Gtm is good in my book. As far as I'm concerned they have done nothing wrong, and in no way do I feel like they are taking our money. Anywhere you go you will have fees. That is to protect them. It may be delayed, but that's the world we live in today, everything gets delayed it seems. The product will be worth the wait.

Please just stop guessing what our laws are over here. If there is no performance date in the contract, the judge will apply what he or she feels is reasonable.

It boils down to customer service and respect for the community and its individuals. That's it.

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Which is......?
I asked you that before.....6 months? 12 months? 5 years?

I have openly invited someone to show me any laws that govern this particular area but no one has responded. It's easy to make statements about what would/should happen without providing any precedent.

Someone mentioned that there was a $1000 non-refundable deposit for the Fast Intentions TT kit pre-order. I don't whether this is true or not as i have only followed that thread very sporadically (and full of jealousy I should add :P). For someone who decided to pull out of their Fast Intentions TT kit pre-order (before the release date was actually announced), would your advice be that they should request their $1000 back?

If Tony said 'No. We had an agreement and I have now invested money into a kit that you no longer want. The $1000 is to cover my costs and you were well aware of this fact when you signed up.' Would your suggestion be for the purchaser to sue Tony and Fast Intentions?

I don't want to turn this into a vendor vs vendor situation, it's just a perfect comparison.

Just let it sink in a bit - the judge will make a call based on the evidence presented. What that ruling may be depends on THE EVIDENCE PRESENTED. The customer may print this entire thread and say "look, the vendor is not providing regular updates, has clear supply chain problems, and can not promise any performance date on our contract". The judge may say a reasonable time has already passed and void the contract.

Like I said multiple times, the customer should have paid off the contract and then demanded performance from GTM. That removes the fee from the picture entirely, but I could understand why they wouldn't want to take the chance unless they were local.

OMFG STFU, just STFUu, u little effing kids, n weit 4ur toy to be completed jeeessshh

Finally I can agree with you!
At long last we have gone from your initial statements....

....to what would actually happen. It could go either way. At least you got some objectivity in there eventually!

As for paying the rest of the invoice and then demanding performance from GTM, I don't think that this would work either. GTM cannot deliver something that is not yet ready and which did not have any specific delivery time outlined. Again it would need to be looked at by a judge and then a decision made as to what a 'reasonable' length of time is.

As per my Fast Intentions example, you cannot put down a non-refundable deposit on a product that you know for a fact is not yet available and has no exact delivery. Then change your mind before the product is ready and in order to get your deposit back, make full payment and say "well, they don't have the product available so I want all of my money back!". You go into the deal knowing that if you want to get out, it will cost a certain amount.

The only variable is what length of time would be considered reasonable by a judge for the product to be ready. In GTM's case a judge might say that the current delays are excessive or that another 6 months would be reasonable, who knows.

But waiting is so boring DOOMMONKEY! Arguing is MUCH more entertaining....If i wasn't doing this then I would be (god forbid!) working.

I can see you like an examples, so put it this way, look around here and open your eyes please, you are here alone like a little australian sheep among the wolves, which try to prove something hopeless and ridiculous. Because of the good exchange rate you made a good deal but everyone else didn't. They frozen their money for months...

The restocking issue has been discussed to death, can we move on guys??????

on side note, anybody know how much additional coolant the csf radiator holds?

:rolleyes:







if you are going to sell 100 turbo kits and 10 people want out of the GB then hell take the hit GTM and give them the full refund....

I cant say anything to that. I look around and all i see are 'wolves' with an axe to grind against GTM and either no decent answers to my points or no skin in the game. Of the people who have made a post disagreeing with any of my arguements, how many are actually involved in the group buy?

If you are so convinced that my points are 'hopeless and ridiculous (sic)' then explain why. The fact that you have moved onto me somehow getting a good deal and everyone else not because of the exchange rates goes to show that you either haven't read or haven't understood anything that I have posted. That has never even been the topic of discussion. You have moved back to complaining about the delays for some reason.

The exchange rate changing doesn't help me at all. I want a TT kit and have to wait around for this one to be ready. End of story. How is my money not frozen? Yes, i would make a couple of hundred if I cancelled but then what? The couple of hundred would be eaten up in exchange fees and no one else has a TT kit that is guaranteed to fit a RHD G37.

I am not sure how you guys do things in Australia but our Government doesn't govern something this small.

I don't need to repeat myself with my reasoning it won't sink in for you.


I was originally in the group buy and even asked for a invoice. I believe I still have it too. I have nothing against GTM and am not trying to attack them. I think it is unreasonable for them to charge this fee. Not only do I think this but many others do too.

Everyone has given you decent answers. You are just unwilling to accept it.

Asked for refund almost three weeks ago quickly received email telling me that refund check will be less 25%.... Then no word since ??? Keep my 25% just give me the rest or answer email something c'mon son ! Real quick to accept money but very slow refunding imagine that

Out of curiousity, why would anyone sign a layaway contract with a 25% restocking/cancellation/wtf fee if GTM didn't require any money whatsoever to get in on the reduced pricing?

