My gf and I have this argument at least every ten days. They always win that one since we value silence more than they do. "If I take you to the place you like will you stfu about it already? Yes? Then get in the ******* car." :rofl2:

Well the night was interesting, but short. We did have a good talk, but there was so much to talk about I couldn't quite organize my thoughts or even finish them without getting interrupted. After leaving the restaurant she hugged me a couple of times, thanked me, but she wanted to go home to sleep. She showed interest to meet up again and told me to just let her know. Once I got home I broke the rules by making a courtesy call to make sure she made it home alright and to finish an important thought. She thanked me again for dinner, had a great night, and that she felt comfortable talking to me. She also reiterated about hanging out again soon be it tomorrow night at the club or this weekend.

Overall the night was okay. She's full of positive energy and is highly social (more than me). Needs more time...

It sounds like you had fun, but you both should be ecstatic about this. If she felt chemistry between you two, she would have said f' it and stayed out anyways, drink coffee, something...

Also, saying she wants to hang out again and making plans to hang out again are two different things. Too little too late, but just dinner wasn't really the best plan for a first date. It's not enough time to know someone and too many distractions associated with eating food. You're also facing each other like you're on an interview the whole time instead of spending time side by side. It's a strange minutia of body language interpretation, but it could mean the difference between being comfortable and being totally turned off.

You also have to be honest with yourself and ask if you're really into her.
...and awwwwww....dude!! You never call her right after just seeing her.

I apologize if I sound negative, but there's still a shot with girl if you play your cards right. My advise (and you can totally ignore it).... is to give it at least two days before you call her again...so Saturday at the earliest. Talk on the phone about all the thoughts you wanted to get out there. Phone dates can be just as constructive as dinner dates so treat it as such.

Watch "Swingers"

The interruptions stemmed from briefly interrupting herself once to text someone, seeing friends coming in and getting up to chat with them (before ordering food and after dinner), and the lengthy conversation with the server. I gotta hand it to her though. She doesn't go off initiating hugs with everyone, and she hugged me quite a bit before and after the date. She's very charismatic, and one would probably describe her as a social butterfly.

I have a hunch she's the type that would be out and socializing with lots of people at the club. I don't get the vibe that she's out looking for guys since they're the ones chasing and creeping on her, but she seems to enjoy socializing with people. At this stage, if I were to see her I'd just hug if she initiates, get her a drink, quick chat, and just let her do her thing.

Agreed. I think she's giving me more time and opportunities. Personally, the challenge is not entirely about her, but it's for me to figure out how to make the right moves, be myself, and stay confident.

Not for nothing, but a hug is not exactly what you want...is it? Be honest here. If you're attracted to her, your goal at the end of the date is, at the very least, a real kiss. Don't sell yourself short and settle for a long hug. Unless she's grabbing your junk, the hug means "friend-zone." Don't let that happen. You gotta make your intentions clear and go for it. As for confidence, you're already there bro. She agreed to go on a date with you for a reason so you're half way there. Most women are insecure about themselves and she's probably wondering about the same things you are.

Yep. Most guys get friendzoned because they're wishy-washy about their intentions. If there is a second date of any type, kiss her. If she doesn't go for it, she's gone.

Hmm... she asked me about the club tonight, which is probably not the best idea to do that. So far no plans for Friday and Saturday. I do plan to take it further the next time I see her.

Why not?

Glad you're making progress!

[shrugs] I'm assuming she's going to be surrounded and see how I'd handle it if I'm there? I might gather up some good wingmen. Another challenge, indeed. Haha.

Might as well. What's the worst that could happen?

That's true. So this sounds like a test: Approaching her when she's surrounded and figure out how to avoid getting FZ'd.

Hell yeah you go, but you're missing the point here. You don't need to over think it. She asked YOU out and will likely go as a pair correct? She's giving you another shot. Skating pretty close to friend-zone territory though if you don't make a move.

