Wheel Spacers 101

CBRsummer · 05-06-2014, 08:18 AM

just threw wheel spacers on the ride. absolutely love how the car looks now. and it may just be in my head, but the car actually seems smoother and turn in is noticeably better.

in my reading, i didn't see anyone mention an off brand of spacer. soooo, i went to amazon looking for something cheap that may be a quality alternative to the h&r's, eibach's, etc. before you start flaming, i did this entirely for testing purposes and the gathering of information and i was prepared to return them if they weren't perfect.

i went with 20mm in the front and 25mm in the rear. total cost was $125 and shipping was free. and yes, they were perfect. so if you're looking for a quality, cnc machined, hub centric spacer at half the cost of the h&r's, i'd highly recommend these.

the 20's fit perfectly on the front but the factory stud does stick out past the spacer. they fit because the rays have recesses in the back of the wheel that allow the wheel to sit flush on the spacer. (the post on amazon says they will not fit.)
the 25's are perfect for the rear with a 275 tire. i may end up dropping down though when i replace the rear tires with something wider next summer.
i used some antiseize on all the hubs and blue locktight on the spacers nuts only.

if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!

mjm · 05-06-2014, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRsummer

just threw wheel spacers on the ride. absolutely love how the car looks now. and it may just be in my head, but the car actually seems smoother and turn in is noticeably better.

in my reading, i didn't see anyone mention an off brand of spacer. soooo, i went to amazon looking for something cheap that may be a quality alternative to the h&r's, eibach's, etc. before you start flaming, i did this entirely for testing purposes and the gathering of information and i was prepared to return them if they weren't perfect.

i went with 20mm in the front and 25mm in the rear. total cost was $125 and shipping was free. and yes, they were perfect. so if you're looking for a quality, cnc machined, hub centric spacer at half the cost of the h&r's, i'd highly recommend these.

the 20's fit perfectly on the front but the factory stud does stick out past the spacer. they fit because the rays have recesses in the back of the wheel that allow the wheel to sit flush on the spacer. (the post on amazon says they will not fit.)

the 25's are perfect for the rear with a 275 tire. i may end up dropping down though when i replace the rear tires with something wider next summer.

i used some antiseize on all the hubs and blue locktight on the spacers nuts only.

if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!

Thank you! I just ordered mine from Amazon. I've had good luck with "off brand" spacers in the past. I'll give these a try at half the price!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bonzo · 05-06-2014, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CBRsummer

if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!

Well you say this, but I do have two nagging doubts.

I'm late to the party here I know because I've been off this forum for a long while now. Just popped back in yesterday to post some pics and saw this thread.

I've long "thought" about spacers, but always dismissed them for 2 main reasons:
#1. I think in the long run they will add extra unnecessary wear on the bearings and cause premature failure.
#2. I don't like the idea of having my wheels perfectly "spaced in the center" twice. I've had big problems with "ring" spacers in the past, such a problem I said I'd never do it again. I realize these Z spacers don't have the rings, they are a solid part of the spacers, but it still makes me wonder in the long run.

Basically, I use my car as a daily driver as much as possible, and I'm afraid the spacers will cause long term premature wear on the bearings, and also cause possible "wobble" (unbalanced) problems. By this time after all these years I wonder if there are any people out there having these problems?

Am I being over cautious here or just plain dumb?

Thanks for any advise anyone can give.

Cheers ---- Bonzo

Driftomodachi · 05-06-2014, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haboob

So that you can use all the threads in the lug to hold it on, otherwise you're only holding that wheel on with 50% (or less, I'm not sure) of the threads.

Doesn't seem safe, nor worth the risk, IMO.

Funny, you liked my post that said this:

I wouldn't replace studs for track. Track duty sees more torsional stress on the lengthened studs which can stretch or break the studs and cause the wheel to come loose or fall off.

Bolt on spacers are torqued down on the wheel and on the spacer so there is no torsional stress on the studs.

Tell me if I'm wrong

JARblue · 05-06-2014, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Driftomodachi

Funny, you liked my post that said this:

I wouldn't replace studs for track. Track duty sees more torsional stress on the lengthened studs which can stretch or break the studs and cause the wheel to come loose or fall off.

Bolt on spacers are torqued down on the wheel and on the spacer so there is no torsional stress on the studs.

Tell me if I'm wrong

ARP studs are the way to go if you want to track with spacers. They're $$$$.

Haboob · 05-06-2014, 11:23 AM

I think I liked it with the understanding that you meant spacers in general are not safe for tracking.

TapaTalk for iPhone.

Driftomodachi · 05-06-2014, 11:37 AM

I see a lot of d1gp cars with bolt on spacers. Considering all the torque that spins their wheels for drifting I feel it's safe to go with them.

DEpointfive0 · 05-07-2014, 05:59 PM

What level of bullshit is this?

Quote:

Because widening the track will increase wear on bearings (just like having wider wheels with lower offset), the steering is now a little bit more responsive due to a slight increase weight in the feel caused by the increase scrub radius. I'm very happy with the result both in terms of looks and handling wise (wider track). In fact the car appeared to sit lower with the wheels pushed flush to the fenders! Photos always make the car seem taller, but in person the car is a lot lower (since you're looked down at it as the last photo shows)

From:
IS250 with Spacers Installed - my.IS - Lexus IS Forum

Bonzo · 05-08-2014, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0

What level of bullshit is this?

