Reflections on GTM over the years

Infidel · 10-07-2014, 09:25 PM

How many more are out there that we don't know about. One day the threat of criminal charges will no longer keep justice in it's holster and hell will be unleashed. May ditches fill with the decomposing corpses of unethical business men.

bullitt5897 · 10-07-2014, 10:06 PM

I just spent this last weekend at GTM. I met with SAM and the tech actively working on my car. They are actively working on customer cars, putting together everyone's kits to be shipped, working on people's refunds and working to get things right.

I am not saying this as a fanboy or because of any affiliation...

I am saying this as that was what was obvious as fact while I was in the shop... People's names were on boxes with packing lists on them, there were whiteboards with projects on them and what was supposed to happen, Sam had a list of bills and refunds with checklists next to them... It appears they are working to make things right.

For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes.

For those upset about the MHI kit... To be honest Sam should not have opened the GB until after all the dev work was completed... I saw atleast 6+ sets of cast turbo manifold revisions! From talking to Sam a revision and recast could take up to 3 months... In that aspect alone I saw atleast at a minimum 1.5 years worth of revisions from R&D... The same went for the V3 turbo manifolds... I do not believe the kit was ready for the GB and it is definitely a business lesson GTM learned. For those awaiting refunds for this GB you will get your money... I asked Sam on this specific subject and he said they are working on getting refunds out slowly but surely.

The mood in the shop was more towards "let's get it done" attitude.

All in all: I went to check on my car and to get my extra parts and bring them home. I sat down with Sam and asked him many questions. I had Sam show me what was going on in the shop and I made observations while looking for my parts boxes and sorting through what stayed and what I took home. There was no evidence that GTM was in trouble at the shop.

I hope this unbiased update will give some of you better insight to what is going on.

Mike

Z eliminator · 10-07-2014, 11:00 PM

When you were there did he mention my 4.2 stroker motor with the stage 3 heads ? I spoke to him thursday and he says that he making progress on it.

Z

Dcocci · 10-07-2014, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emares

Geez. Sam screwed me out of 20k. I paid in full for turbo kit and installation and a couple other stuff since I lived pretty close to them. I also had him do a stage 4 transmission job on my G37. He had my car for about 8 months. After about 7 months of no turbo, I told him I wanted out of it. When I finally got my car back he claimed he had installed the turbo kit and told me about it before I said I no longer wanted it. My refund was about $700. He claimed he had to charge me for the installation and removal of the turbo kit, plus the transmission job. Im sure there was never any turbo kit installed, and the transmission never worked. Still waiting on those $700. Anything I can do?

Uhhh call a lawer dude.

elperuano · 10-07-2014, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emares

Geez. Sam screwed me out of 20k. I paid in full for turbo kit and installation and a couple other stuff since I lived pretty close to them. I also had him do a stage 4 transmission job on my G37. He had my car for about 8 months. After about 7 months of no turbo, I told him I wanted out of it. When I finally got my car back he claimed he had installed the turbo kit and told me about it before I said I no longer wanted it. My refund was about $700. He claimed he had to charge me for the installation and removal of the turbo kit, plus the transmission job. Im sure there was never any turbo kit installed, and the transmission never worked. Still waiting on those $700. Anything I can do?

bullitt5897 · 10-08-2014, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z eliminator

When you were there did he mention my 4.2 stroker motor with the stage 3 heads ? I spoke to him thursday and he says that he making progress on it.

Z

Yes your motor is being worked on. I saw they were making progress on it but I don't know how far along they were.

Mike

MMC Racing · 10-08-2014, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullitt5897

For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes.

Mike

You didn't go in with ear plugs in.. You let him speak..

Chuck33079 · 10-08-2014, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullitt5897

I just spent this last weekend at GTM. I met with SAM and the tech actively working on my car. They are actively working on customer cars, putting together everyone's kits to be shipped, working on people's refunds and working to get things right.

I am not saying this as a fanboy or because of any affiliation...

I am saying this as that was what was obvious as fact while I was in the shop... People's names were on boxes with packing lists on them, there were whiteboards with projects on them and what was supposed to happen, Sam had a list of bills and refunds with checklists next to them... It appears they are working to make things right.

For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emares

Geez. Sam screwed me out of 20k. I paid in full for turbo kit and installation and a couple other stuff since I lived pretty close to them. I also had him do a stage 4 transmission job on my G37. He had my car for about 8 months. After about 7 months of no turbo, I told him I wanted out of it. When I finally got my car back he claimed he had installed the turbo kit and told me about it before I said I no longer wanted it. My refund was about $700. He claimed he had to charge me for the installation and removal of the turbo kit, plus the transmission job. Im sure there was never any turbo kit installed, and the transmission never worked. Still waiting on those $700. Anything I can do?

