WHo has 300whp and what do you have

GZ3 · 03-29-2011, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TROOPER

Very broad statement LOL

What do you call "similar numbers" and "similar mods"..??

I'd be surprised with similar mods that you're dyno'ing the same as a Nismo.!

Why not? The only advantage you hold with your "Nismo" at this point is a suspect adjust to the factory to VVEL. Which is just that, a suspicion. No proof, the only reason a nismo makes more power "Stock" than a regular 370 is because it has a freer flowing exhaust and a mild tune. But its still called "stock" lol...

Jordo! · 03-29-2011, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GZ3

Why not? The only advantage you hold with your "Nismo" at this point is a suspect adjust to the factory to VVEL. Which is just that, a suspicion. No proof, the only reason a nismo makes more power "Stock" than a regular 370 is because it has a freer flowing exhaust and a mild tune. But its still called "stock" lol...

I just took a good look at a bone stock Nismo dyno -- they DEFINITELY have more than just CBE and fuel/spark -- it must have different VVEL tune as well.

Regular Z's need a tune, CBE, and TP's to catch up to the bone stock Nismos.

That difference has gotta be all due the VVEL.

Dammit. C'mon GTM -- bring out that VVEL controller already!

Oh and whoever thinks they're putting down 330-340 NA... yeah... that's an awfully optimistic dyno.

Maybe at the crank

birdmanx1 · 03-30-2011, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordo!

I just took a good look at a bone stock Nismo dyno -- they DEFINITELY have more than just CBE and fuel/spark -- it must have different VVEL tune as well.

Regular Z's need a tune, CBE, and TP's to catch up to the bone stock Nismos.

Glad to hear that Jordo, saving this argument for the future Nismo bashing threads

Jordo! · 03-30-2011, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by birdmanx1

Glad to hear that Jordo, saving this argument for the future Nismo bashing threads

Actually -- slight amendment to that: All those bolt-on's plus a tune will surpass a stock Nismo -- but... the fact that it takes TP's to be in the same ball park suggests that the Nismo just flows a lot a lot more freely than a regular Z, which makes me think the VVEL is the key.

If somebody has a Dynojet drf for a Z with just CBE and tune, please send me the file so I can get a better idea just how far apart they are

Vince@R/T · 03-30-2011, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

The mustang dyno reads high.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomnavone

I thought mustang dynos were the heart break dyno that reads lower than a dyno jet. Rcz did 390 on a mustang and 455 on a dynojet

Quote:

Originally Posted by jnaut

nope they read typicaly lower

true!

The Main difference from a numbers standpoint between Mustang and dynojet, is that with Mustang you can change a Value to either make it read higher or lower. Mustang has this power/coast down procedure that u perform several times thats gives you a value. You take those values and then average them out and thats the value you are suppose to use in the Mustang software. Now if you maunually make that value higher or perfrom the power/coastdown procedure wrong and it gives you higher numbers...the dyno will read higher. Same is true with lower values

Now with a dynojet, that number isn't adjustable, that's why its the industry standard and everybody compares them. Now we have both, and they both work great for what they do. If we are talking about a accurate numbers stand point, its no doubt that the dynojet is more accurate. If we are talking about a load control and variable tuning tool, no doubt the mustang is better.

Quick story, we used to do alot of Porsche product testing. Specifically on the 997 Carrera 4. Company was making intakes and exhaust on a already pretty well engineered N/A 3.6 liter. Long story short, is that no matter what this company did they couldn't make any more power with there products. They got everybody involved including current and previous Porsche engineers. Through this process with them being here they had brought all the factory calculated drivetrain loss figures (from Porsche R&D), stating that there was a 13% drivetrain loss on that vehicle. Well with 340BHP, we consistently got 293-296 WHP on over a half dozen Carrera 4's.

So that is one specific instance of the accuracy of dynojets numbers. When you compile that with the 100's if not 1000's of stock NA cars that we have done with the information that is out there, dynojet numbers always seem to be on par with what is expected to see HP at the wheels....

BLM · 03-30-2011, 09:17 AM

^^^ Very informative! So if I'm reading this correctly, Mustang dyno's may read high, low, or accurately, whereas Dynojet's are more comparable from dyno to dyno...

IIRC, stock 370Z's hit the dynoJet's at around 270-275 whp, which is approximately 19-20% drivetrain loss. That makes sense to me.

Unless you're in the 1000 hp club, and at a dyno day to show off grotesque power numbers, I think it's important to remember that the dyno is ultimately a tool for tuning.

GZ3 · 03-30-2011, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BLM

^^^ Very informative! So if I'm reading this correctly, Mustang dyno's may read high, low, or accurately, whereas Dynojet's are more comparable from dyno to dyno...

IIRC, stock 370Z's hit the dynoJet's at around 275 whp, which is approximately 19% drivetrain loss. That makes sense to me.

Unless you're in the 1000 hp club, and at a dyno day to show off grotesque power numbers, I think it's important to remember that the dyno is ultimately a tool for tuning.

sounds about right, my baseline was 277rwhp, dynojet SAE C.

Vince@R/T · 03-30-2011, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BLM

^^^ Very informative! So if I'm reading this correctly, Mustang dyno's may read high, low, or accurately, whereas Dynojet's are more comparable from dyno to dyno...

IIRC, stock 370Z's hit the dynoJet's at around 270-275 whp, which is approximately 19-20% drivetrain loss. That makes sense to me.

Unless you're in the 1000 hp club, and at a dyno day to show off grotesque power numbers, I think it's important to remember that the dyno is ultimately a tool for tuning.

^^ Yes sir dynojets are all calibrated at the factory and the shipped out to the shops, and there is no adjustment parameters for the shops. I really like both the dynos alot, and give custmers the option to decide which one they want. Usually they just ask us what is best and we lead them in the right direction. Also our dyno jet is only 2wd so when it comes to the AWD cars they all go on the mustang. We just did a G37X with all the bolt ons and we ended up with 305whp on the mustang...

Jordo! · 03-30-2011, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BLM

^^^ Very informative! So if I'm reading this correctly, Mustang dyno's may read high, low, or accurately, whereas Dynojet's are more comparable from dyno to dyno...

IIRC, stock 370Z's hit the dynoJet's at around 270-275 whp, which is approximately 19-20% drivetrain loss. That makes sense to me.

Unless you're in the 1000 hp club, and at a dyno day to show off grotesque power numbers, I think it's important to remember that the dyno is ultimately a tool for tuning.

This is why I've said elsewhere that Mustangs and other load bearing dynos can either break hearts OR lift spirits -- there's too many fudge factors.

This is also why I pretty much only go by dynojets for determining power figures.

Load bearing dynos are better for tuning, tho.

03-30-2011, 09:17 AM	#6 (permalink)
BLM Enthusiast Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 342 Drives: 2011 Silver M6 sport Rep Power: 16	^^^ Very informative! So if I'm reading this correctly, Mustang dyno's may read high, low, or accurately, whereas Dynojet's are more comparable from dyno to dyno... IIRC, stock 370Z's hit the dynoJet's at around 270-275 whp, which is approximately 19-20% drivetrain loss. That makes sense to me. Unless you're in the 1000 hp club, and at a dyno day to show off grotesque power numbers, I think it's important to remember that the dyno is ultimately a tool for tuning. __________________ K&N // GTM // BERK Last edited by BLM; 03-30-2011 at 09:23 AM.