Forced Induction for Noobs...

shabarivas · 04-28-2009, 06:14 PM

Awesome thread!! But... under superchargers you say FWHP and not RWHP

Slidefox · 05-19-2009, 12:45 AM

^^ Grammar Police

HP Logic · 06-15-2009, 03:59 PM

The world of Turbo Vs. Supercharger is sometimes tough to realize....the truth is...when making power there are many ways to apply it. Some engines are low reving torque monsters and some rev to infinity....some cars are driven in varying situations...others live in a narrow powerband....and the same goes for turbos and superchargers...some compressors make very little boost....but move enough air to fill a football stadium in 10 seconds....lol...others can push air into 7x atmospheres....Diesel engines are a prime example of this use. Some pulling trucks make 100+psi of boost and turn 3500rpm max...LOL...insane!....and they use compound compressors to achieve these elevated pressures. On the other hand a Top Fuel motor's blower runs into the 45psi range but the motor is getting to 8500rpm...both extreme examples of each type of compressor...but the Turbo is applied to achieve ultra high boost compared to the supercharger....and the parasitics at these levels can be astonishing....with the Top Fuel motor taking a 900hp hit to spin its "Iron Lung" ....

.....on the lesser more realistic and practical end of the spectrum, there are some interesting qualities for each as well. With a smaller compressor on board...the turbo can achieve efficiency quickly with little or no lag noticed...but will quickly expose its limits as the motor swallows the air on its way down the track...which can be tolerable in less power demanding scenarios...the Supercharger will continue to build power in a linear fashion directly proportional to engine speed. This can be great for on/off throttle events....but believe it or not...the smaller Turbo will develop more low-end power with Load present. There is a fine line in finding the sweet spot for your individual needs...but careful analysis of your vehicles purpose/needs could prevent you from choosing the wrong avenue to follow.... either way...positive pressure is positively fun!

-Jack

BillyGoatGag · 07-11-2009, 07:08 AM

This is a fantastic writeup, although it is a bit on the length(y) side.

Would you like some help with the abridged version?

-Clay

LUVZTTZ · 08-07-2009, 01:44 PM

I wouldn't call it "length(y)". I'd call it thorough.

Nice work. One question that you may or may not know the answer to--are the Stillen supercharger performance numbers for a Stage I or II?

FuszNissan · 08-07-2009, 01:51 PM

+ Rep! Great insight!

Quiet1NJ · 10-15-2009, 08:46 PM

Thanks for the write-up on F/I.... I read it over and over (yea, I'm a noobs...). I learned a lot.

Much Thanks, again.

avitech · 11-17-2009, 10:23 PM

This all sounds pretty incredible. 332 horsepower it more than plenty of horsepower for me. And to think that it is all naturally aspirated to insure longevity. But hey, it's a free country. Different strokes for different folks.

In my humble opinion as long as it's not the little boy racer graphics or skater stickers on the paint job then it is all good.

z350boy · 03-14-2010, 02:08 PM

Haven't there been issues with some of the sleeved DE engines??? What if any drawbacks are there to a sleeved engine??

1slow370 · 04-15-2010, 06:32 AM

sleeving an engine can cause problems if they aren't taken care of properly. If the machinist that modifies the block doesn't hold his tolerances correctly there can be misalignment between the pistons and the crank, in the case of the darton sleeves, the cylinders may actually move around if it isn't machined correctly, the head may have trouble sealing, the difference in heat dissipation can cause hotspots to form because the iron sleeve won't shed heat like the aluminum block would have, and if you are using a forged aluminum piston in an iron sleeve but aren't running enough clearance the piston can out-expand the cylinder and seize it's self tight in the block (you have to pretend the whole block is iron and run appropriate clearances). So basically if you fork out the cash and have the block sleeved correctly by a reputable shop that has done it before and they don't make any mistakes then you're good assuming the sleeve was designed to work in the block, and dissipate heat correctly.