One of these things is not like the other.

And who would really trust Sam to tell a customer the depth of their financial woes? How does someone listen to all of that without a boulder-sized grain of salt?

roplusbee · 10-08-2014, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullitt5897

I just spent this last weekend at GTM. I met with SAM and the tech actively working on my car. They are actively working on customer cars, putting together everyone's kits to be shipped, working on people's refunds and working to get things right.

I am not saying this as a fanboy or because of any affiliation...

I am saying this as that was what was obvious as fact while I was in the shop... People's names were on boxes with packing lists on them, there were whiteboards with projects on them and what was supposed to happen, Sam had a list of bills and refunds with checklists next to them... It appears they are working to make things right.

For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes.

For those upset about the MHI kit... To be honest Sam should not have opened the GB until after all the dev work was completed... I saw atleast 6+ sets of cast turbo manifold revisions! From talking to Sam a revision and recast could take up to 3 months... In that aspect alone I saw atleast at a minimum 1.5 years worth of revisions from R&D... The same went for the V3 turbo manifolds... I do not believe the kit was ready for the GB and it is definitely a business lesson GTM learned. For those awaiting refunds for this GB you will get your money... I asked Sam on this specific subject and he said they are working on getting refunds out slowly but surely.

The mood in the shop was more towards "let's get it done" attitude.

All in all: I went to check on my car and to get my extra parts and bring them home. I sat down with Sam and asked him many questions. I had Sam show me what was going on in the shop and I made observations while looking for my parts boxes and sorting through what stayed and what I took home. There was no evidence that GTM was in trouble at the shop.

I hope this unbiased update will give some of you better insight to what is going on.

Mike

I am not sure what you saw while you were there in regard to things owed to others, but it does make sense that they are trying to make good (as much as possible) with the community. I never liked the way things sounded when I talked to them back in 2010. I don't think anything has change between then and now, other than they got hung up trying to make a quick run of something that needed more work (just like some of their other offerings).

I am sure that they will make good with you, since you talk good about them AND you have spent a lot of money while they used your platform to develop things.

Any way you want to see this, it shows the true colors of this company and it's business practices. That is why I chose to stay away 4 years ago.

Rob

09nismo498 · 10-08-2014, 09:00 AM

Once a crook always a crook. I hope he does get shut down after the things he put people through. IMO, theres nothing he could possibly do to ever earn my business again. Sounds like he filled your ears with a ton of bs I'm sure bullitt5897...

mikey1600 · 10-08-2014, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emares

Geez. Sam screwed me out of 20k. I paid in full for turbo kit and installation and a couple other stuff since I lived pretty close to them. I also had him do a stage 4 transmission job on my G37. He had my car for about 8 months. After about 7 months of no turbo, I told him I wanted out of it. When I finally got my car back he claimed he had installed the turbo kit and told me about it before I said I no longer wanted it. My refund was about $700. He claimed he had to charge me for the installation and removal of the turbo kit, plus the transmission job. Im sure there was never any turbo kit installed, and the transmission never worked. Still waiting on those $700. Anything I can do?

lawyer up NOW, thats a load of crap.

mikey1600 · 10-08-2014, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullitt5897

I just spent this last weekend at GTM. I met with SAM and the tech actively working on my car. They are actively working on customer cars, putting together everyone's kits to be shipped, working on people's refunds and working to get things right.

I am not saying this as a fanboy or because of any affiliation...

I am saying this as that was what was obvious as fact while I was in the shop... People's names were on boxes with packing lists on them, there were whiteboards with projects on them and what was supposed to happen, Sam had a list of bills and refunds with checklists next to them... It appears they are working to make things right.

For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes.

For those upset about the MHI kit... To be honest Sam should not have opened the GB until after all the dev work was completed... I saw atleast 6+ sets of cast turbo manifold revisions! From talking to Sam a revision and recast could take up to 3 months... In that aspect alone I saw atleast at a minimum 1.5 years worth of revisions from R&D... The same went for the V3 turbo manifolds... I do not believe the kit was ready for the GB and it is definitely a business lesson GTM learned. For those awaiting refunds for this GB you will get your money... I asked Sam on this specific subject and he said they are working on getting refunds out slowly but surely.

The mood in the shop was more towards "let's get it done" attitude.

All in all: I went to check on my car and to get my extra parts and bring them home. I sat down with Sam and asked him many questions. I had Sam show me what was going on in the shop and I made observations while looking for my parts boxes and sorting through what stayed and what I took home. There was no evidence that GTM was in trouble at the shop.

