Car and Driver's Cars Worth Waiting For: 2016 Z

UNKNOWN_370 · 05-31-2013, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Notwithstanding price and whatever qualia the 86 twins claim, the Z beats it in every way -- lux, power, actual (over imagined) handling and braking.

It's still a bargin basement Porsche or perhaps fighting with the US Muscle/Pony cars for customers. The other major competitor is the Genesis.

About the same (or a little less) weight plus another 25-50 ponies, further chassis refinement, other nettling issues resolved (e.g., fuel starve) and we're there.

Ooooh I wants me the next gen Z -- bring on the concept already!

On the weight: Anyone know what the Q50 is supposed to be coming in at? I'm guessing we can expect similar weight difference between current Z:current G and next gen Z:Q50.

They are taking the whole fun factor BS of the 86 and running with it like a freight train with no brakes. Point is, this car can barely dent a Civic on a track. Let alone any of the Big Boys. The gencoupe 2.0 is a track beast by comparison of the FR-S.

Fun factor on that car is high. But FR-S reviews are definitely one-sided and convoluted.

Redglare · 05-31-2013, 12:15 PM

the z being a japanese mustang It should at least be able to go toe to toe vs the new gen mustang, (lighter weight/ 475hp)

Only way to do this is to go F/i /v8 or drastic weight reduction, I am talking sub 3000lbs with 350+ hp

Chuck33079 · 05-31-2013, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redglare

the z being a japanese mustang It should at least be able to go toe to toe vs the new gen mustang, (lighter weight/ 475hp)

Only way to do this is to go F/i /v8 or drastic weight reduction, I am talking sub 3000lbs with 350+ hp

What are you willing to give up to cut that weight? Are you ok with a price increase, since lightweight materials cost more than heavier ones?

UNKNOWN_370 · 05-31-2013, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redglare

the z being a japanese mustang It should at least be able to go toe to toe vs the new gen mustang, (lighter weight/ 475hp)

Only way to do this is to go F/i /v8 or drastic weight reduction, I am talking sub 3000lbs with 350+ hp

I think it's the japanese mustang only because of price AND MOST JAPANESE CARS HAVE RELATIVELY LOW HP. The Z is one of very few RWD cars in japan priced with mid-range hp sedans(250-300hp) and has high hp for japan standards. Most VERY high hp japanese cars are in a high price range, GTR, LFA. Then cheaper high hp cars are usually AWD sedans. EVO, STi... Japans mustang is calling it Japans affordable sport coupe. Which up until the LFA/FR-S. Nissan made all of their coupes for nearly a decade. Fairlady, Skyline and GT-R.

Spikuh · 05-31-2013, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redglare

the z being a japanese mustang It should at least be able to go toe to toe vs the new gen mustang, (lighter weight/ 475hp)

Only way to do this is to go F/i /v8 or drastic weight reduction, I am talking sub 3000lbs with 350+ hp

I would be willing to bet that the Z will only hit sub 3k weight by getting its own platform and while that would be nice, I doubt Nissan has the cash flow to do such a thing.

While I really want the Z to stay relevant against new muscle, Nissan is not Ford and it is entirely plausible that the Z simply won't be able to match the new Mustang at all. Provided Ford gets it right and hits the right marks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

What are you willing to give up to cut that weight? Are you ok with a price increase, since lightweight materials cost more than heavier ones?

Personally, with the GTR moving past the $100k mark, I do feel it opens up the top end of the range on the Z to have some growing room. Depending on what they did with the Z, I would have no problem with a top end Z being $60k and competing head to head with the Cayman S again.

Things I would look for would be a transaxle setup, DCT and/or better MT, 3000-3100 weight with upwards of 400hp (don't really care how be it NA, FI, etc.). The interior of the Z is already pretty solid and comparable enough imo.

Would still like to see the Z start in the $30 range and then scale up to the $60k mark if it needs too.

What would be really cool (and I think would work well for Nissan long-term) would be to design a new platform that gets dedicated to the Z and a new Silvia. Have the Silvia be pretty bare bones and live in the $17k-$28k range to get some volume and then have the Z be ~$33k-$60k as a more focused sports car with the GTR staying where it is (although I would like to see it sub-$100k again but whatevs). Silvia could use the current Juke motor up'ed to 2.0L and have it cap around 260-280hp, with the Z using probably whatever they have already come up with.

Anyway, that is what I would pay!!!

UNKNOWN_370 · 05-31-2013, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spikuh

I would be willing to bet that the Z will only hit sub 3k weight by getting its own platform and while that would be nice, I doubt Nissan has the cash flow to do such a thing.

While I really want the Z to stay relevant against new muscle, Nissan is not Ford and it is entirely plausible that the Z simply won't be able to match the new Mustang at all. Provided Ford gets it right and hits the right marks.

Personally, with the GTR moving past the $100k mark, I do feel it opens up the top end of the range on the Z to have some growing room. Depending on what they did with the Z, I would have no problem with a top end Z being $60k and competing head to head with the Cayman S again.

Things I would look for would be a transaxle setup, DCT and/or better MT, 3000-3100 weight with upwards of 400hp (don't really care how be it NA, FI, etc.). The interior of the Z is already pretty solid and comparable enough imo.

Would still like to see the Z start in the $30 range and then scale up to the $60k mark if it needs too.

What would be really cool (and I think would work well for Nissan long-term) would be to design a new platform that gets dedicated to the Z and a new Silvia. Have the Silvia be pretty bare bones and live in the $17k-$28k range to get some volume and then have the Z be ~$33k-$60k as a more focused sports car with the GTR staying where it is (although I would like to see it sub-$100k again but whatevs). Silvia could use the current Juke motor up'ed to 2.0L and have it cap around 260-280hp, with the Z using probably whatever they have already come up with.

Anyway, that is what I would pay!!!

That's more or less where my mindset is at. The GT-R is getting expensve and Infiniti's IPL will be in the same price range next year. Nissan is leaving the $25,000-50,000 sport coupe market kinda empty.

We need th Silvia IF the Z is going to go upscale up to $60k. That will leave the Z possibly starting between $35,000-40,000. The Silvia can start @ $27k and top out @36k and give is the est. 250-300hp.

Z would do well with an entry 350hp $35,000
A nismo tuned 400hp $43,000
And maybe a LIMITED twin-turbo 480hp? $55,000

Chuck33079 · 05-31-2013, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNKNOWN_370

That's more or less where my mindset is at. The GT-R is getting expensve and Infiniti's IPL will be in the same price range next year. Nissan is leaving the $25,000-50,000 sport coupe market kinda empty.

We need th Silvia IF the Z is going to go upscale up to $60k. That will leave the Z possibly starting between $35,000-40,000. The Silvia can start @ $27k and top out @36k and give is the est. 250-300hp.

Z would do well with an entry 350hp $35,000
A nismo tuned 400hp $43,000
And maybe a LIMITED twin-turbo 480hp? $55,000

I'm on board with this, but once we get near c7 prices I'm going to need near c7 power.

UNKNOWN_370 · 05-31-2013, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck33079

I'm on board with this, but once we get near c7 prices I'm going to need near c7 power.

The Z may have better than C7 handling next gen if a TT came out???

Besides my only gripe with the vette??? Too wide!!!

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05-31-2013, 12:15 PM	#2 (permalink)
Redglare Enthusiast Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: FL Posts: 387 Drives: C172 Skyhawk GIII Rep Power: 176	the z being a japanese mustang It should at least be able to go toe to toe vs the new gen mustang, (lighter weight/ 475hp) Only way to do this is to go F/i /v8 or drastic weight reduction, I am talking sub 3000lbs with 350+ hp