Dude, getting friendzoned isn't like stepping in a puddle walking down the street. It doesn't just happen because you're not paying attention. Just make your intentions clear. If you want to date her, make sure you get that point across. If you want to go to the club with her, go. If not, don't. Go have some drinks and dance with her. It's not a test to see how you deal with her being surrounded.

She's just a chick. She's not setting up tests or challenges to see if you pass, she wants to go dancing. You're not being evaluated any more than you're evaluating her. I think a lot of people's problems with women come from dramatically overthinking things.

We were typing pretty much the same thing at the same time.

To expand- getting friendzoned is not something that happens as a result of your actions. It's a result of inaction. If you go out with her again, kiss her. It's that simple.

No, I believe we're meeting up since it was a general "Are you going to be there?"

You're right, the over thinking and putting her on the pedestal mentality is bad. That's not my intention. My nerves are calm now... just figuring out the correct approach and not make the same mistakes.

I hope you guys don't mind me jumping in: I'm relatively new to the forum and just discovered this thread. I've read the whole thing, though, and am pulling for ya DIGI!

I'm 42 and single, and I'm also a chick...a fat chick who is picky and old (in dating years). Women can be one or two of those things, but not all three. ;)

(I look 30 and am cute enough to still get laid if/when I want to, so I'm really not complaining. As others have mentioned, there are lots of great things about being single with no kids. Having a Z as my daily driver is one of them. :D Sure in a perfect world I'd prefer not to be alone, but for the most part I like my life. I'm also not trying very hard to meet anyone right now: e.g., I have an OKCupid profile, but I hardly ever go to the site.)

I hear this all the time, but I don't necessarily agree: the key is to see the movie before you go for dinner/coffee, so that you can talk about it. Having a movie to discuss can be a great way to break the ice with someone new and get the conversational ball rolling, plus sometimes you can discover a lot about people based on how they react to stuff in movies.

Girls might prefer that, but women don't mind pulling their weight/having some input. ;)

Truth.

More truth.

Just do whatever you want to do. If you feel like going to a club, go. Personally, I despise clubs. In your situation, I would get some buddies and go to an acceptable bar close to the club she's going to. That way, you can avoid the club but still tell her "I'm right around the corner at X. Come have a drink with me before/after you go to the club".

You've hedged your bet for a good night. If she shows up, great. If not, you're at a bar with some buddies shooting the ****. Also, you've made her come to you. That will show you if she's interested or not. If she can't be bothered, That tells you something.

The more female input in here the better as far as I'm concerned.

Although I see your point, I'm gonna disagree only because that's never the case unless you're still in high school. A movie you both just saw is never a great ice breaker. You spent 2 hours just watching it, no one really wants to talk about it right after seeing it. It's boring conversation just thinking about it. This is why something like an art gallery or another activity is so much better. You talk while doing said activity. If women could imagine a perfect date, I seriously doubt going to the movies on the first date is one of them. Sure there are exceptions, but they're exceptions for a reason. I'd be creeped out if you were staring at me and watching my reactions during a movie on a first date.

Gonna kinda disagree on this one too. It's not about pulling your weight, it's about taking the initiative. It's totally normal when you're IN a relationship, but makes the guy look weak and unorganized when you're still just dating. The mindset of girls and women are one and the same. Wiser, yes, but the same nevertheless

I went to see a movie with a girl once... afterwards I was going through a list of scientific inaccuracies I saw in the movie and she looked the other way and made a barfing action and asked me to take her home.

So you don't need us to tell you where you went wrong with that one, right? :rofl2:

No, lesson learned lol

Just sayin though... talking about a movie after you just see it is probably a bad idea even if you have positive things to say

lol @ XiP

I do like the idea of doing something after the movie to talk about it, or whatever. It's always a sort of downer to go to a movie, then sludge on out knowing you're just going to get into a car and go home or something. <--I think that is the main point about not doing a movie. That and the fact you're going to be together for 1.5-2 hours and not really say anything and instead just consume something being thrown into your eye holes.

