2016 Alpha platform Camaro

Red__Zed · 12-20-2015, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Curious to see if you could fit a car seat in either...

If you take the passenger seat out

UNKNOWN_370 · 12-22-2015, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Good video subaruwrxfan posted today.

He is right that similarly configured there is about a $5k difference with the Camaro being more expensive. Of course you get the HUD, mag ride, heated steering wheel, and dual mode exhaust with the Camaro.

Mustang might be easier to live with every day with more space and better visibility.

I am not really interested in buying a new car right now, but I would like to get out and drive the Camaro on a nice day.

I still prefer the look of the Mustang. It gives me a positive emotional response whereas I have no real reaction to the Camaro. I would be interested to see if that changes after driving it.

I drove the Mustang some time ago and thoroughly enjoyed it, though I felt like it still needed a bit more damping and spring rate. However the stock suspension was very comfortable and felt perfect for grand touring duty.

Curious to see if you could fit a car seat in either...

I'm sorry but I did some fact checking and I call mega ******** on the pricing and packaging...

First off, if we're comparing his facts to the Chevy turbo.
He's off

0-60/quarter mile (manual)
Mustang ecoboost 5.5 seconds/13.9 seconds
Mustang v6 5.5 seconds/14.1 seconds.
Camaro 2.0T 5.6 seconds/ 14.0 seconds
Camaro v6 5.1 seconds 13.7 seconds

Weight
Mustang ecoboost 3,532lbs
Mustang v6 3,526lbs
Camaro turbo 3,400lbs
Camaro v6 3,339 lbs

Mustang ecoboost premium base price
Approx $30,500
Camaro 2.0T 2LT (Premium pkg equiv)
29,800
Camaro v6 2LT
32,790

Being that the Camaro v6 performance is greatly superior to the mustang v6 or turbo. The Chevy turbo is comparable to both mustang models. Secondly, the difference in weight in turbo models is 132lbs. Anything under 75lbs is almost equal, over 75lbs IMHO is a fair bit small difference, but over 125lbs is a decent difference. There's a 221lb difference between the v6. That's SIGNIFICANT

I view both turbos equally as you can't configure a mustang v6 with much. It's a base car in Ford where in Camaro 4 and 6 are more performance choices than base options. Base cars in both are 1LT packages. Not so much engines.

I configured a mustang, equally loaded to a turbo 4 mustang and the Camaro with manual transmission was
Approx $36,000 the mustang was $38,000 and the v6 was approximately $40,000. So I found the pricing perspective to have a lot of bias and subjectivity to the opinion. But when you load both cars out. You really see that the difference is miniscule. And at base price, you get more in your Camaro standard than you do in your Mustang

Everything else is his opinion, but facts were kind of skewed to show bias as to appease mustang fanboys.

SS guise, weights narrow up significantly against the GT. The SS is only 44 lbs lighter which is miniscule. But the Camaro engineering exceeds mustang significantly.
I will update on Max loaded prices momentarily

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 09:37 AM

I don't think anything has been skewed intentionally. When I do a build of the Camaro using Chevy's employee pricing (what I would pay) I come out to just under $43,000. If I build a Mustang using invoice pricing (the maximum I would pay) I come out to $39,000. That's a $4,000 difference right there.

No matter what, if I configure the SS/GT in the way I would order them, the Camaro is always more expensive. I agree that you do get more options in the Camaro which adds to the price, but still, that's real money.

I don't see any attempt to appeal to any fanboys. I think you're just splitting hairs, to be honest.

You have to understand that this is just a kid on Youtube who reviews cars. I don't think he has a fact checking team to make sure every number he keeps in his head is spot on.

UNKNOWN_370 · 12-22-2015, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

I don't think anything has been skewed intentionally. When I do a build of the Camaro using Chevy's employee pricing (what I would pay) I come out to just under $43,000. If I build a Mustang using invoice pricing (the maximum I would pay) I come out to $39,000. That's a $4,000 difference right there.

No matter what, if I configure the SS/GT in the way I would order them, the Camaro is always more expensive. I agree that you do get more options in the Camaro which adds to the price, but still, that's real money.

I don't see any attempt to appeal to any fanboys. I think you're just splitting hairs, to be honest.

You have to understand that this is just a kid on Youtube who reviews cars. I don't think he has a fact checking team to make sure every number he keeps in his head is spot on.

Not quite splitting hairs at all. It is skewed because his words were. His ecoboost comes in at 33,000 and a comparable Camaro is $5,000 more. I'm talking on the side of the ecoboost and I am not splitting hairs. I brought completely researched FACTS.
It's OK to prefer the mustang. I really think from an aesthetics standpoint. It's give and take between the two cars. But the Chevy 4 banger is more than competitive and sub v8 mustang isn't quite the value he expressed it as.

He's been reviewing cars a long time n he's one of my favorite reviewers. If he's gonna make a "value" statement" on his ecoboost. It better be factual Because, he's making himself an authority on the topic

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:23 AM

$5k is still a lot. It might not be the $8k or whatever he said, but that's a big number for most people.

UNKNOWN_370 · 12-22-2015, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

$5k is still a lot. It might not be the $8k or whatever he said, but that's a big number for most people.

