Steering lock problem solved (for real)

SurfDog · 06-19-2012, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheee!

Just a small warning to people:

Another member had an issue this week with the Power Distribution box unrelated to this mod. MAKE SURE the seal is good when you close up the fuse box after removing the steering lock fuse. His had a bad seal and was not watertight and all the water coming off the windshield drains past this fuse box area. His got wet and the resulting damage was extensive. Fried ECU, fried/melted fuse box. All was covered under warranty because of the defective seal, but I want to ensure people closed that box properly and snapped it shut tight. The repair bill was close to $7000 for the dealer, not including the $400 towing bill....

AWESOME safety tip. Thanks!!

kenchan · 06-19-2012, 03:30 PM

i too doubt the ecu learns steering lock environment either. it's like the ecu will not learn a dead door lock solenoid, or window motor, etc. not part of the critical parameters to run the engine/drivetrain efficiently.

but then again, i dont program car ecu's so wat the hell do i know.

daisuke149 · 06-19-2012, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenchan

i too doubt the ecu learns steering lock environment either. it's like the ecu will not learn a dead door lock solenoid, or window motor, etc. not part of the critical parameters to run the engine/drivetrain efficiently.

but then again, i dont program car ecu's so wat the hell do i know.

not true. Everytime you start the car the ecu is programmed to trigger the lock and wait for a response that the lock is released before starting

It would have a mode / instruction incase the fuse blows and it wouldnt get the response.

When you start the car it doesnt check if the doors are locked or unlocked.

ChrisSlicks · 06-19-2012, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daisuke149

It would have a mode / instruction incase the fuse blows and it wouldnt get the response.

Yes and no. It sends the unlock first, i.e. when the car is completely off and indicates LOCK on the starter button. Provided it can get position feedback on the lock position sensor (passive, doesn't require power to the lock directly) the car will start, if it can't get feedback then it will not start (e.g. harness unplugged).

My guess is that the people that are getting the delay are going directly from LOCK to START, where as the people that don't get the delay have the habit of putting the car in ACC mode first (which does the unlock step) and then starting. Just a guess, but something to try out.

kenchan · 06-19-2012, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daisuke149

not true. Everytime you start the car the ecu is programmed to trigger the lock and wait for a response that the lock is released before starting

It would have a mode / instruction incase the fuse blows and it wouldnt get the response.

When you start the car it doesnt check if the doors are locked or unlocked.

you're missing the point. i was stating the example that unlike the engine component parameters, steering locks have nothing to do with the engine performance. there's nothing for the ecu to 'learn.' it's only a pass/fail system for the steering lock.

im not here to make an argument. i am just here monitoring everyone's progress before i decide do do anything about mine.

carry on.

VCuomo · 06-19-2012, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daisuke149

not true. Everytime you start the car the ecu is programmed to trigger the lock and wait for a response that the lock is released before starting

It would have a mode / instruction incase the fuse blows and it wouldnt get the response. ...

This is not "learning", this is recovery from an error (timeout) condition.

Look, I suggest we agree to disagree on this issue. The only reason that I brought up the whole "ECU learning" thing is simply that I don't think there's any reason to recommend that anyone reset the ECU to try and get it to "learn" that the steering wheel lock is disabled.

The main thing is you and Baer383 did excellent work, and did us all a big favor, in discovering that removing the fuse will eliminate the steering wheel lock failure - it doesn't cost anything to implement, and can be easily reversed. The only side effect appears to be a once-in-a-while delay in starting the car. It's no big deal.

Peace.

Ubetit · 06-20-2012, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VCuomo

This is not "learning", this is recovery from an error (timeout) condition.

Look, I suggest we agree to disagree on this issue. The only reason that I brought up the whole "ECU learning" thing is simply that I don't think there's any reason to recommend that anyone reset the ECU to try and get it to "learn" that the steering wheel lock is disabled.

100% correct. The ECU encounters conditions and reacts to those conditions. It's all preprogrammed though.

