2010 Consumer Reports Owner Survey says Z is 45% below average in reliability

theDreamer · 10-31-2010, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

I agree. I'd say if you have a cooler installed by a Nissan dealer and documented, it should have NO implications on your warranty at all.

Does that count for me?

m4a1mustang · 10-31-2010, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

Does that count for me?

Well apparently a supercharger had no implication on your transmission warranty status.

shadoquad · 10-31-2010, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

Does that count for me?

You can't put a warranty on Awesome.

Educ8r · 10-31-2010, 03:51 PM

After seeing the title of this thread and being bashed by people here because of my Z complaints, sorta does the following to me...

Endgame · 10-31-2010, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

i agree. I'd say if you have a cooler installed by a nissan dealer and documented, it should have no implications on your warranty at all.

sa weet!

m4a1mustang · 10-31-2010, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endgame

sa weet!

Sorry man, I didn't mean to imply that Nissan would honor warranty claims if you had an oil cooler installed. I meant it as in I wished that were the case.

TypeOne · 10-31-2010, 02:52 PM

Is the issue with the paint just from chips? What about fading or peeling clear coats?

The paint on my STi was really thin and over the years the silver started to fade pretty bad.

m4a1mustang · 10-31-2010, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TypeOne

Is the issue with the paint just from chips? What about fading or peeling clear coats?

The paint on my STi was really thin and over the years the silver started to fade pretty bad.

The paint and clear quality that Nissan uses on the Z's is very poor. The clear is ridiculously soft so it will chip and etch very, very easily.

OldGuy · 11-01-2010, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

The paint and clear quality that Nissan uses on the Z's is very poor. The clear is ridiculously soft so it will chip and etch very, very easily.

Sounds to me like this inferior paint/clearcoat situation could have the makings of a class action law suit. I've seen class actions filed over very speculative allegations of defect. These allegations seem to be supported in fact. A national level class action law firm should take a look at this one.

Jordo! · 10-31-2010, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleLion

Consumer Reports has published the results of its 2010 owner survey. The 370 has lost reliability points. It is now shown as solid black (much worse than average). The survey shows results for the 2009 Z. The 2010 hasn't been around long enough for them to rate it.

Engine Minor and Engine Cooling rated worse than average
Paint/trim, squeats and rattles, and body hardware all were rated (by owners) much worse than average.

Everything else, except for audio were rated much better than average.

None of this is a surprise to readers here. The ratings pretty well mirror how people here have discussed their cars. What is concerning to me is the worse than average rating on engine cooling. According to Nissan and backed up by forum members is that for normal driving the oil temps stay below excessive heating. The readers of Consumers Reports are not likely to be tracking their cars. That means a significant number of poeple who use their Z's on public roads are experiencing eil temperature problems. I am assuming it is oil temp, since I haven't seen any reports of water temp getting too high.

They rated the 370 as expected to be 45% below average reliability. The Infiniti G coupe, on the other hand, had much better than average reliability for engine cooling. With an overall reliability rating of average.
The overall rating suggests that G owners will have cars that are 42% above average in reliability. I don't understand how the same engine-transmission combination (7 speet AT) gets such vastly different owner ratings.

Probably the G gets better ratings in the "squeaks and rattles" dept. Also, I agree that G owners probably aren't beating up on the car quite as much, and thus not as likley to deal with oil temp issues.

I'm just disappointed that my fuel sender is bad -- it's a minor problem, but on a brand new car? Nissan should really find a better unit and issue a recall.

They should also extend the oil consumption TSB to the Z.

cab83_750 · 10-31-2010, 04:55 PM

IMHO, to the extreme, G drivers are grandpas and Z drivers are uncles. They are apples and oranges.

spearfish25 · 10-31-2010, 05:06 PM

I remember when people on this forum were getting these Consumer Reports surveys. It was during the height of what I call "The Great Oil Temp Scare of 2009". People frequently posted on the forum that they just got a survey and listed the oil temps as a key problem. The unfortunate backlash of that behavior is that those owners have now potentially lessened the resale value by getting us a nice black circle on CR. The reality of the oil temp 'problem' is that it's not really a problem. Most people (as shown by numerous impromptu surveys on this site) have never really had a PROBLEM with oil temperatures. They were perceived problems when the temp gauge went to 240F but there was never limp mode or engine failures due to the temps. Those of us who track the car have experienced a true need for oil coolers, but that should not get reflected in a CR survey.

A special thanks to everyone who vented their frustration of a not-so-real problem during street driving by filling out the survey with frivolous complaints.

A real survey should give low marks for the following areas: 1) cabin noise during highway driving (it's a sports car but it shouldn't be this loud), 2) inaccurate fuel gauges, 3) high pitch whining sound from ECU (many people certainly have this), 4) brittle paint.

