Mistubishi EVO vs 370Z

MightyBobo

Ryan - most people here have never even been on a track before, and are stuck on the mindset that RWD will always be optimal and AWD is inferior with equal drivers behind the wheel. Let the bench racing begin.

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I don't own a car anymore.

shabarivas

Hey Ryan... i dont know if you have driven an X before but what armensti said could not be closer to the truth... there are "drive assist" computers working always in the case of the X. It modulates power to each wheel based on turn in angle and what not... the car IS helping you drive and gives you a perception of going through a turn a lot smoother and faster (it is this way all the way up to the limit of the car ... and when you pass the limit and the computers start tripping out - you get into accidents)... All he was saying is the following - w/ an AWD you get tricked into a false sense of security - but essentially the car is doing the work that the driver should be doing hence you countersteer less etc etc... w/ a RWD... you gotta do the work...your diff can only help so much.

I can honestly say... driving the evo x made me MUCH crappier at driving any other car- even my G35 when I had both. It was noticeable to the point where my friends would tell me that I used to be better at driving my G before my Evo... Now that I dont have my X anymore - im back to RWD land and they tell me that now they notice the change ... driving isnt so sloppy...

MightyBobo

So, if the EVO X has computers to modulate power being put down to the wheels....what would we call SyncroRev Matching?

Some think these things dull the driving experience. Others think there is nothing wrong with it. Its a debate that will continue forever.

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I don't own a car anymore.

Ryan@Forged

I have indeed driven an X and I know what you are referring to. My original argument was of the 8/9 but in the case of the X I believe you are referring to the AYC System. One of us should have clarified which model Evo was being used as my comments were originally directed for the 8/9. However, where you may have assists on the X, etc it does not modulate what the car is and is not capable of. I don't feel it drives the car for you, although I will admit I can see that point of view. The statement that lead to this entire discussion was that the "370z handles better than the Evo" So from this point of view the Evo (X in this case) with all the driver assists would still handle better than the 370z correct?

Well said. I know countless drivers, some of them my friends, who don't know how to rev match, heel-toe, etc. Having a Rev Matching feature eliminates the need for this skill altogether. In my opinion if you don't know how to rev match you don't know how to properly drive a manual transmission. I see the rev matching feature more as driving the car for you than having computers that are calculating your pitch.

KingDavid

If you're talking about the vehicles being stock, what tool or process would you use to measure handling?

Ryan@Forged

How about same driver around the same track? 2 equally good drivers around the same track? You can measure it however you want. 2 comparisons have been mentioned. Stock and modded, but the same mods to both cars.

However... my personal opinion (sorry not trying to pick on you OP as you have already explained your name!) is that if you make a name such as "fill in the blank killer" you need to be prepared to take on any car you are calling out in your current state regardless of what the opposing car has done. So if you are stock and say in this case the Evo is modded you can say it is not fair, but you're the one who made the name so you should be able to back it up. Just my opinion.

KingDavid

I meant like lateral G's and slalom speeds. Things like that. Would that be accurate at all to show which car handles better?

I would like to be educated on the topic if you don't mind.

Ryan@Forged

On paper yes, you could do it that way. However I have found that while those tests are directly reflected to a cars handling they do not tell everything. I have always preferred track testing to see how a car performs.

KingDavid

Ahhh...Similar to power and weight numbers vs. what they actually put down at a 1/4 mile. Gotcha. Thanks. -_-

shabarivas

In an average drivers hands - the X / other evos will give you more confidence to push the car harder - with a RWD car... you will have to build that confidence over time and learning... by your logic... a twin clutch is way worse than a SRM system correct? Honestly - I can revmatch all day long and heel toe till the cows come home... but there is a certain awesome feeling you get when the car does it so amazingly well that you feel it would be stupid to try and be as good as the computer can. However - this does not stop me from turning off my SRM for spirited runs where I feel I need to stay sharp for when I want to drive other cars.. but its much less of a "auto-drive" feature than the AWD systems seen in the Evos / STis

bboypuertoroc

This so-called auto-drive feature is non-existent.

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Ryan@Forged

I think you are misinterpreting what I am trying to say. By my logic, no twin clutch is not worse than SRM. What I am trying to say is these aids take the driving skill out of the hands of the driver. They are great advancements in technology and I have no doubt that they work better than any human is capable of. I am not saying they are bad features in any way. At the same time I am not questioning your driving skills one bit. My point being that they do in fact lessen the amount of skill it takes to drive these cars. This discussion will never reach an agreement because it is that of opinion. You believe the AWD system is more of an auto drive while I believe auto rev match is more of an auto drive. Are either of us wrong? I don't think so, it's just opinion.

With that being said I still think the Evo's handle better than the 370z whether it be by electronic advancement, AWD, or by the drivers having more confidence in them.

shabarivas

So by that logic... how is a twin clutch not taking the "skill" out of driving ie - shifting? Are you serious? If SRM is taking skill away then so does a twin clutch... I agree that they are progressing towards making driving "easier" - whatever that means haha... but in an AWD car - which was unheard of until recent years - you get all 4 wheels on the ground w/ power... which is also a "technological advance" if you remember that it used to be JUST FWD and RWD.... so could we say that AWD takes skill away from driving? absolutely not... just like that SRM and dual clutches are just the way things are headed... its evolution... (no pun intended ) ... and it will be widely accepted once it proves itself ... just like AWD did.. just like dual clutches are doing now...

If you are saying it takes more skill to drive an evo at the limit than it does to drive a Z at its limit.. then you are lying to yourself... with all that said.. I do miss my X

Ryan@Forged

a twin clutch IS taking skill out of driving, I did not say it didn't. That was actually part of my previous point. I don't think one is worse than the other, they are equal in my mind. Wow, I am really not getting through to you. Nowhere did I say an Evo takes more skill to drive at the limit, all I said is that the Evo does not drive itself. I am a firm believer that RWD is more challenging to drive than AWD.

armensti

to make things a little bit clear when i posted before i was talking about the evo x. it distributes power to any wheel needed to gain traction to make the car handle better. i dont need to explain this to anyone because im sure most of you know this. a 370z does not do that, in fact most of the people turn off the traction control so that their in the control of the car.


about SYNCRO REV.

i learned how to drive stick on my 370z. within 2 weeks i was heel and towing and i was rev matching. i also learned how to dump the clutch and all the little goodies. BUT from the first time i got into the car i simple turned off the S-mode and i havent used it since. WHy? because i dont need the cars computer telling me what to do, i dont need the cars computer controlling each and every single movement that i make with the car. most of the passionate drivers who buy the 370z stick dont even use the syncro rev. the only time i could see myself using that is if im so tired that i cant even move my legs to make my job easier but like i stated before i dont like to use it and thats why i bought a manual car.

the only reason modern AWD cars keep up with the rwd cars is because of the cars computer system. if it was just a basic AWD 100% of the time it wouldnt even be a match for a rwd.

Modern AWD cars = perfect handling for anyone.. crappy driver, professional driver etc...

AWD 100% of the time = under steer, under steer and some more under steer for a basic driver and a great challenge for a professional driver

RWD = hard to drive for a basic driver...... a beast in the hands of a professional driver.

modding? ive tooken a Porsche carrera s... my cars STOCK

its all about the driver



by the way i just remembered something the evo x doesnt even come in stick lol




yeah and the nissan that you own is still computer controlled lloll