What!!!! No ashtray

Nick911sc · 03-25-2010, 03:45 PM

I don't smoke, but cigarette taxes in New York City are over $4 a pack.

I don't smoke and I hate it. But I support peoples rights to do it if they please. And any government based tax on goods because they're "bad" for you is unconstitutional crap. It needs to stop.

Zsteve · 03-25-2010, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

I don't smoke, but cigarette taxes in New York City are over $4 a pack.

I don't smoke and I hate it. But I support peoples rights to do it if they please. And any government based tax on goods because they're "bad" for you is unconstitutional crap. It needs to stop.

Its not the bad for you, the person smoking, that they care about really. Its the problems they are doing to those around them that dont smoke. Kill yourself, those that smoke, but not those that dont. You think that little girl in the car I saw had a choice on them smoking and hurting her young and growing lungs? If they do that enough she will have problems even if she doesnt learn from them and smoke.

Nick911sc · 03-25-2010, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zsteve

Its not the bad for you, the person smoking, that they care about really. Its the problems they are doing to those around them that dont smoke. Kill yourself, those that smoke, but not those that dont. You think that little girl in the car I saw had a choice on them smoking and hurting her young and growing lungs? If they do that enough she will have problems even if she doesnt learn from them and smoke.

Oh i totally agree with you 100%. But problems such as those aren't fixed by taxing the product. A awful parent poisoning their child with a $10 pack of cigarettes is no different than an awful parent poisoning their child with a $5 pack.

Zsteve · 03-25-2010, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

Oh i totally agree with you 100%. But problems such as those aren't fixed by taxing the product. A awful parent poisoning their child with a $10 pack of cigarettes is no different than an awful parent poisoning their child with a $5 pack.

I know it was a joke about raising the taxes to support the new health care plan it just gotta little side tracked.

kannibul · 03-25-2010, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

Oh i totally agree with you 100%. But problems such as those aren't fixed by taxing the product. A awful parent poisoning their child with a $10 pack of cigarettes is no different than an awful parent poisoning their child with a $5 pack.

Except a $5 tax on top of each pack sold would go a long way towards paying for the expenses that the user or their child may face when it comes to smoking related illnesses.

1 pack a day, $5 x 365 x 30 years smoking = approx $55K. That's not even close to what radiation costs...but it'd help.

Nick911sc · 03-25-2010, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Except a $5 tax on top of each pack sold would go a long way towards paying for the expenses that the user and their child may face when it comes to smoking related illnesses.

1 pack a day, $5 x 365 x 30 years smoking = approx $55K. That's not even close to what radiation costs...but it'd help.

Which is why the govt shouldn't be adding the tax on top. It takes that money out of their pocket. It's not like they give the money back if you get cancer.

370Zsteve · 03-25-2010, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

Which is why the govt shouldn't be adding the tax on top. It takes that money out of their pocket. It's not like they give the money back if you get cancer.

Tobacco taxes aren't going anywhere but up, Nick.

Nick911sc · 03-25-2010, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

Tobacco taxes aren't going anywhere but up, Nick.

I agree

I'm just against taxes in general regardless of the item haha

kannibul · 03-25-2010, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

Which is why the govt shouldn't be adding the tax on top. It takes that money out of their pocket. It's not like they give the money back if you get cancer.

Who's pocket? The smoker's? Simple - quit smoking. Easy enough fix. Make it cost enough (by taxing it) and people will stop doing it, and the problems caused by it will go away.

The end result is that we're healthier for it, making our healthcare costs go down, which then the money "gained" by taxing won't be nessicary. On the other hand, those that do smoke, end up costing ALL OF US more money by having higher premiums - might as well try and offset it by placing a tax on the items causing the problem.

Zaggeron · 03-25-2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Who's pocket? The smoker's? Simple - quit smoking. Easy enough fix. Make it cost enough (by taxing it) and people will stop doing it, and the problems caused by it will go away.

