Base Z - Regrets?

FricFrac · 07-01-2009, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Go back to the early days of automobiles...

You have to adjust the advance/retard of the ignition MANUALLY, you have to adjust the mixture MANUALLY, and the throttle...and there's no such thing as power steering, power brakes, shock absorbers, or even a roof. No synchronizers in the manual-only transmission, so you have to double-clutch just to shift.

Exactly - and who here is racing a vehicle like that? The point is SRM is just another step in the advancement of the automobile - not a cheat. Technology doesn't create laziness - humans do. You can be lazy without technology or extremely busy with it - ever had a problem with your computer and spend hours trying to get it work?

370Z Purist · 07-01-2009, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FricFrac

A common misconception.... To infer that the ultimate ability in driving is to do it the "old fashioned way" is a narrow perspective of what represents skill. If cars were developed without a clutch from the very begining would racing be missing something? Should we have a cockpit like an aircraft where the lift on each lobe on your cam can be adjusted in real time by the driver to optimize the performance of the vehicle or perhaps being able to change the length or diameter of the exhaust or intake on your engine on the fly?

If you really want to be a purist shouldn't you be adding coal to your steam engine and adjusting the preasure? I don't think we'll see you on the race track with your Model T Ford and its 3 inch wide wooden spoke wheels even though that's real old school racing...

Lets face it - you rely on this technology that is common place (fuel injection, power everything, computer tuned systems, etc, etc, etc) but when something new comes around its cheating or beating the system. Well the whole automobile itself is a piece of technology and what you drive today minus the SMR is more of a far cry from the first automobile than just the SMR technology itself. After a period of time all transmissions will have some form of SMR and we'll forget that we ever had to blip the throttle....

I feel cool when I know how do it at least most of it manually. Is that good enough?

I mean, you kinda have to admit that the more fast movements you do, you seem to appear as if you know what you're doing. I've had people tell me they'd get manual and spend hours and days practicing just to look good and esoteric.

Yes, I do think that SRM is a pinnacle of technology, the very first of it's kind, and I agree with blackbird, all the pride of people who have driven manual transmission since the 50s-60s have all that specific skill for doing everything for the car. (No, blackbird, I'm not calling you old, my father has driven manual since the 60s.) I'm sure as hell glad there are synchros and other components that keep manual from becoming a workout though.

I never said it's the old fashioned way (although I suppose it is somewhat). But I think just for now, where SRM is somewhat a rarity in general, that learning heel toe or whatever technique you desire for downshifting would be good, since I can only name DSGs, SMGs, and SRM that have rev matching. All other cars don't have it, and I doubt we'll see it on many cars for quite a while. It's even more likely that just like the 370Z, there will likely be an option to take it off, and will remain deactivate-able for years to come.

Premo34WV · 07-02-2009, 10:27 AM

For those base model people considering and aftermarket LSD like Nismo or Quaife, take this into consideration before buying.
I previously had a base 350z (open differential) and swapped for the Nismo LSD

The 1.5 Nismo LSD definitely improved performance as far as off the line grip, corner entry and exit, maybe acceleration a bit, and for drifters it is a MUST HAVE.

For the everyday street drivers, I would not recommend this type of differential. The chattering and clunking noise is very very bad. Its loud and harsh. When making slow sharp turns, say in a parking lot for instance, the inside wheel would actually spudder and hop leaving rubber behind. I put only 7000 miles on a set of Goodyear F1 GSD3's. I believe mostly contributable to the differential.

I ended up swapping the open differential back into my base due to the very aggressive and nonpractical street nature of the Nismo LSD.

Conclusion:
Nismo, Quaife type LSD I would recommend only to those who track there car often, in which case you will love it

For a streetcar only, it is WAY too aggressive. stick with the viscuous lsd.

For the record: this is all IMHO

sensi09 · 07-02-2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Premo34WV

For those base model people considering and aftermarket LSD like Nismo or Quaife, take this into consideration before buying.
I previously had a base 350z (open differential) and swapped for the Nismo LSD

The 1.5 Nismo LSD definitely improved performance as far as off the line grip, corner entry and exit, maybe acceleration a bit, and for drifters it is a MUST HAVE.

For the everyday street drivers, I would not recommend this type of differential. The chattering and clunking noise is very very bad. Its loud and harsh. When making slow sharp turns, say in a parking lot for instance, the inside wheel would actually spudder and hop leaving rubber behind. I put only 7000 miles on a set of Goodyear F1 GSD3's. I believe mostly contributable to the differential.

I ended up swapping the open differential back into my base due to the very aggressive and nonpractical street nature of the Nismo LSD.