Better yet, go to a place where you get beer/food and a movie. Or, when you're up to it, watch one at home where you can talk all you want. (Just don't keep talking if you're with someone who hates talking through the show!)

At any rate, for conversation after the movie, you better be prepared to have some conversation, though! Better/worse options, more than just a "this sucked" response...

I've had some good luck starting at a bar and going to a movie afterward. My favorite dates were the ones where we asked the box office which POS movie hadn't sold any tickets and we go make fun of it the whole time with no one to be bothered by the fact we're laughing like jackasses. You might want to sneak in a flask for that.

this thread is crowded today.

And that's a bad thing?

Haha... well my mistake about this place tonight. I've only been there once. It's really a bar. It's Thirsty Thursday so this place gets pretty packed with no room to sit around. I'm bound to run into some friends, and possibly meeting with others. Keep you guys posted.

BTW, although she tells me she likes texting with me we really don't text all that much. Maybe once or twice especially once I figured her responses can take awhile or she doesn't respond. Last night at the table she actually checked the MMS I sent her. O_o

Good luck!

Shook hands with a random dude speaking gibberish. A few minutes later several bouncers kicked him out. I'm on my 3rd beer. Getting sleepy. Earlier she said she was sleepy so no guarantee. My friends with left to another bar or went to hookah bar.

No surprise. I'm out of the house chilling at least Haha.

I feel for you bro:icon17:. Hookah bar would have been perfect place to take her. Usually pretty quiet.

Did you get to talk to her at least? ...like an actual conversation?

Also, try not to text. I know it's the norm these days, but it's lazy and you make up all these crazy scenarios in your head when she doesn't text you back. Just call her (but not right after a date, lol). It's instant feedback.

She ended up staying home to sleep (works 7 days a week). So far it's just texts since her phone is messed up after getting the screen replaced. She has to get on speaker phone to chat. Coincidentally, I end up learning how to pace myself with texts.

To be honest, she's just like any typical girl I've met. The difference is hanging out versus having a date. I've hung out with several girls the past few months, and it was easy breezy without expectations. With this one, as part of my 2014 resolution, I decided to put in some effort.

Funny thought. We talked about the day we first met when my dad introduced us at her work place. She was making coffee for us. When she rang us up I gave her a $20, but she punched in $10. We both had a brain fart when she tried to recalculate the change. The more she asked, the more I forgot how to do simple math (a disgrace to engineers). We chuckled.

Anyhow, my nerves are finally getting calm after the 1st date. So from here on out I'll pace myself and keep a mental note of all your advices. Thanks again, and I'll keep you all posted.

Wish we can all get together and I'd buy you all pitchers of beer.

DIGI, it sounds like you have the right attitude! Keep giving us updates...

Dude, what kind of crappy movies do you go to? ;) Any decent movie is able to be discussed afterwards. I'm not saying you go see Frozen or Fast 6, but pick a movie with an actual plot and it shouldn't be hard to exchange opinions about it afterwards. They key here is that the movie is a conversation starter, not what you're relying on for the entire dinner/coffee date. If I'm on a first date with a guy and he can't come up with a single thing to say about the movie we just saw, there won't be a second date.

I meant reactions during the conversation about the movie, not someone's reactions during the actual movie-watching, but I see how my wording there sucked. (d'oh!)

BS. If you pick the restaurant and offer to let her pick the activity and the woman thinks that makes you weak/unorganized, she's not worth your time.

More BS. Your fiancée is 26: before you met her, did you ever date anyone older than you? Or even anyone over 30? (I'm not saying that every female over 30 is a woman, but nearly all females under 30 are still just girls.) Trust me, the mindsets of girls and women are VERY different. :)

Hey, I actually enjoyed watching frozen with my date...and she really liked it too lol.

Then again, I also fall into the classic thinking of 'no movies for first dates'. I think it's weird, if you're going out for the first time shouldn't you...you know, TALK a lot?