Wow. This has turned into a complete train wreck.:drama:
I'm just curious to see a complete kit and final numbers.

So is everyone else here :roflpuke2:

:p

I thought the sarcasm was thick enough from my original post but I guess not.:bowrofl:

We're so bored it's become a seminar in contract law :rofl2:.

Your HONOR the forum clearly stated!!!

LOL

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I guess for the same reason that anyone uses layaway, they didnt have the money up front and knew that they wouldn't have it all anytime soon.

Its easy to say in hindsight that it was a bad idea but if they expected the kits to be ready within a few months of when they ordered, then it was possibly a good idea. Plus if they had started paying and then were able to make the final payment when the kits were ready then they wouldnt be at the bottom of the queue for delivery.

Maybe they knew that if they didnt start paying it off now then they would end up spending their money on something else whilst waiting and miss out completely.

Are you serious???

I find it hard to believe that in the US there are zero laws which govern trade practises. In Aus we have the 'trade practises act' and 'consumer protection act'. There are probably others but they are the two that come to mind.

In a country that requires a jar of peanuts to have a 'Warning! May contain traces of nuts' label on the side, i highly doubt that there are no laws governing layaway practises at all.

In fact, 30 seconds on google has just shown me that California has very specific laws when it comes to layaway.......the defence rests.

:rofl2:
Credit where credit is due - that was hilarious! Thanks for the laughs!

There is a reason that act is vague. It is vague so the person writing the contract can put the details in. Like I said before if the terms are not defined in the contract the customer still wins. Case would still be dealt with in civil court. It will not be "u.s. vs GTM" if it is "u.s. vs GTM" then you know the government cares.

This stuff really is too small for them to care about it.

In the end it still goes back to what I have been saying. 51% in civil court wins. Ambiguity in a contract favors the customer.

A real good contract will define all terms to its exact detail. I have yet to see the actual contract so I will still say that the people still deserve a refund.



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This small part basically sums up my entire arguement.

So many people jumped on this without knowing all the facts with the sole intent of slandering GTM. That is the only reason that I argued it this far. Everyone disagreed with me that there was potentially nothing legally wrong with a restocking fee and jumped on the 'bash GTM' bandwagon.

The fact that you are happy to lay blame and make an absolute decision that a refund is due without even knowing all of the details, just rams this point home. Even though I am one of the people currently being screwed over by the delays, I am sill able to look at this objectively and say that GTM have potentially done nothing wrong. I would have done things differently but in the end that is completely irrelevant.

As long as you have proven all this to yourself, nothing else really matters.

Fixed


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And once again, the entire point has been missed....

I've had enough, I cant compete with such amazing sarcasm skills. I'll leave you guys to sue each other over fatal peanut overdoses.

P.S. how are things going for you over in the Carb Certified Supercharger thread?

What ever happened to your "F$&k you all, F$&K GTM, F$&K this forum, F$&K the police' comment...

I thought you said that you were done?

Lol f$&k the police.

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Yea Dzel did u get in trouble for that? I got a warning I think either for saying "grow a pair" or "sad". How are u still able to post? If I got a warning for that you should have been banned for life.

Uh oh! I probably just dropped myself right in it by reposting then.

Ak doesn't make an appearance just for any one.

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I brought my point up to ak and he took care of it. He along with trip saw my point and got you guys a long awaited update.

The fact that they didn't try to ban me reinstated my faith in this community and the forum.

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With that said Alk you've single handedly turned this thread into a pissing match. Keep in mind the last 6 months on this thread I along with Spohn and Baer are the ones that kept this thread alive. Not with bickering with questions, plans, and updates that we would receive through GTM.

Now have you noticed how the dynamic of this thread has turned since we've backed out?

I'll make it easy for everyone if you went with the lay away contract that has no date of delivery and you choose to back out. You WILL pay the restocking fees. If you signed no such thing and paid in full you'll get your full refund back. No arguing, no pissing contest. That's just how it is. Customer service sucks... yeah we know that.

But I'm still very excited to see this kit distributed and applied. I can't wait to see the rewards of the guys patience that stuck it out.

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Following me around is cute. I always like to have a fan.

The part in bold I can completely agree with. That was my point from the very beginning.

The rest I really hope that you are joking about. You are correct though, once a certain few of you pulled out the dynamic of the thread DID completely change for the worse. Think about that fact for a minute.

It changed from useful information being provided to people involved in the group buy to random negative comments (from people not or no longer involved in he GB) complaining about the delays and just generally attacking GTM.

A few people, including admins agreed with me but it still never changed. I can see that it wont change so I'll just go back to being a casual observer and hope that some useful info gets posted up every now and then.

Thank you that's all we were asking for.

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whats your thoughts on upgrading the fuel pump wiring to a thicker gauge with its own relay. Is this necessary below 500whp? Do it for peace of mind?

And what about the CJM stage 0 fuel return kit?

Any thoughts?

I just did the fuel pump relay yesterday. $30 in parts. Might as well do it since it's so cheap and easy.