There's a ton of guessing that is masquerading as fact in this thread. It's the reason i've stayed out of this thread but to correct the misread on the wiring schematic early on. The schematic shows that removing the fuse will disable the steering lock. What we can't be sure of is what the ECU does with that info, not from the schematic alone anyway. Obviously whatever condition the ECU sees doesn't prevent you from starting your car and driving off. My guess (with circuit design and repair experience) is that this mod is fine.

wheee! · 06-19-2012, 06:02 PM

^ you're welcome

Also, if anyone cares, I hooked up the UpRev cable to the car and checked for error codes and none were reported or logged.... all good.

As a side note, I wonder if UpRev would have the ability to control this Steering Lock circuit from within the Osiris software? You can disable a lot of other features like Auto Power Windows etc.... currently it cannot adjust Steering Lock settings but maybe an update could....

Baer383 · 06-19-2012, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheee!

^ you're welcome

Also, if anyone cares, I hooked up the UpRev cable to the car and checked for error codes and none were reported or logged.... all good.

As a side note, I wonder if UpRev would have the ability to control this Steering Lock circuit from within the Osiris software? You can disable a lot of other features like Auto Power Windows etc.... currently it cannot adjust Steering Lock settings but maybe an update could....

When you pulled the codes did you check just ECU or did you check the Body control module.

AlphaSnacks · 06-19-2012, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheee!

^ you're welcome

Also, if anyone cares, I hooked up the UpRev cable to the car and checked for error codes and none were reported or logged.... all good.

As a side note, I wonder if UpRev would have the ability to control this Steering Lock circuit from within the Osiris software? You can disable a lot of other features like Auto Power Windows etc.... currently it cannot adjust Steering Lock settings but maybe an update could....

The BCM on our cars seems to be split up into different layers it seems, because you can't control every BCM function for some reason. The 370Z's ECU in general is definitely more difficult than the 350Z's was, the 350Z certainly had more tinkering to be done with UpRev.

wheee! · 06-20-2012, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baer383

When you pulled the codes did you check just ECU or did you check the Body control module.

ECU and BCM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlphaSnacks

The BCM on our cars seems to be split up into different layers it seems, because you can't control every BCM function for some reason. The 370Z's ECU in general is definitely more difficult than the 350Z's was, the 350Z certainly had more tinkering to be done with UpRev.

I agree that the BCM is more of a 'Black Box' than ever. Still, there may be more access than we realize with the right software....

SPOHN · 06-20-2012, 08:58 AM

Can we all just settle on it works with no issues.

Alchemy · 06-20-2012, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

Can we all just settle on it works with no issues.

Its a great fix but much too much bickering has insued.

Red__Zed · 06-20-2012, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

Can we all just settle on it works with no issues.

Cutting down on comments like this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baer383

And you have read the wiring diagrams,talk to techs, and determined on your own that the ECU can't relearn,

To guys with 40 years of experience with electronics (and the right answer) will help.

Baer383 · 06-20-2012, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

To guys with 40 years of experience with electronics (and the right answer) will help.

Thanks for contributing.

06-19-2012, 06:02 PM	#8 (permalink)
wheee! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Mod Capital of Canada Age: 58 Posts: 7,354 Drives: cars. lots of cars. Rep Power: 40182	^ you're welcome Also, if anyone cares, I hooked up the UpRev cable to the car and checked for error codes and none were reported or logged.... all good. As a side note, I wonder if UpRev would have the ability to control this Steering Lock circuit from within the Osiris software? You can disable a lot of other features like Auto Power Windows etc.... currently it cannot adjust Steering Lock settings but maybe an update could.... __________________ H&R / Stillen / Berk / HKS / Swift / Michelin / UpRev / SPC / Amuse Rep / Seibon / Fringe XVO / TWM / more... My Journal

06-20-2012, 08:58 AM	#12 (permalink)
SPOHN A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Covington, GA Age: 46 Posts: 14,844 Drives: Waiting on next Z Rep Power: 222	Can we all just settle on it works with no issues. __________________

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06-19-2012, 03:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
kenchan A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: N/A Posts: 76,801 Drives: N/A Rep Power: 141521	i too doubt the ecu learns steering lock environment either. it's like the ecu will not learn a dead door lock solenoid, or window motor, etc. not part of the critical parameters to run the engine/drivetrain efficiently. but then again, i dont program car ecu's so wat the hell do i know.