The end result is that we're healthier for it, making our healthcare costs go down, which then the money "gained" by taxing won't be nessicary. On the other hand, those that do smoke, end up costing ALL OF US more money by having higher premiums - might as well try and offset it by placing a tax on the items causing the problem.

Well I for one don't want to be made "healthier" against my will. Oh and get your facts straight. It's a little publicized fact but smokers have lower total health care costs. The average age at which a smoker gets lung cancer is 72 and typically they don't live long enough to have long extended illnesses.

Why stop at cigarettes? Why not tax to extinction or outright outlaw all sorts of risky behavior -- hang gliding ... no way ..the nanny state says people having accidents hang gliding will raise premiums. Like fast cars ... sorry ...fast cars are dangerous. Like your whoppers -- you gotta be kidding ... saturated fat is a mega killer.

It's a slippery slope and it's inconsistent with the notion of individual responsibility for which this country is known.

If they are going to outlaw smoking because the non-smokers are getting annoyed at smelling a little smoke, then they should also outlaw wearing Axe body spray or old lady perfume in public places -- that crap is way more noxious smelling than a bit of stale tobacco smoke

shadow2k · 03-25-2010, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Who's pocket? The smoker's? Simple - quit smoking. Easy enough fix. Make it cost enough (by taxing it) and people will stop doing it, and the problems caused by it will go away.

The end result is that we're healthier for it, making our healthcare costs go down, which then the money "gained" by taxing won't be nessicary. On the other hand, those that do smoke, end up costing ALL OF US more money by having higher premiums - might as well try and offset it by placing a tax on the items causing the problem.

Ya know...I could easily apply those same sentiments to the Z itself, or any other sports car. Maybe we should levy a 40% tax on sports cars too? Maybe everyone should drive around in Nissan Versa in full body armor because its safer? Hey, lets just stop polluting the world and everyone rides bicycles!

No, that wouldn't be convenient for you, would it... Let's just focus on other people's vices instead.

JACKPAC · 03-25-2010, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

Which is why the govt shouldn't be adding the tax on top. It takes that money out of their pocket. It's not like they give the money back if you get cancer.

It won't prevent already addicted people who can afford it to quit, but maybe it will reduce the number of teens who start smoking, or who can't afford to start smoking. Nobody starts smoking when they're adults and have money.

Zaggeron · 03-25-2010, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JACKPAC

It won't prevent already addicted people who can afford it to quit, but maybe it will reduce the number of teens who start smoking, or who can't afford to start smoking. Nobody starts smoking when they're adults and have money.

No one can argue that it is good to reduce the number of teens who start smoking. But this should be between the teens and their parents. If you want to instill certain values in your children you need to teach those values to your children and not rely on the government to protect your kids from the big bad world.

370Zsteve · 03-25-2010, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick911sc

I don't smoke, but cigarette taxes in New York City are over $4 a pack.

I don't smoke and I hate it. But I support peoples rights to do it if they please. And any government based tax on goods because they're "bad" for you is unconstitutional crap. It needs to stop.

They don't tax tobacco because it's bad for you. It's a Excise (consumption) tax, much like the tax on alcohol or gasoline... and soon, if there is a God, marijuana.

Zsteve · 03-25-2010, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

They don't tax tobacco because it's bad for you. It's a Excise (consumption) tax, much like the tax on alcohol or gasoline... and soon, if there is a God, marijuana.

bit I do that without taxes now. hmmm might have to have maijuana party to stop them from taxing us.

I dont really smoke it, I get tested at work.

03-25-2010, 03:45 PM	#1 (permalink)
Nick911sc A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Long Island, New York Posts: 1,698 Drives: 2010 Nissan GT-R Rep Power: 22	I don't smoke, but cigarette taxes in New York City are over $4 a pack. I don't smoke and I hate it. But I support peoples rights to do it if they please. And any government based tax on goods because they're "bad" for you is unconstitutional crap. It needs to stop.