I hope this unbiased update will give some of you better insight to what is going on.

Mike

it's good you are getting your car finished (I hope you really do for your sake), but pretty sure any of the current members wouldn't send any $$ their way for anything. Any new members asking about parts will get sent to the various train wreck threads, pretty sure they are screwed forum wise until next generation Z and most of us are not around anymore. (again not sure how much work came from the forums, would assume a fair bit)

They had a really good thing going with the group buy, but that's completely ruined their rep. Lots of people got completely screwed over and the people who didn't get screwed over, were all the other people saying that we were going to get screwed over lol

bullitt5897 · 10-08-2014, 11:41 AM

To those that think I am cheerleading... I am not. Sam and I have a complex relationship and if you ask him I am a pain in the a$$! However, as a former business owner I know the right questions to ask and when to call bs. This trip was solely about my car and my project. I asked and inquired and dug into these items because it means something to the community... Does it benefit me to come forward? NO! Actually it does the opposite! Sam holds his cards close to his chest. I have learned how to work with Sam and how to get the information I needed.

So to recap I was not fed b.s. I pulled information from Sam as well as other sources to validate. I also was physically in the building and walking through the operations. This is something about 70+% of you cannot claim...

so yes take what I say with a grain of salt but also know I have dealt with Sam more than probably half of the members of the forums combined... No offense taken here by me and I would be just as skeptical as many of you are. But remember I am an OG here and I have always been very straight with people and members...

bullitt5897 · 10-08-2014, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emares

Geez. Sam screwed me out of 20k. I paid in full for turbo kit and installation and a couple other stuff since I lived pretty close to them. I also had him do a stage 4 transmission job on my G37. He had my car for about 8 months. After about 7 months of no turbo, I told him I wanted out of it. When I finally got my car back he claimed he had installed the turbo kit and told me about it before I said I no longer wanted it. My refund was about $700. He claimed he had to charge me for the installation and removal of the turbo kit, plus the transmission job. Im sure there was never any turbo kit installed, and the transmission never worked. Still waiting on those $700. Anything I can do?

This story does not make sense...

Can you go into more detail of what happened? From what you have posted it sounds as the following happened:

You bought a TT kit and extras (what extras? This could impact your install)
You bought a transmission upgrade

You sent your car in for installation of the TT kit, upgrade of your transmission and installation of extra parts.

After 7 months you were unsatisfied with the progress and requested the car be returned to you.

(There is a gap as to what happened next as apparent in your post quoted above)

From your post I am deducting that Sam uninstalled the kit and transmission and returned you the car.

Based off what you posted Sam only charged you for the initial tear down and install amount of $700... This is the amount you claim he did not refund you and kept. This is completely legitimate as you bought a product and service then cancelled after work began... Most companies would have charged a restocking fee if you bought parts from them. This is the same thing. Now a TT kit install will cost you north of $2k+ Not to mention the install of the upgraded transmission so a $700 fee is a bargain... They could have kept more if they were greedy. I have known shops to keep all the install costs just to penalize the customer.

With all that said: there are a lot of gaps in this story and in order for you to get correct advice or answers you may want to be complete in your story...

I am curious how this really played out... And how Sam took 20k from you... I don't think he actually took 20k from you but rather you are upset over A $700 dispute... Am I correct in my thinking?

DEpointfive0 · 10-08-2014, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullitt5897

This story does not make sense...

Can you go into more detail of what happened? From what you have posted it sounds as the following happened:

You bought a TT kit and extras (what extras? This could impact your install)
You bought a transmission upgrade

You sent your car in for installation of the TT kit, upgrade of your transmission and installation of extra parts.

After 7 months you were unsatisfied with the progress and requested the car be returned to you.

(There is a gap as to what happened next as apparent in your post quoted above)

From your post I am deducting that Sam uninstalled the kit and transmission and returned you the car.

Based off what you posted Sam only charged you for the initial tear down and install amount of $700... This is the amount you claim he did not refund you and kept. This is completely legitimate as you bought a product and service then cancelled after work began... Most companies would have charged a restocking fee if you bought parts from them. This is the same thing. Now a TT kit install will cost you north of $2k+ Not to mention the install of the upgraded transmission so a $700 fee is a bargain... They could have kept more if they were greedy. I have known shops to keep all the install costs just to penalize the customer.

With all that said: there are a lot of gaps in this story and in order for you to get correct advice or answers you may want to be complete in your story...

I am curious how this really played out... And how Sam took 20k from you... I don't think he actually took 20k from you but rather you are upset over A $700 dispute... Am I correct in my thinking?

