Reflections on GTM over the years

Alstann · 09-23-2014, 11:19 AM

Hey all,

I just spent some time at work reading through these last few pages, and man, what a trip.

As some of you may know, I was one of the first people to lay down money for the kit, and I've been in a constant struggle trying to get my money back, as well as contact them for information. I even visited their facility personally to see what was going on.

Just a little quick update on where I am at - I currently have a court summons and date by the California Court for a small claims lawsuit. I have asked for exactly what I paid for, and I have a set court date.

I have all of my previous invoices, contact records, phone calls, and emails. I hoped it had not come to this, but Sam and GTM will be held responsible.

I guess I can keep you all posted on that end of things, when I fly out to California soon for the court date.

28 pages is a crapton of info to sift through without anyone at work noticing, haha.

Chuck33079 · 09-23-2014, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alstann

Hey all,

I just spent some time at work reading through these last few pages, and man, what a trip.

As some of you may know, I was one of the first people to lay down money for the kit, and I've been in a constant struggle trying to get my money back, as well as contact them for information. I even visited their facility personally to see what was going on.

Just a little quick update on where I am at - I currently have a court summons and date by the California Court for a small claims lawsuit. I have asked for exactly what I paid for, and I have a set court date.

I have all of my previous invoices, contact records, phone calls, and emails. I hoped it had not come to this, but Sam and GTM will be held responsible.

I guess I can keep you all posted on that end of things, when I fly out to California soon for the court date.

28 pages is a crapton of info to sift through without anyone at work noticing, haha.

How does a bankruptcy filing affect a small claims lawsuit in CA? Does that move you higher on the list of creditors?

Alstann · 09-23-2014, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

How does a bankruptcy filing affect a small claims lawsuit in CA? Does that move you higher on the list of creditors?

From what I understand in California, a bankruptcy filing discharges debts that are previously owed, unless the debt in question was fraudlent (which I believe this is the case), and was obtained with a false pretense.

From the US Code - Section 523 - Exemptions to Discharge (in terms of bankruptcy):

(a) A discharge under section 727, 1141, 1228(a), 1228(b), or 1328(b) of this title does not discharge an individual debtor from any debt.....(2) for money, property, services, or an extension, renewal, or refinancing of credit, to the extent obtained by - (A) false pretenses, a false representation, or actual fraud, other than a statement respecting the debtor's or an insider's financial condition.

I'm going to be speaking to a friend of mine who is an attorney to get more information, but I believe I have a case. Also, I am unsure of how that bankruptcy filing worked out - they filed under a different name.

MMC Racing · 09-23-2014, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alstann

From what I understand in California, a bankruptcy filing discharges debts that are previously owed, unless the debt in question was fraudlent (which I believe this is the case), and was obtained with a false pretense.

From the US Code - Section 523 - Exemptions to Discharge (in terms of bankruptcy):

(a) A discharge under section 727, 1141, 1228(a), 1228(b), or 1328(b) of this title does not discharge an individual debtor from any debt.....(2) for money, property, services, or an extension, renewal, or refinancing of credit, to the extent obtained by - (A) false pretenses, a false representation, or actual fraud, other than a statement respecting the debtor's or an insider's financial condition.

I'm going to be speaking to a friend of mine who is an attorney to get more information, but I believe I have a case. Also, I am unsure of how that bankruptcy filing worked out - they filed under a different name.

Getting the first judgment will be the easy part. Collecting on that judgment is going to be hard and expensive with very little chance of success. Every additional dollar you put into trying to get your money back will just be more money down the drain.

The only creditors that will get any satisfaction out of this is they ones that leased him equipment. They will get their equipment back. They still will need to eat the lost lease payments, transportation, and reconditioning.

Chuck33079 · 09-23-2014, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMC Racing

Getting the first judgment will be the easy part. Collecting on that judgment is going to be hard and expensive with very little chance of success. Every additional dollar you put into trying to get your money back will just be more money down the drain.

The only creditors that will get any satisfaction out of this is they ones that leased him equipment. They will get their equipment back. They still will need to eat the lost lease payments, transportation, and reconditioning.

Unless there are hard assets you can repo, I'm afraid you may be left holding a judgement in your favor and a pocketful of nothing. There's no doubt in my mind that there are no assets to go after. Man, I hope I'm wrong and you get made whole, but I'm afraid you're about to find out how broke Sam is.

1slow370 · 09-23-2014, 02:05 PM

I love forum legal advice, ery'one be talkin out they a55, it's filled under 11 not 7 or 13, so most of what everyone has so far said does not apply, it is not straight liquidation it is for a company to work through a court to satisfy their creditors over the course of a few years to be able to maintain an operable business, if it gets rolled into a 7 then it would be liquidated but usually they would just make the payments to repay a certain decided upon percentage of debt and then would be released from the remainder and could continue operating. Don't take my word for it though or the word of any of the other amateur financial and legal counselors on here go get real advise if you need it.

G37sHKS · 09-23-2014, 06:37 PM

So GTM is officially bankrupt?

DEpointfive0 · 09-23-2014, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G37sHKS

So GTM is officially bankrupt?

Bankrupt, sure. Out of business, no.

Bankrupt does not mean out of business.

1slow370 · 09-23-2014, 06:45 PM

bankruptcy has turned into something some businesses will do to shuffle some paperwork around and bring the profit margin back up, usually the ones who get hurt the most under a chapter 11 are suppliers and companies who have leased equipment because they can no longer take that equipment back until an agreement is reached and in which case they may end up not taking it back and cutting there losses for semi repayment, but again I can't tell you for sure I don't make a living dealing with it, like the people you should pay to talk to about it if it concerns you. Always seek legal and financial advise before making any serious decisions that are not cut and dry.