Conclusion:
Nismo, Quaife type LSD I would recommend only to those who track there car often, in which case you will love it

For a streetcar only, it is WAY too aggressive. stick with the viscuous lsd.

For the record: this is all IMHO

The quaife should be almost seamless with none of the low speed issues mentioned.

Along with the quaife, the carbonetics and cusco LSDs will be quite good for daily driven cars while also performing at the track.

cossie1600 · 06-30-2009, 07:42 AM

I think having the S mode as an option is great. Use it if you like, the ability to turn it off is priceless. I also love how it remembers the setting from the last time you start up, not some default setting like VDC.

Arguing over this is like talking about VDC, some people will swear by it and some people won't touch it with a 10 foot pole

blackbird · 06-30-2009, 08:28 PM

Got a base model. Knew I was going to do upgrades. Like the old geezer earlier, didn't need most of the extra stuff. Got NISMOS shocks, springs, sway bar and rear spoiler. Got Sport brakes from Concept Z . Good price. Next will be Quaife dif., Stillen Oil cooler, headers, HFC and intake. I think old guys who started on MGAs, Alfas, etc. pride ourselves on the heel-toe stuff.

travisjb · 06-30-2009, 10:49 PM

sounds like a great build blackbird, hope you start a journal in member gallery !

agree, lots of pride involved in the heel-toe debate... i think that's part of the issue... also it IS fun and satisfying when you do it well... I'm just trying to temper the view point that "you shouldn't bother racing unless..."... that kind of thing just hits me wrong... we can all agree that we want more people in the sport right ? no need to discourage anyone

tbonesteak · 07-01-2009, 01:18 AM

yeah, the srm is a track-aid tool and also a overall driver aid as:
the m mode is for the m3s, m5s, and m6s. Nobody calls them ******* at the track.
the abs is for all braking situations.
the bimmer's reverse roll-lock system is for their manual trannies.
the traction control system is for all cars equipped with it.
I'm willing to bet that there will be atleast one case in the history of the 370z era in which a life will be saved by the srm. I can think of many scenarios how this can happen. I'm all for it and i think it's a phenomenal system that a lot of automakers will replicate in the future models.

alexanderb · 07-01-2009, 03:30 AM

travisjb · 07-02-2009, 10:47 AM

good advice premo... one option is to have the diff adjusted with less engagement force - prob would have resolved your issues... also, clutch-type diffs like the carbonetic give you the same benefits but with a more progressive engagement and less of the problems you mention

fly yellow · 07-02-2009, 11:36 AM

I think what bothers people about the SRM is the fact that they know how to heel and toe and now some guy who just learned how to drive a manual the day before yesterday can achieve better results than they could ever hope to achieve the "old way". Technology is typically better than humans doing something. It's just like ABS. I know how to pump my brakes, but it is physically impossible for me to do it as quickly as the ABS system does, especially in a stressful situation when such a skill would be required.

travisjb · 07-02-2009, 09:02 PM

I WANT YOU TO BUY THE MANUAL ! LOL

One of the great things about SRM is that it takes some of the work out of shifting... I'd say get the auto if this were a dual-clutch auto like on porsche/audi/etc, but this auto is not nearly as efficient... buy the manual, get the clutch cable, have fun !

Zaku · 07-02-2009, 09:47 PM

Maybe I should go try the one they got that is the same config but manual, thing is it's yellow. As rare as that thing is and stuff I don't think I can do yellow it's just too bright hahaha.....argh... now Manual or Auto, Which Color...I really just want a nice Z I'll always be happy with, btw this is my first Nissan!

travisjb · 07-03-2009, 02:23 AM

no shortage of opinions on colors around here, check around... my preferences were silver, white, blue, black, and everything else

CBRich · 07-03-2009, 04:29 PM

Learning to heel toe lately (no SRM) and a successful execution is pure bliss. Not saying the SRM is not helpful but DIY sure is rewarding. To each his own. If you NEED the sport get it, but I plan to replace everything it includes so I didn't go with it.

06-30-2009, 10:49 PM	#7 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 189	sounds like a great build blackbird, hope you start a journal in member gallery ! agree, lots of pride involved in the heel-toe debate... i think that's part of the issue... also it IS fun and satisfying when you do it well... I'm just trying to temper the view point that "you shouldn't bother racing unless..."... that kind of thing just hits me wrong... we can all agree that we want more people in the sport right ? no need to discourage anyone __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

07-02-2009, 10:47 AM	#10 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 189	good advice premo... one option is to have the diff adjusted with less engagement force - prob would have resolved your issues... also, clutch-type diffs like the carbonetic give you the same benefits but with a more progressive engagement and less of the problems you mention __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