Think of it this way to my knowledge every single commercial semi truck has a sleeved block and they run for over 300,000 miles with over 20:1 compression ratio's often making well over a 1000 ft/lbs of torque.

Andyy · 03-13-2011, 04:00 PM

How much power can the automatic transmission on the 2011 370z handle?

1slow370 · 03-13-2011, 07:43 PM

well a few guys have blown them up rompin around the 400 mark for a while think GTM is starting to do some work on it but they busy as hell, stage2 supercharger, gtr manifold kit, white dragon, vvel tuning, and regular shop business all at once over there

tower74 · 01-10-2012, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andyy

How much power can the automatic transmission on the 2011 370z handle?

I'm putting 440-450hp+ on my at7 right now. Haven't really had an issue so far but probably going to tear out the system and trade my z in for another but manual this time. I've looked for upgrades for it but haven't really found anything since most people FI or SC manuals.

KillerBee370 · 05-23-2011, 09:15 PM

I believe the Stillen SC is sentrifugal not a roots type.

1slow370 · 05-24-2011, 03:59 AM

his information on the kits is only applicable to the 350z engines and the stillen 350z kit was roots. the 370 kit is a vortech centrifugal

05-19-2009, 12:45 AM	#2 (permalink)
Slidefox Previous Moderator Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,534 Drives: A Pony Rep Power: 214	^^ Grammar Police __________________ Forum Rules: Click Here Before Posting Click Here to Become a Premium Member Go Turbo or Go Home!!//Cowboys 2012 Superbowl Champs// Suns 2012 NBA Champions

06-15-2009, 03:59 PM	#3 (permalink)
HP Logic The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Wellington, FL Posts: 51 Drives: 1993 mazda rx7 5spd Rep Power: 218	The world of Turbo Vs. Supercharger is sometimes tough to realize....the truth is...when making power there are many ways to apply it. Some engines are low reving torque monsters and some rev to infinity....some cars are driven in varying situations...others live in a narrow powerband....and the same goes for turbos and superchargers...some compressors make very little boost....but move enough air to fill a football stadium in 10 seconds....lol...others can push air into 7x atmospheres....Diesel engines are a prime example of this use. Some pulling trucks make 100+psi of boost and turn 3500rpm max...LOL...insane!....and they use compound compressors to achieve these elevated pressures. On the other hand a Top Fuel motor's blower runs into the 45psi range but the motor is getting to 8500rpm...both extreme examples of each type of compressor...but the Turbo is applied to achieve ultra high boost compared to the supercharger....and the parasitics at these levels can be astonishing....with the Top Fuel motor taking a 900hp hit to spin its "Iron Lung" .... .....on the lesser more realistic and practical end of the spectrum, there are some interesting qualities for each as well. With a smaller compressor on board...the turbo can achieve efficiency quickly with little or no lag noticed...but will quickly expose its limits as the motor swallows the air on its way down the track...which can be tolerable in less power demanding scenarios...the Supercharger will continue to build power in a linear fashion directly proportional to engine speed. This can be great for on/off throttle events....but believe it or not...the smaller Turbo will develop more low-end power with Load present. There is a fine line in finding the sweet spot for your individual needs...but careful analysis of your vehicles purpose/needs could prevent you from choosing the wrong avenue to follow.... either way...positive pressure is positively fun! -Jack __________________ http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3..._Sig_02-01.jpg Jack Cecil HorsepowerLogic.com

07-11-2009, 07:08 AM	#4 (permalink)
BillyGoatGag Base Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Trier, Germany Posts: 31 Drives: 90 Z32 TT Rep Power: 17	This is a fantastic writeup, although it is a bit on the length(y) side. Would you like some help with the abridged version? -Clay __________________ Life lovin', bass thumpin', fist pumpin', frisbee flickin', pool shootin', beer drinkin', chain smokin' S.O.B. Last edited by BillyGoatGag; 07-11-2009 at 07:08 AM. Reason: Typo!