Hello... If you look at the numbers. The turbo 4 is $2000 cheaper than the ecoboost.
The v6 is $2,000 more expensive.

WHERE $5,000 CAME FROM? Maybe on the GT's. But he price checked his own car.

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:31 AM

FWIW, when I configure an Ecoboost vs a Camaro V6, I come up with 32k (Truecar) for the Ford and $36k (GM Employee) for the Camaro. The general theme here is that the Mustang configuration will likely be cheaper than that of the Camaro, regardless of the model.

You also have to remember that the concept of "value" includes both objective and subjective components.

Some people here find great value in paying nearly $50k for a 2015 Nismo...

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:32 AM

It makes sense, too. Camaros have higher starting MSRP and more expensive option packages than Mustang.

UNKNOWN_370 · 12-22-2015, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

FWIW, when I configure an Ecoboost vs a Camaro V6, I come up with 32k (Truecar) for the Ford and $36k (GM Employee) for the Camaro. The general theme here is that the Mustang configuration will likely be cheaper than that of the Camaro, regardless of the model.

You also have to remember that the concept of "value" includes both objective and subjective components.

Some people here find great value in paying nearly $50k for a 2015 Nismo...

To make a determination on price I optioned out from MSRP's. As true car will give you a guesstimated what people average.

Fully loaded from Ford I got $38,000leather, premium package optional colors etc.
I did the same with Chevy.

It is all relative.

His case kinda holds true for v8 models as the

V8 mustang premium is 37,295
2SS V8 IS $41,300

CHEVY is more expensive as a v8 by $3,995

The v8 is where the mustang wins in value.

FPenvy · 12-22-2015, 10:40 AM

wait................why the hell is there an argument about NON V8 options of these cars?

it's simple. with a mustang or Camaro if you don't get a V8 you're a pole smoker.

end of argument//

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

To make a determination on price I optioned out from MSRP's. As true car will give you a guesstimated what people average.

Fully loaded from Ford I got $38,000leather, premium package optional colors etc.
I did the same with Chevy.

It is all relative.

His case kinda holds true for v8 models as the

V8 mustang premium is 37,295
2SS V8 IS $41,300

CHEVY is more expensive as a v8 by $3,995

The v8 is where the mustang wins in value.

I used True Car and GM Employee pricing for a reason... it's very close to what you actually pay for the car in the real world.

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:45 AM

And to reiterate, value is both subjective and objective.

UNKNOWN_370 · 12-22-2015, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy

wait................why the hell is there an argument about NON V8 options of these cars?

it's simple. with a mustang or Camaro if you don't get a V8 you're a pole smoker.

end of argument//

He's choosing to debate facts... Lol. In reality though. I think the Camaro v6 is a compelling performance package. If they come out with more aggressive suspensions for the v6. This thing will be 100% competition for the Z.

Well not 100% cuz it's a 2+2 but you know what I mean.

TerribleONE · 12-22-2015, 10:46 AM

m4a1mustang · 12-22-2015, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

He's choosing to debate facts... Lol. In reality though. I think the Camaro v6 is a compelling performance package. If they come out with more aggressive suspensions for the v6. This thing will be 100% competition for the Z.

I'm not debating facts. I'm merely highlighting that this isn't exactly science. Configurations vary and what you consider to be an equivalent configuration might differ from what Subaruwrxfan thinks. And at the end of the day you are the one that "fact checked" him because his 8k or whatever claim was a little bit off of the 5k reality, as configured by you.

12-22-2015, 09:37 AM	#558 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	I don't think anything has been skewed intentionally. When I do a build of the Camaro using Chevy's employee pricing (what I would pay) I come out to just under $43,000. If I build a Mustang using invoice pricing (the maximum I would pay) I come out to $39,000. That's a $4,000 difference right there. No matter what, if I configure the SS/GT in the way I would order them, the Camaro is always more expensive. I agree that you do get more options in the Camaro which adds to the price, but still, that's real money. I don't see any attempt to appeal to any fanboys. I think you're just splitting hairs, to be honest. You have to understand that this is just a kid on Youtube who reviews cars. I don't think he has a fact checking team to make sure every number he keeps in his head is spot on. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

12-22-2015, 10:23 AM	#560 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	$5k is still a lot. It might not be the $8k or whatever he said, but that's a big number for most people. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

12-22-2015, 10:31 AM	#562 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	FWIW, when I configure an Ecoboost vs a Camaro V6, I come up with 32k (Truecar) for the Ford and $36k (GM Employee) for the Camaro. The general theme here is that the Mustang configuration will likely be cheaper than that of the Camaro, regardless of the model. You also have to remember that the concept of "value" includes both objective and subjective components. Some people here find great value in paying nearly $50k for a 2015 Nismo... __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

12-22-2015, 10:32 AM	#563 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	It makes sense, too. Camaros have higher starting MSRP and more expensive option packages than Mustang. UNKNOWN_370 likes this. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

12-22-2015, 10:45 AM	#567 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	And to reiterate, value is both subjective and objective. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

12-22-2015, 10:46 AM	#569 (permalink)
TerribleONE A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Socal Posts: 10,203 Drives: WOT Rep Power: 5850	__________________ 638WHP 541WTQ @ 13.5PSI Build thread

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