Cobb vs UpRev

t-ray · 07-15-2009, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

Those statements may be true based on the products they've released for other cars, but as it pertains to the 370Z, until their stuff is released, it's vaporware. Don't get me wrong, I've heard nothing but good things about UpRev and have high expectations for their 370Z software. Heck, there's a good chance that I'll end up going with them. But coming out and claiming that your stuff is better than the other guys before you've even finished with development just seems kinda cocky to me. To be honest, it's a bit of a turnoff. Also, I believe the forum rules state that one needs to be a forum sponsor if he wants to push his products on the forum.

Technically, the product isn't out yet, so I don't know if he's violating rules or not.

I love the potential offered by the product, even though I'm not an owner. However, as much as I love what I have read about the product, I'm not too fond of the company.

** Edit -
Another benefit of UpRev not posting as a sponsor - we can discuss things objectively without the poster getting all butthurt and threatening to have threads pulled/edited/closed by throwing around sponsorship weight.

On another forum I suggested that UpRev make Cipher open source, and still charge for the cable. Or at least open up the software to other developers with a core api. There are some awesome things the community could build if we had that low-level api already done for us. But the reaction was a typical knee-jerk "but we're in business to make money" response. That's a typical response from some one that is not in the software business. People in the software business have figured out how to still make money while giving certain things away for free decades ago.

My issue wasn't with the company's response. It was the tone and verbiage used; I was insulted. I speak to my 12 year old son with more respect than was present in the response I received from UpRev. That cost them a customer. That's the primary reason I haven't ditched the utec and gone the full Osiris+Cipher route.

wstar · 07-15-2009, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

Those statements may be true based on the products they've released for other cars, but as it pertains to the 370Z, until their stuff is released, it's vaporware. Don't get me wrong, I've heard nothing but good things about UpRev and have high expectations for their 370Z software. Heck, there's a good chance that I'll end up going with them. But coming out and claiming that your stuff is better than the other guys before you've even finished with development just seems kinda cocky to me. To be honest, it's a bit of a turnoff. Also, I believe the forum rules state that one needs to be a forum sponsor if he wants to push his products on the forum.

It's really hard work, I work on similar stuff professionally, just not for cars. Their various statements about superiority are based on the fact that they're taking an entirely different approach to the problem than other vendors. Their approach is a lot more difficult to pull off from a technical perspective, but it does in result in a completely different level of control. It's not like other parts, like an exhaust, where nobody really knows how two things will stack up until it hits the dyno. They already know their approach is superior if more difficult to accomplish.

As far as vaporware status: they've clearly (1) already done this for previous-gen Nissan cars and released it, and (2) already done all the hard parts for this car, as it has been used privately for TT tuning of a VQ37VHR already. They're just still polishing up the loose ends before they release it to the public.

Scribe · 07-15-2009, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uprev

We offer it both ways. The Pro Tuner can tune it for you, or if you want to tune it yourself you can buy that system also. We're far more flexible in our offerings than other companies also. That tends to be somewhat confusing to people as they aren't use to having choices. But it works for us.

Some people will buy the Osiris Tuner so they can adjust their car, but they will have a Pro Tuner set up the original tune on it. That way they can adjust their car for different tracks etc. They have the software available in the event something happens also. We have a tone of SCCA and NASA teams that use our software, and if a motor dies between events and they need to replace it, they will need to adjust that tune. Sometimes they don't have time to get a full new dyno tune between events, and we're their saving grace.

Other customers just want their car to run right, they don't care about having Cipher for data logging or diagnostics. They can go to a Pro Tuner, buy an Osiris License and a tune and be done. By far the cheapest solution on the market for that customer.

Also our system is upgradeable. Start with the Osiris License and a tune because thats what your budget allows, then add the Cipher at a later date. You can upgrade to Osiris Tuner even if you'd like.

I don't want to totally highjack this thread, but want to take the talk about the posabilities of the stock ecu with Uprev.

Uprev sounds a lot like DSMLink from when I when I had my GSXes. It turns the stock ECU into a kind of 'standalone' unit, allowing you to monitor everything and alter a lot of things that the ECU can.

Uprev apparently can handle forced induction, but I'm wondering about overwriting the tables for a VK50 swap. Any input on whether your software would allow the stock VQ37 tables to be overwritten to allow someone to maintain the stock ECU with a modified wiring harness? The other option is to use the VK50 ECU for the engine and VQ37 ECU for the chasis, or try and modify the chasis harness to work with the FX50 ECU, either of which is acceptable, but not ideal. I'm also looking at a 'full standalone' option.

Togo · 07-05-2009, 07:47 PM

I suspect the guys at Forged would have mentioned that they could make more power on UpRev vs the Cobb if it were true.

Anyone know if either UpRev or Cobb can raise the Rev Limiter? 8K+ Rev Limit on a car seems like it would be fun. Although I'm used to my 15.5k Rev Limit, hahahah

import111 · 07-05-2009, 07:52 PM

You're right, there will be no performance difference between them if there is a dyno tune done. However, if Cobb does the same on the 370 as they did with the STi/Evo, you will be able to see A/F ratio, Coolant temps, 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, ect., along with lots of base maps, like economy mode, valet mode, race gas map, pump gas map, ect. Cobb was able to do all that on WRX's/STi's/Evo's, so I would imagine it will be the same with the 370Z.