DEpointfive0 · 09-23-2014, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

bankruptcy has turned into something some businesses will do to shuffle some paperwork around and bring the profit margin back up, usually the ones who get hurt the most under a chapter 11 are suppliers and companies who have leased equipment because they can no longer take that equipment back until an agreement is reached and in which case they may end up not taking it back and cutting there losses for semi repayment, but again I can't tell you for sure I don't make a living dealing with it, like the people you should pay to talk to about it if it concerns you. Always seek legal and financial advise before making any serious decisions that are not cut and dry.

JARblue · 09-23-2014, 08:29 PM

Hi. I am not a lawyer nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. But I do have a keyboard connected to the internet

Alstann · 09-23-2014, 08:51 PM

I am currently in contact with a lawyer, and I'm gonna post when I get definitive information on everything. But regardless, my court date is set for November, so I will definitely be attending that.

The California court also sent a certified mail court-summons, which requires Sam to attend this hearing by law. Failure to attend, I'd imagine, would not be good. I made sure I went through the right methods as well before I made this a legal issue.

*Off topic, but a few people asked me about my custom master cylinder, and how it's holding up. It's rock solid as the day I installed it.

JARblue · 09-24-2014, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alstann

*Off topic, but a few people asked me about my custom master cylinder, and how it's holding up. It's rock solid as the day I installed it.

Let me know when you are producing them en masse

BlkNismo · 09-24-2014, 10:37 AM

C'mon Sam...Speak out. I know your lurking you snake.

1slow370 · 09-24-2014, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlkNismo

C'mon Sam...Speak out. I know your lurking you snake.

He probably realizes his credibility is not so credible anymore, we might hear from him once all the refund stuff is taken care of and things have turned around but until then i don't see it happening.

09-23-2014, 11:19 AM	#1 (permalink)
Alstann Track Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: South Florida Posts: 882 Drives: 12 PW 370z 6MT Sport Rep Power: 16	Hey all, I just spent some time at work reading through these last few pages, and man, what a trip. As some of you may know, I was one of the first people to lay down money for the kit, and I've been in a constant struggle trying to get my money back, as well as contact them for information. I even visited their facility personally to see what was going on. Just a little quick update on where I am at - I currently have a court summons and date by the California Court for a small claims lawsuit. I have asked for exactly what I paid for, and I have a set court date. I have all of my previous invoices, contact records, phone calls, and emails. I hoped it had not come to this, but Sam and GTM will be held responsible. I guess I can keep you all posted on that end of things, when I fly out to California soon for the court date. 28 pages is a crapton of info to sift through without anyone at work noticing, haha. __________________ 2012 Pearl White 370Z GReddy Twin Turbo

09-23-2014, 02:05 PM	#6 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7252	I love forum legal advice, ery'one be talkin out they a55, it's filled under 11 not 7 or 13, so most of what everyone has so far said does not apply, it is not straight liquidation it is for a company to work through a court to satisfy their creditors over the course of a few years to be able to maintain an operable business, if it gets rolled into a 7 then it would be liquidated but usually they would just make the payments to repay a certain decided upon percentage of debt and then would be released from the remainder and could continue operating. Don't take my word for it though or the word of any of the other amateur financial and legal counselors on here go get real advise if you need it. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

09-23-2014, 06:37 PM	#7 (permalink)
G37sHKS A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Dubai Posts: 1,183 Drives: 09 G37S Coupe 7AT Rep Power: 22	So GTM is officially bankrupt? __________________ G37 BUILD UNDER CONSTRUCTION

09-23-2014, 06:45 PM	#9 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7252	bankruptcy has turned into something some businesses will do to shuffle some paperwork around and bring the profit margin back up, usually the ones who get hurt the most under a chapter 11 are suppliers and companies who have leased equipment because they can no longer take that equipment back until an agreement is reached and in which case they may end up not taking it back and cutting there losses for semi repayment, but again I can't tell you for sure I don't make a living dealing with it, like the people you should pay to talk to about it if it concerns you. Always seek legal and financial advise before making any serious decisions that are not cut and dry. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

09-23-2014, 08:29 PM	#11 (permalink)
JARblue A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Austin, TX Age: 45 Posts: 36,450 Drives: 11 Z34, 98 E36 M3 Rep Power: 2684442	Hi. I am not a lawyer nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. But I do have a keyboard connected to the internet __________________ 2011 370Z 6MT Sport Gun Metallic \| ARC \| CJM \| Ecutek \| FI \| Fujimura \| R2C \| SPL \| Stillen \| TWM \| Z1 \| ZSpeed \|

09-23-2014, 08:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
Alstann Track Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: South Florida Posts: 882 Drives: 12 PW 370z 6MT Sport Rep Power: 16	I am currently in contact with a lawyer, and I'm gonna post when I get definitive information on everything. But regardless, my court date is set for November, so I will definitely be attending that. The California court also sent a certified mail court-summons, which requires Sam to attend this hearing by law. Failure to attend, I'd imagine, would not be good. I made sure I went through the right methods as well before I made this a legal issue. *Off topic, but a few people asked me about my custom master cylinder, and how it's holding up. It's rock solid as the day I installed it. __________________ 2012 Pearl White 370Z GReddy Twin Turbo

09-24-2014, 10:37 AM	#14 (permalink)
BlkNismo Track Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: USA Posts: 614 Drives: Nismo Rep Power: 16	C'mon Sam...Speak out. I know your lurking you snake.

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