Is anyone trying to unlock tuning the VVEL?

wstar · 10-19-2011, 09:42 AM

Pic of Service Manual page that shows the adjustment bolts:

The Dimer · 10-19-2011, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Doing an NA build, then going FI makes no sense. You are going to build the motor differently.

Almost everyone seems to be running FI kits on the stock 11:1 motors right now. So while it wouldn't necessarily be the optimal setup for FI, it should still be a feasible option.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

I do not understand the desire to run a huge v6 either. I would not want to be dealing with a massive, unbalanced engine, but that's just me.

Would balancing the engine not be something that was done when putting it together?

Red__Zed · 10-19-2011, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dimer

Almost everyone seems to be running FI kits on the stock 11:1 motors right now. So while it wouldn't necessarily be the optimal setup for FI, it should still be a feasible option.

Would balancing the engine not be something that was done when putting it together?

I mean, you can. It's just if i am dropping that much building the motor...hell, even just that time...i am gonna build it up for my end goal.

V6 motors are inherently unbalanced.

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 10:25 AM

Thats pretty cool!

It seems like a case of removing the rocker cover, manually locking the arms to max lift and turning the crank over by hand to see if theres any P2V contact...

Ron · 10-19-2011, 10:35 AM

^^ Go try it and let us know

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron

^^ Go try it and let us know

You first

wstar · 10-19-2011, 10:46 AM

I would *guess* that the factory lift spec for the adjuster is so they can have reasonable mfg tolerances. e.g. some of the VVEL units mfg'd will have slightly different physical limits, but the factory spec is something that all VVEL units can be adjusted to at the factory with those bolts. You might find that some engines have more leftover room on the adjust than others (or even different on the two sides of one engine, and you really want them to match up perfectly). Still, even assuming most engines have some usable adjustment headroom on both sides and you could adjust them perfectly in sync with each other, and it doesn't cause physical contact, you're left with question marks about whether the stock ECU can deal with that safely, and/or what (possibly unknown) tuneables to tweak there to make it work right).

pulpmelon_Z · 10-19-2011, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

I would *guess* that the factory lift spec for the adjuster is so they can have reasonable mfg tolerances. e.g. some of the VVEL units mfg'd will have slightly different physical limits, but the factory spec is something that all VVEL units can be adjusted to at the factory with those bolts. You might find that some engines have more leftover room on the adjust than others (or even different on the two sides of one engine, and you really want them to match up perfectly). Still, even assuming most engines have some usable adjustment headroom on both sides and you could adjust them perfectly in sync with each other, and it doesn't cause physical contact, you're left with question marks about whether the stock ECU can deal with that safely, and/or what (possibly unknown) tuneables to tweak there to make it work right).

I think coping with the new angle and lift induced by manual adjustment would need another cam angle table in aftermarket software.

The Dimer · 10-19-2011, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulpmelon_Z

Thats pretty cool!

It seems like a case of removing the rocker cover, manually locking the arms to max lift and turning the crank over by hand to see if theres any P2V contact...

I'm all about P2V contact.

Jordo! · 10-19-2011, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

I would *guess* that the factory lift spec for the adjuster is so they can have reasonable mfg tolerances. e.g. some of the VVEL units mfg'd will have slightly different physical limits, but the factory spec is something that all VVEL units can be adjusted to at the factory with those bolts. You might find that some engines have more leftover room on the adjust than others (or even different on the two sides of one engine, and you really want them to match up perfectly). Still, even assuming most engines have some usable adjustment headroom on both sides and you could adjust them perfectly in sync with each other, and it doesn't cause physical contact, you're left with question marks about whether the stock ECU can deal with that safely, and/or what (possibly unknown) tuneables to tweak there to make it work right).

I guess the big question is how loose are things set up? If that extra potential lift that isn't being used is there to aovid problems due to potential valve float at high revs maybe it's best left alone...

It just seems really surprising to me that with better flowing intake and exhaust components that VVEL tuning wouldn't be advantageous, but data trumps theory so...