08-07-2009, 01:51 PM	#6 (permalink)
FuszNissan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: St. Louis Posts: 14,275 Drives: Pure Sex Rep Power: 543	+ Rep! Great insight! __________________ Mods: Too Many to list! LouFuszNissan ZDAYZ 2012

11-17-2009, 10:23 PM	#8 (permalink)
avitech Base Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: So.Cal. Posts: 95 Drives: 82Mercedes-Benz300SD Rep Power: 16	This all sounds pretty incredible. 332 horsepower it more than plenty of horsepower for me. And to think that it is all naturally aspirated to insure longevity. But hey, it's a free country. Different strokes for different folks. In my humble opinion as long as it's not the little boy racer graphics or skater stickers on the paint job then it is all good. Last edited by avitech; 11-18-2009 at 01:22 PM.

04-28-2009, 06:14 PM	#1 (permalink)
shabarivas A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 2,188 Drives: 370z MB 6mt Rep Power: 915	Awesome thread!! But... under superchargers you say FWHP and not RWHP

08-07-2009, 01:44 PM	#5 (permalink)
LUVZTTZ Base Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: St Louis, MO Posts: 57 Drives: Black 91 TT Rep Power: 17	I wouldn't call it "length(y)". I'd call it thorough. Nice work. One question that you may or may not know the answer to--are the Stillen supercharger performance numbers for a Stage I or II?

10-15-2009, 08:46 PM	#7 (permalink)
Quiet1NJ Base Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: North Jersey Posts: 4 Drives: Future 370Z Rep Power: 16	Thanks for the write-up on F/I.... I read it over and over (yea, I'm a noobs...). I learned a lot. Much Thanks, again.

03-14-2010, 02:08 PM	#9 (permalink)
z350boy Base Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: East Coast Posts: 100 Drives: '05 Enthusiast Rep Power: 17	Haven't there been issues with some of the sleeved DE engines??? What if any drawbacks are there to a sleeved engine??

04-15-2010, 06:32 AM	#10 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7252	sleeving an engine can cause problems if they aren't taken care of properly. If the machinist that modifies the block doesn't hold his tolerances correctly there can be misalignment between the pistons and the crank, in the case of the darton sleeves, the cylinders may actually move around if it isn't machined correctly, the head may have trouble sealing, the difference in heat dissipation can cause hotspots to form because the iron sleeve won't shed heat like the aluminum block would have, and if you are using a forged aluminum piston in an iron sleeve but aren't running enough clearance the piston can out-expand the cylinder and seize it's self tight in the block (you have to pretend the whole block is iron and run appropriate clearances). So basically if you fork out the cash and have the block sleeved correctly by a reputable shop that has done it before and they don't make any mistakes then you're good assuming the sleeve was designed to work in the block, and dissipate heat correctly. Think of it this way to my knowledge every single commercial semi truck has a sleeved block and they run for over 300,000 miles with over 20:1 compression ratio's often making well over a 1000 ft/lbs of torque. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

03-13-2011, 04:00 PM	#11 (permalink)
Andyy Base Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Dallas Posts: 47 Drives: 2011-370z-Silver-7AT Rep Power: 15	How much power can the automatic transmission on the 2011 370z handle?

03-13-2011, 07:43 PM	#12 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7252	well a few guys have blown them up rompin around the 400 mark for a while think GTM is starting to do some work on it but they busy as hell, stage2 supercharger, gtr manifold kit, white dragon, vvel tuning, and regular shop business all at once over there __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

05-23-2011, 09:15 PM	#14 (permalink)
KillerBee370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: So Cal baby! Age: 52 Posts: 5,964 Drives: with passion Rep Power: 322	I believe the Stillen SC is sentrifugal not a roots type.

05-24-2011, 03:59 AM	#15 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7252	his information on the kits is only applicable to the 350z engines and the stillen 350z kit was roots. the 370 kit is a vortech centrifugal __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50