z concept is coming in the fall. A new Z shortly after. Within months.. Where's u go?

02-06-2017, 10:00 AM	#3188 (permalink)
RicerX Track Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: TN Posts: 597 Drives: To the Pizza joint. Rep Power: 7720	I'm still dying laughing at "New World Order Steering System". That's probably the best possible description for it. UNKNOWN_370 and FPenvy like this.

02-06-2017, 05:10 PM	#3191 (permalink)
pulpz Enthusiast Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 281 Drives: 09 PG 370Z Sport 6MT Rep Power: 15	Nissan is WAY over due on bringing the next gen Z to market. The likelihood of it being FI and moving up market pushed me to move on to a cayman gts. And frankly, I think folks will look back at the 370Z as the Z car to have given its value, performance, and NA setup. I think its the best Z car next to the 240. UNKNOWN_370 and ThaeMaestro like this. __________________ 2016 Cayman GTS 6MT / 2017 Q60 Sport / 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD / 2015 Lexus IS 350 AWD F-Sport (Sold) / 2009 PG 370Z Sport 6MT, (Sold) / 2003 SS 350Z Enthusiast 6MT (Sold)

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02-05-2017, 06:23 AM	#3181 (permalink)
TKP-Zeto Base Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: New York City, USA Posts: 6 Drives: '12 370Z touring Rep Power: 10	The guys at stillen have been messing around with the new engine in the Q60 red sport... claim that is actually UNDER-rated. If that's the case, if it gets transplanted to the next Z35 it sounds promising. I was afraid a smaller block with the twin scrolls between the V's and the integrated water to air intercooler might be more expensive to upgrade or have a lower max potential than getting a current 3.7L and just tossing on bolt-ons and a tune.