Maybe UPREV and the others can do this stuff too, idk.

theDreamer · 07-05-2009, 07:56 PM

Togo, rev limiters, MPH limiters, and others are all built into the ECU and any simple tuner (canned or not) should be able to remove them if they know what they are doing. That is if you want them removed. Also, upRev also has Valet tunes and let you change tunes on the go with the cruise control buttons I believe.

semtex · 07-05-2009, 07:57 PM

Well, I just sent a note to Sharif to confirm that gains will be the same on both tools. I'll let you guys know what he says. Or maybe he'll find this thread and chime in. Also, if you look at Cobb's webpage for the 370Z, it looks like you get all those goodies like valet map, anti-theft map, etc. CobbTuning.com - '09 370Z AccessPORT

Togo · 07-05-2009, 07:58 PM

@theDreamer - Tune changes on the fly with CC buttons is sweetness! Thats beyond sweetness, it's sweetesque!

Don't mind me, I'm easily amused...

theDreamer · 07-05-2009, 08:00 PM

In the end I believe most tunes are really all going to be the same if you get a dyno tune (Uprev or Cobb). Each might have an "extra" feature that you like, but really it comes down to which one you can get best access to with the best support. Uprev is in Austin and I can easily drive to them and have them look at my car and such. I bet Sharif will do a great job with Semtex's car with Cobb.

Togo · 07-05-2009, 08:02 PM

Would it be possible to get the Live Data function of the Cobb unit displayed onto a dedicated screen or the Navi screen, kinda like Magden or HKS Camp II?

theDreamer · 07-05-2009, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Togo

Would it be possible to get the Live Data function of the Cobb unit displayed onto a dedicated screen or the Navi screen, kinda like Magden or HKS Camp II?

Depends on how the data is transferred and how quickly it reads it (delay?). The data might log every second but it might not be able to display it in real time which would make it useless, though I am completely unsure.

RCZ · 07-05-2009, 08:52 PM

From what I've heard, the AP doesnt have the same features for the Z as it does for Evos and STIs. It seems that the tuning software of choice for the Z world is Osiris from UpRev...

As far as suggesting that the average folk tune their own car... I would 100% advice against it. If you dont know exactly what you are doing, have someone who does tune your car...

Specially so in the Z, since it seems to have two maps overlayed rather than just one like we are used to...I'm scheduled for a tune as soon as it comes out, I will let you all know how it goes.

t-ray · 07-05-2009, 09:25 PM

Osiris offers a valet mode as well. In fact, at least one g35 owner used the valet mode as a form of a two-step for launching at the drag strip. He basically selected the valet map, which I believe limited his revs to like 3k rpms, then when he launched, he selected the performance map. Viola! Two-step.

Another benefit from the UpRev offering is the Cipher software. Unbelievable software; you can log practically every sensor on the canbus** (not "literally" every sensor).

Also, just from observing the two product offerings on the g35/350z platform, I would suggest that over time/into the future, the Osiris product will offer more tuning parameters. I don't know if Osiris will ever allow for tuning the VVEL system, but if either company ever offers such functionality, it will likely be UpRev and not Cobb.

NIZMOZ · 07-06-2009, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t-ray

Osiris offers a valet mode as well. In fact, at least one g35 owner used the valet mode as a form of a two-step for launching at the drag strip. He basically selected the valet map, which I believe limited his revs to like 3k rpms, then when he launched, he selected the performance map. Viola! Two-step.

Another benefit from the UpRev offering is the Cipher software. Unbelievable software; you can log practically every sensor on the canbus** (not "literally" every sensor).

Also, just from observing the two product offerings on the g35/350z platform, I would suggest that over time/into the future, the Osiris product will offer more tuning parameters. I don't know if Osiris will ever allow for tuning the VVEL system, but if either company ever offers such functionality, it will likely be UpRev and not Cobb.

They are working on completing the software but the VVEL system is adjustable in the UPREV tune last I heard.

http://my350 z.com/forum/tuning/422156-cobb-tuning-vs-osiris-tuning.html

Uprev/Osiris/Cipher is a real tune from real people, not a pre-programmed gameboy. Also you get a copy of Cipher which pays for itself after the tune, its a complete diagnostic program for Nissan cars.

NIZMOZ · 07-06-2009, 08:29 AM

http://my350 z .com/forum/nismo-350z/437479-cobbtuning-anyone.html

http://my350 z .com/forum/vq35hr/434254-cobb-tune-or-uprev-on-08-hr.html

Many other posts to read about, just some examples.