I'm not saying Frozen isn't a great movie, just that it might not be the best conversation fodder for two people who don't know each other yet. :)

Why does a first date have to be ALL talking? Why can't there be both talking and entertainment? First dates are about getting to know each other, but that can happen whether you're talking or not. Do you laugh at the same lines? Does she cry way too easily, or text during the movie? Does he leave his trash on the floor? Etc. It's not that you're studying the other person or critiquing them the whole time or anything, it's just that little things like that can tell you just as much about someone -- and your level of compatibility with them -- as their words.

I'm clearly in the minority here, but I think a movie + dinner/coffee/drinks (movie first!) is a perfectly good first date. I also think that a show + dinner/coffee/drinks is a great first date, and you aren't talking during those, either.

I agree there should be talking and entertainment! But I would think something more interactive would be more fun and constructive.

I'm just saying not necessarily. But I can agree to disagree. :)

Do you honestly think two or more hours of complete silence in the dark is a good start to a first date? It doesn't matter what movie you go to, crappy or otherwise. It's a boring discussion after both having just seen it. It's a terrible conversation starter, even at dinner. I'm not saying the guy should or shouldn't have stuff to say about a movie he just saw, I'm saying watching a movie on the first date shouldn't be done, period! If you want to talk about movies on a date, that's totally fine. Talk about the ones you've seen in the past or one you want to see in the future. Not the one you both just saw an hour ago.

I'm not saying she shouldn't speak up, I'm saying the entire date should be somewhat planned. I'm all for spontaneity, but not having a plan lessens your odds of landing a second date. Which of these dates would you rather be on:

A) A date with a guy who picks you up at your place, reserved a nice restaurant for dinner, bought tickets to a play/musical/art exhibit/whatever followed by drinks or coffee. Ends it with a walk or quiet place where you both get to talk to one another.

B) A date with a guy who says...... " I dunno, where do you wanna go for dinner?" " I dunno, where do you wanna go after?" " I dunno, where do you wanna go now?"

Going to the movies, dinner and then having you decide where to go next isn't exactly a memorable romantic date for most women. I dunno, maybe I'm setting the standard too high, but I guess I'm a romantic at heart. If I really like someone, I'm gonna make an effort and that includes a good first impression.

Oh boy...Can't touch these without being mean.....Lets agree to disagree. I'm not making this about you, so please refrain from making this about me.

Is there such a thing as an overplanned date? I typically waffle on setting things up, like I would have a dinner place set up but then figure out the rest spontaneously (although I have some options in mind). Hence yesterday we ate then just randomly watched a movie because it was right there and she wanted to watch something.

I only noticed there was a basketball game that looked interesting later this month so I'm basically planning a day out piece by piece...but is that overkill?

Yes. Do you honestly have to ask me that at this point in the thread? It's clear that we don't agree on this point. I guess we'll never have a first date. ;)

Go back to how this started: it was about offering to let the woman pick the activity, and you said that the guy should do all of the planning. We don't disagree about what you're saying now, just what you said then.

Except this bit isn't a matter of opinion. You've said that all girls and women think the same, and I'm a woman saying "Um, not quite/not always." There's nothing to "agree to disagree" about: your generality is incorrect.

"Making this about you/me"? You made it about you when you expressed your opinion, just like I made it about me by expressing mine. We are disagreeing with each other, therefore this is, in fact, about you and me. :)

Seriously, though, I'm sorry if you were offended by being asked how old your girlfriends have been. It seemed germane to our discussion. If you'd rather just end this part of the conversation, that's cool with me.

I'd say yes, but also that what you're talking about doesn't qualify. I'd say that "overplanned" would be a date that includes more than two elements: dinner and a movie, drinks and a ballgame, etc. Not that you need two or can't do more than two things, but if you've already planned two parts the rest of it (if there is a "rest of it") should be spontaneous.

Keep in mind, too, that there's a difference between a first/early date and a date with someone you've been seeing for a while, who might not care if you plan out an entire day.