From:
IS250 with Spacers Installed - my.IS - Lexus IS Forum

Which part are you talking about? The part about the bearings is exactly what I was talking about in my post above. There will be more wear on the bearings for certain, I guess I'm just wondering how much. I don't want to have to be replacing bearings every 50,000 miles.

As for the the other stuff, no clue.

Chuck33079 · 05-08-2014, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonzo

Which part are you talking about? The part about the bearings is exactly what I was talking about in my post above. There will be more wear on the bearings for certain, I guess I'm just wondering how much. I don't want to have to be replacing bearings every 50,000 miles.

As for the the other stuff, no clue.

I know on Subarus, spacers caused premature bearing failure often. However, the hubs and bearings on them were weak and undersized to begin with and often failed completely stock. So spacers do cause accelerated wear, but on a bearing that's not a problem the question becomes "how much accelerated wear?" If it would have gone 250k without issue and now will only go 200k, that's probably ok. We just don't know. There haven't been a lot of reported failures. I won't run them but plenty of people seem to have no issues.

Bonzo · 05-08-2014, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

So spacers do cause accelerated wear, but on a bearing that's not a problem the question becomes "how much accelerated wear?" If it would have gone 250k without issue and now will only go 200k, that's probably ok. We just don't know. There haven't been a lot of reported failures. I won't run them but plenty of people seem to have no issues.

Exactly. If no spacers gets me 120,000 and with spacers gets me, 115,000, that's not a big deal to me. But if no spacers is 120,000 and with spacers is 80,000, then that's huge. Thing is, the guys who put on spacers aren't typically going to be the ones jumping on the forum talking about how their bearings failed prematurely. That's the only way we are going to know.

If Nissan had only designed the car with a 1" wider stance on each side we wouldn't be having this discussion, and the spacer business would plummet.

DEpointfive0 · 05-08-2014, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonzo

Exactly. If no spacers gets me 120,000 and with spacers gets me, 115,000, that's not a big deal to me. But if no spacers is 120,000 and with spacers is 80,000, then that's huge. Thing is, the guys who put on spacers aren't typically going to be the ones jumping on the forum talking about how their bearings failed prematurely. That's the only way we are going to know.

If Nissan had only designed the car with a 1" wider stance on each side we wouldn't be having this discussion, and the spacer business would plummet.

I agree that if the wear is even 10% faster, who cares.

As for Nissan making the stance wider, (again forgive my ignorance,) but that means Nissan would have to make the axles and hubs/suspension assembly longer, not wheels wider (same question I posed in the post above)

DEpointfive0 · 05-08-2014, 05:55 PM

To Bonzo and Chuck.

Wow, I didn't know that... I guess it makes sense now that I think about it because the bearing gets more "flex"

Current me if I'm wrong, but that means that the Nismo will have bearing failure sooner than a normal Sport, and the sport will have bearing failure before a base model? (all things being equal)

Bonzo · 05-09-2014, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0

To Bonzo and Chuck.

Wow, I didn't know that... I guess it makes sense now that I think about it because the bearing gets more "flex"

Current me if I'm wrong, but that means that the Nismo will have bearing failure sooner than a normal Sport, and the sport will have bearing failure before a base model? (all things being equal)

Just like ricers who put on wheels with ridiculous offset, and you can see the wheels "bending" up. Those bearings will be shot in no time.

When car makers design the car they design it all to work together in harmony as much as possible. In this area, they design the tire/wheel/hub/bearing/suspension to all be balanced as much as possible, so the wear on the bearing takes place evenly. Change the offset and you change that balance. Putting on big fat tires and wheels with more offset looks awesome for your Saturday driver or show car, but it's not a good idea for a daily driver if you want things to last.

As for the Nismo question, I don't know. Do those wheels have more natural offset?

DEpointfive0 · 05-09-2014, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonzo

As for the Nismo question, I don't know. Do those wheels have more natural offset?

Nismos are wider and have a lower offset

05-06-2014, 11:37 AM	#7 (permalink)
Driftomodachi Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Cerritos, CA Posts: 482 Drives: 2010 40th Rep Power: 14	I see a lot of d1gp cars with bolt on spacers. Considering all the torque that spins their wheels for drifting I feel it's safe to go with them. cooltoy likes this. __________________ 2010 40th Anniversary ll GT-R start button ll GT-R map lenses ll Plastidipped fangs and rear valence ll OEM foglight & switch ll Motordyne E370 Cat back ll Motordyne ART Pipes ll Takeda aFe Attack CAI ll Sprint Booster ll Z1 34 row Setrab oil cooler ll Z1 Motorsports M-Spec Shift Knob

05-08-2014, 05:55 PM	#13 (permalink)
DEpointfive0 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: SoCal Posts: 14,824 Drives: a lot Rep Power: 17152	To Bonzo and Chuck. Wow, I didn't know that... I guess it makes sense now that I think about it because the bearing gets more "flex" Current me if I'm wrong, but that means that the Nismo will have bearing failure sooner than a normal Sport, and the sport will have bearing failure before a base model? (all things being equal) __________________ Do YOU want to know what/where I got my username from? ( Click to show/hide ) NSFW due to language:

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05-06-2014, 11:23 AM	#6 (permalink)
Haboob A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Surface of the sun. Posts: 13,159 Drives: '18 GTI Autobahn DSG Rep Power: 1388	I think I liked it with the understanding that you meant spacers in general are not safe for tracking. TapaTalk for iPhone.