I'd really like to know more details about what kinds of tests and adjustments were done before the conclusion "not worth it" was determined

pulpmelon_Z · 10-20-2011, 04:49 AM

I agree, providing you have piston clearance plus another table for the 'extended' cam opening in terms of fueling and ignition. I dont see how another 0.025" of lift and 5 degress of duration wouldnt make power on a bolt-on equiped Z

Looking at a bunch of I/H/E dynos generally shows everyone running out of puff around 7k RPM, unless the exhaust cam is the limiting factor thats where the additional lift should help out.

pulpmelon_Z · 10-20-2011, 05:34 AM

Hope this isnt a repost!

Jordo! · 02-09-2012, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulpmelon_Z

Hope this isnt a repost!

.

NYBladeZ · 02-09-2012, 09:50 AM

Not holding my breath for someone to crack VVEL but I hope someone does it. It looks like it will need both a hardware adjustment and separate ecu tuning.

7419sundat · 08-23-2012, 08:53 PM

Revive, but I'd like to know if anyone has messed with this adjusting screw for intake lift. Or would it not work at all?

10-19-2011, 09:42 AM	#106 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	Pic of Service Manual page that shows the adjustment bolts: __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

10-19-2011, 10:46 AM	#112 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	I would guess that the factory lift spec for the adjuster is so they can have reasonable mfg tolerances. e.g. some of the VVEL units mfg'd will have slightly different physical limits, but the factory spec is something that all VVEL units can be adjusted to at the factory with those bolts. You might find that some engines have more leftover room on the adjust than others (or even different on the two sides of one engine, and you really want them to match up perfectly). Still, even assuming most engines have some usable adjustment headroom on both sides and you could adjust them perfectly in sync with each other, and it doesn't cause physical contact, you're left with question marks about whether the stock ECU can deal with that safely, and/or what (possibly unknown) tuneables to tweak there to make it work right). __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

10-20-2011, 04:49 AM	#116 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 13	I agree, providing you have piston clearance plus another table for the 'extended' cam opening in terms of fueling and ignition. I dont see how another 0.025" of lift and 5 degress of duration wouldnt make power on a bolt-on equiped Z Looking at a bunch of I/H/E dynos generally shows everyone running out of puff around 7k RPM, unless the exhaust cam is the limiting factor thats where the additional lift should help out. Last edited by pulpmelon_Z; 10-28-2011 at 05:20 AM.

10-20-2011, 05:34 AM	#117 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 13	Hope this isnt a repost! UNKNOWN_370 likes this. Last edited by pulpmelon_Z; 10-20-2011 at 01:08 PM.

02-09-2012, 09:50 AM	#119 (permalink)
NYBladeZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: New York Posts: 2,158 Drives: Lotus Exige S Rep Power: 20	Not holding my breath for someone to crack VVEL but I hope someone does it. It looks like it will need both a hardware adjustment and separate ecu tuning. __________________ 2009 Carbon Fiber/Red 370z aka Trish: Sports Package, Meisterschaft full catback, Fast Intentions Longtube Headers, Injen Long Tube Intakes, UpRev Tune: Sold 2008 Lotus Exige S Club Racer aka Bella, always leaves me smiling

10-19-2011, 10:25 AM	#109 (permalink)
pulpmelon_Z Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: UK Posts: 23 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 13	Thats pretty cool! It seems like a case of removing the rocker cover, manually locking the arms to max lift and turning the crank over by hand to see if theres any P2V contact...

10-19-2011, 10:35 AM	#110 (permalink)
Ron A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 3,009 Drives: TT '11 PW Nismo #113 Rep Power: 21	^^ Go try it and let us know

08-23-2012, 08:53 PM	#120 (permalink)
7419sundat Base Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: colorado Posts: 145 Drives: 09 370z Gtm TT 2 Rep Power: 13	Revive, but I'd like to know if anyone has messed with this adjusting screw for intake lift. Or would it not work at all?

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