07-02-2009, 11:36 AM	#11 (permalink)
fly yellow Enthusiast Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 455 Drives: 09 yellow 370z Rep Power: 266	I think what bothers people about the SRM is the fact that they know how to heel and toe and now some guy who just learned how to drive a manual the day before yesterday can achieve better results than they could ever hope to achieve the "old way". Technology is typically better than humans doing something. It's just like ABS. I know how to pump my brakes, but it is physically impossible for me to do it as quickly as the ABS system does, especially in a stressful situation when such a skill would be required. __________________ A severed foot is the ultimate stocking stuffer. Mitch Hedberg

07-02-2009, 09:02 PM	#12 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 189	I WANT YOU TO BUY THE MANUAL ! LOL One of the great things about SRM is that it takes some of the work out of shifting... I'd say get the auto if this were a dual-clutch auto like on porsche/audi/etc, but this auto is not nearly as efficient... buy the manual, get the clutch cable, have fun ! __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

07-03-2009, 02:23 AM	#14 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 189	no shortage of opinions on colors around here, check around... my preferences were silver, white, blue, black, and everything else __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

07-02-2009, 10:27 AM	#3 (permalink)
Premo34WV Base Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Morgantown, W.Virginia Posts: 68 Drives: PW '09 370z Sp. 6mt Rep Power: 17	For those base model people considering and aftermarket LSD like Nismo or Quaife, take this into consideration before buying. I previously had a base 350z (open differential) and swapped for the Nismo LSD The 1.5 Nismo LSD definitely improved performance as far as off the line grip, corner entry and exit, maybe acceleration a bit, and for drifters it is a MUST HAVE. For the everyday street drivers, I would not recommend this type of differential. The chattering and clunking noise is very very bad. Its loud and harsh. When making slow sharp turns, say in a parking lot for instance, the inside wheel would actually spudder and hop leaving rubber behind. I put only 7000 miles on a set of Goodyear F1 GSD3's. I believe mostly contributable to the differential. I ended up swapping the open differential back into my base due to the very aggressive and nonpractical street nature of the Nismo LSD. Conclusion: Nismo, Quaife type LSD I would recommend only to those who track there car often, in which case you will love it For a streetcar only, it is WAY too aggressive. stick with the viscuous lsd. For the record: this is all IMHO

06-30-2009, 07:42 AM	#5 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 31	I think having the S mode as an option is great. Use it if you like, the ability to turn it off is priceless. I also love how it remembers the setting from the last time you start up, not some default setting like VDC. Arguing over this is like talking about VDC, some people will swear by it and some people won't touch it with a 10 foot pole

06-30-2009, 08:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
blackbird Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Nashua NH Posts: 179 Drives: 09 370Z BLk GTM TT Rep Power: 17	Got a base model. Knew I was going to do upgrades. Like the old geezer earlier, didn't need most of the extra stuff. Got NISMOS shocks, springs, sway bar and rear spoiler. Got Sport brakes from Concept Z . Good price. Next will be Quaife dif., Stillen Oil cooler, headers, HFC and intake. I think old guys who started on MGAs, Alfas, etc. pride ourselves on the heel-toe stuff.

07-01-2009, 01:18 AM	#8 (permalink)
tbonesteak Track Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Socal Posts: 914 Drives: MY09 MB 6MT Rep Power: 376	yeah, the srm is a track-aid tool and also a overall driver aid as: the m mode is for the m3s, m5s, and m6s. Nobody calls them ******* at the track. the abs is for all braking situations. the bimmer's reverse roll-lock system is for their manual trannies. the traction control system is for all cars equipped with it. I'm willing to bet that there will be atleast one case in the history of the 370z era in which a life will be saved by the srm. I can think of many scenarios how this can happen. I'm all for it and i think it's a phenomenal system that a lot of automakers will replicate in the future models.

07-01-2009, 03:30 AM	#9 (permalink)
alexanderb Base Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Manila Posts: 171 Drives: PG 370 Tour/Sprt/Nav Rep Power: 271

07-02-2009, 09:47 PM	#13 (permalink)
Zaku Base Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Maryland Posts: 76 Drives: 02 Honda Civic Si Rep Power: 17	Maybe I should go try the one they got that is the same config but manual, thing is it's yellow. As rare as that thing is and stuff I don't think I can do yellow it's just too bright hahaha.....argh... now Manual or Auto, Which Color...I really just want a nice Z I'll always be happy with, btw this is my first Nissan!

07-03-2009, 04:29 PM	#15 (permalink)
CBRich A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: SC Posts: 2,464 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 545	Learning to heel toe lately (no SRM) and a successful execution is pure bliss. Not saying the SRM is not helpful but DIY sure is rewarding. To each his own. If you NEED the sport get it, but I plan to replace everything it includes so I didn't go with it.

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