07-05-2009, 07:56 PM	#6 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4212	Togo, rev limiters, MPH limiters, and others are all built into the ECU and any simple tuner (canned or not) should be able to remove them if they know what they are doing. That is if you want them removed. Also, upRev also has Valet tunes and let you change tunes on the go with the cruise control buttons I believe. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

07-05-2009, 07:57 PM	#7 (permalink)
semtex A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Behind enemy lines Age: 55 Posts: 5,995 Drives: People to drink Rep Power: 34	Well, I just sent a note to Sharif to confirm that gains will be the same on both tools. I'll let you guys know what he says. Or maybe he'll find this thread and chime in. Also, if you look at Cobb's webpage for the 370Z, it looks like you get all those goodies like valet map, anti-theft map, etc. CobbTuning.com - '09 370Z AccessPORT __________________ "There are no small accidents on this circuit." -- Ayrton Senna 316.8whp & 248 ft/lbs (Dyno Dynamics) \| 319whp & 256 ft/lbs (DynoJet) (04/23/10) Stillen G3 CAI, CBE, Pulley / F.I. LTH / GTSpec Ladder Brace / Setrab Oil Cooler / UpRev-tuned by Forged Perf.

07-05-2009, 08:00 PM	#9 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4212	In the end I believe most tunes are really all going to be the same if you get a dyno tune (Uprev or Cobb). Each might have an "extra" feature that you like, but really it comes down to which one you can get best access to with the best support. Uprev is in Austin and I can easily drive to them and have them look at my car and such. I bet Sharif will do a great job with Semtex's car with Cobb. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram

07-06-2009, 08:29 AM	#15 (permalink)
NIZMOZ Track Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 634 Drives: 07 NISMO 350Z SA M6 Rep Power: 492	http://my350 z .com/forum/nismo-350z/437479-cobbtuning-anyone.html http://my350 z .com/forum/vq35hr/434254-cobb-tune-or-uprev-on-08-hr.html Many other posts to read about, just some examples. __________________ SOLD: 2007 NISMO 350Z #0044 Silver Alloy New DD: 2010 Titan Pro4X CC

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Switch to Linear Mode Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

07-05-2009, 07:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
Togo A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: E. Northport, NY Posts: 7,597 Drives: Stuff Rep Power: 659	I suspect the guys at Forged would have mentioned that they could make more power on UpRev vs the Cobb if it were true. Anyone know if either UpRev or Cobb can raise the Rev Limiter? 8K+ Rev Limit on a car seems like it would be fun. Although I'm used to my 15.5k Rev Limit, hahahah

07-05-2009, 07:52 PM	#5 (permalink)
import111 Track Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ. Posts: 622 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 193	You're right, there will be no performance difference between them if there is a dyno tune done. However, if Cobb does the same on the 370 as they did with the STi/Evo, you will be able to see A/F ratio, Coolant temps, 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, ect., along with lots of base maps, like economy mode, valet mode, race gas map, pump gas map, ect. Cobb was able to do all that on WRX's/STi's/Evo's, so I would imagine it will be the same with the 370Z. Maybe UPREV and the others can do this stuff too, idk.

07-05-2009, 07:58 PM	#8 (permalink)
Togo A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: E. Northport, NY Posts: 7,597 Drives: Stuff Rep Power: 659	@theDreamer - Tune changes on the fly with CC buttons is sweetness! Thats beyond sweetness, it's sweetesque! Don't mind me, I'm easily amused...

07-05-2009, 08:02 PM	#10 (permalink)
Togo A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2009 Location: E. Northport, NY Posts: 7,597 Drives: Stuff Rep Power: 659	Would it be possible to get the Live Data function of the Cobb unit displayed onto a dedicated screen or the Navi screen, kinda like Magden or HKS Camp II?

07-05-2009, 08:52 PM	#12 (permalink)
RCZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 6,403 Drives: '09 370Z Rep Power: 1120	From what I've heard, the AP doesnt have the same features for the Z as it does for Evos and STIs. It seems that the tuning software of choice for the Z world is Osiris from UpRev... As far as suggesting that the average folk tune their own car... I would 100% advice against it. If you dont know exactly what you are doing, have someone who does tune your car... Specially so in the Z, since it seems to have two maps overlayed rather than just one like we are used to...I'm scheduled for a tune as soon as it comes out, I will let you all know how it goes.

07-05-2009, 09:25 PM	#13 (permalink)
t-ray Base Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: bham al Posts: 91 Drives: 05 g sedan 6mt Rep Power: 18	Osiris offers a valet mode as well. In fact, at least one g35 owner used the valet mode as a form of a two-step for launching at the drag strip. He basically selected the valet map, which I believe limited his revs to like 3k rpms, then when he launched, he selected the performance map. Viola! Two-step. Another benefit from the UpRev offering is the Cipher software. Unbelievable software; you can log practically every sensor on the canbus** (not "literally" every sensor). Also, just from observing the two product offerings on the g35/350z platform, I would suggest that over time/into the future, the Osiris product will offer more tuning parameters. I don't know if Osiris will ever allow for tuning the VVEL system, but if either company ever offers such functionality, it will likely be UpRev and not Cobb.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
COBB AP Tune for the G37	kdo2milger	Tuning	3	09-18-2010 05:47 AM
UpRev development status	semtex	Tuning	12	07-13-2009 11:34 AM
Cobb G37 AccesPort	Endgame	Tuning	74	07-05-2009 01:34 AM