He's saying his refund was $700, so he lost $19,300

10-07-2014, 09:25 PM	#466 (permalink)
Infidel Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Central Florida Posts: 457 Drives: 2013 GM 6MT Rep Power: 14	How many more are out there that we don't know about. One day the threat of criminal charges will no longer keep justice in it's holster and hell will be unleashed. May ditches fill with the decomposing corpses of unethical business men. David Parra, elperuano and DEpointfive0 like this.

10-07-2014, 10:06 PM	#467 (permalink)
bullitt5897 Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: North GA Posts: 6,831 Drives: Twin Turbo Z34 Rep Power: 3682	I just spent this last weekend at GTM. I met with SAM and the tech actively working on my car. They are actively working on customer cars, putting together everyone's kits to be shipped, working on people's refunds and working to get things right. I am not saying this as a fanboy or because of any affiliation... I am saying this as that was what was obvious as fact while I was in the shop... People's names were on boxes with packing lists on them, there were whiteboards with projects on them and what was supposed to happen, Sam had a list of bills and refunds with checklists next to them... It appears they are working to make things right. For those saying GTM is going bankrupt and we should all abandon ship... This is not the case... GTM as a business is not going anywhere. Were there bad decisions being made? Yes, and Sam is working to rectify the situation and learn from the mistakes. For those upset about the MHI kit... To be honest Sam should not have opened the GB until after all the dev work was completed... I saw atleast 6+ sets of cast turbo manifold revisions! From talking to Sam a revision and recast could take up to 3 months... In that aspect alone I saw atleast at a minimum 1.5 years worth of revisions from R&D... The same went for the V3 turbo manifolds... I do not believe the kit was ready for the GB and it is definitely a business lesson GTM learned. For those awaiting refunds for this GB you will get your money... I asked Sam on this specific subject and he said they are working on getting refunds out slowly but surely. The mood in the shop was more towards "let's get it done" attitude. All in all: I went to check on my car and to get my extra parts and bring them home. I sat down with Sam and asked him many questions. I had Sam show me what was going on in the shop and I made observations while looking for my parts boxes and sorting through what stayed and what I took home. There was no evidence that GTM was in trouble at the shop. I hope this unbiased update will give some of you better insight to what is going on. Mike __________________ *Shop Cars: 2013 318whp Nismo VspecII 370z SOLD, 2009 1000hp+ 93oct 4.0L TT 370z Fast Intentions STAGE 4 #054*

10-07-2014, 11:00 PM	#468 (permalink)
Z eliminator A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Ontario Canada Posts: 1,658 Drives: 370 Z 7AT Sports Rep Power: 18	When you were there did he mention my 4.2 stroker motor with the stage 3 heads ? I spoke to him thursday and he says that he making progress on it. Z __________________ 12.343 @114.14 . 4.5 stroker motor is now being built. Dec 1 2015.

10-08-2014, 09:00 AM	#475 (permalink)
09nismo498 Base Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Chicago burbs Posts: 207 Drives: 14 GTR Rep Power: 15	Once a crook always a crook. I hope he does get shut down after the things he put people through. IMO, theres nothing he could possibly do to ever earn my business again. Sounds like he filled your ears with a ton of bs I'm sure bullitt5897... elperuano, Masterbeatty and NoLaKrewe like this. __________________ 2013 370z Nismo Turbo 2017 Lexus IS200T F Sport (DD)

10-08-2014, 11:41 AM	#478 (permalink)
bullitt5897 Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: North GA Posts: 6,831 Drives: Twin Turbo Z34 Rep Power: 3682	To those that think I am cheerleading... I am not. Sam and I have a complex relationship and if you ask him I am a pain in the a$$! However, as a former business owner I know the right questions to ask and when to call bs. This trip was solely about my car and my project. I asked and inquired and dug into these items because it means something to the community... Does it benefit me to come forward? NO! Actually it does the opposite! Sam holds his cards close to his chest. I have learned how to work with Sam and how to get the information I needed. So to recap I was not fed b.s. I pulled information from Sam as well as other sources to validate. I also was physically in the building and walking through the operations. This is something about 70+% of you cannot claim... so yes take what I say with a grain of salt but also know I have dealt with Sam more than probably half of the members of the forums combined... No offense taken here by me and I would be just as skeptical as many of you are. But remember I am an OG here and I have always been very straight with people and members... Infiniti370z, JARblue and DEpointfive0 like this. __________________ *Shop Cars: 2013 318whp Nismo VspecII 370z SOLD, 2009 1000hp+ 93oct 4.0L TT 370z Fast Intentions STAGE 4 #054*

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