Fortunately, not a single one of those issues would change my mind about buying the car.

Check out the definitions of the areas where the Z faired poorly in the survey. The real irony is that we're going to get a nasty symbol for 'engine major' now that people are starting to freak about oil consumption too. My guess at the issue getting the low marks for each area is listed in blue italics.

Engine, minor: Oil leaks, accessory belts, engine mounts, engine knock or ping. people complaining of valvetrain noise from the VVEL (probably no real problem present), a few may have reported their blown aftermarket oil cooler lines as oil leaks which would be ridiculous

Engine, cooling: Radiator, cooling fan, antifreeze leaks, water pump, thermostat, overheating. The Great Oil Temp Scare of 2009

Paint/trim: Paint (fading, chalking, cracking, or peeling), loose exterior trim or moldings, rust. easily chipped paint, a few orange peel complaints, the random unhappiness from swirls on black paint

Body integrity: Squeaks or rattles, seals and/or weather-stripping, air or water leaks, loose interior trim and moldings, wind noise. road noise mainly during highway driving and debris hitting wheel liners

Body hardware: Windows, locks and latches, tailgate, hatch or trunk, doors or sliding doors, mirrors, seat controls, seat belts, sunroof, convertible top, glass defects. the 'stuck hatch' issue and the base model seats moving around

c41006 · 10-31-2010, 05:50 PM

I don't get how those relatively minor issues landed us with the worst possible overall reliability rating. A solid black dot I mean come on it cant be that bad

spearfish25 · 10-31-2010, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by c41006

I don't get how those relatively minor issues landed us with the worst possible overall reliability rating. A solid black dot I mean come on it cant be that bad

CR says that if they get over 3% of surveys with those complaints, the vehicle gets a black circle for that category.

m4a1mustang · 10-31-2010, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

CR says that if they get over 3% of surveys with those complaints, the vehicle gets a black circle for that category.

Wow... that's a really tight tolerance.

I could understand maybe 3.5/5 stars for quality because of some of the issues the Z's have, but reliability?

Aside from the problems some of the 6MTs experience (CSC failures and bum synchros) the rest of the mechanical reliability problems seem to be anomalies only.

Pretty unfortunate if you ask me. And yeah, given the number of buyers that consult CR before making a used vehicle purchase this could definitely impact resale value for the negative.

10-31-2010, 05:06 PM	#12 (permalink)
spearfish25 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Naples, FL Posts: 4,117 Drives: to work Rep Power: 1857	I remember when people on this forum were getting these Consumer Reports surveys. It was during the height of what I call "The Great Oil Temp Scare of 2009". People frequently posted on the forum that they just got a survey and listed the oil temps as a key problem. The unfortunate backlash of that behavior is that those owners have now potentially lessened the resale value by getting us a nice black circle on CR. The reality of the oil temp 'problem' is that it's not really a problem. Most people (as shown by numerous impromptu surveys on this site) have never really had a PROBLEM with oil temperatures. They were perceived problems when the temp gauge went to 240F but there was never limp mode or engine failures due to the temps. Those of us who track the car have experienced a true need for oil coolers, but that should not get reflected in a CR survey. A special thanks to everyone who vented their frustration of a not-so-real problem during street driving by filling out the survey with frivolous complaints. A real survey should give low marks for the following areas: 1) cabin noise during highway driving (it's a sports car but it shouldn't be this loud), 2) inaccurate fuel gauges, 3) high pitch whining sound from ECU (many people certainly have this), 4) brittle paint. Fortunately, not a single one of those issues would change my mind about buying the car. Check out the definitions of the areas where the Z faired poorly in the survey. The real irony is that we're going to get a nasty symbol for 'engine major' now that people are starting to freak about oil consumption too. My guess at the issue getting the low marks for each area is listed in blue italics. Engine, minor: Oil leaks, accessory belts, engine mounts, engine knock or ping. people complaining of valvetrain noise from the VVEL (probably no real problem present), a few may have reported their blown aftermarket oil cooler lines as oil leaks which would be ridiculous Engine, cooling: Radiator, cooling fan, antifreeze leaks, water pump, thermostat, overheating. The Great Oil Temp Scare of 2009 Paint/trim: Paint (fading, chalking, cracking, or peeling), loose exterior trim or moldings, rust. easily chipped paint, a few orange peel complaints, the random unhappiness from swirls on black paint Body integrity: Squeaks or rattles, seals and/or weather-stripping, air or water leaks, loose interior trim and moldings, wind noise. road noise mainly during highway driving and debris hitting wheel liners Body hardware: Windows, locks and latches, tailgate, hatch or trunk, doors or sliding doors, mirrors, seat controls, seat belts, sunroof, convertible top, glass defects. the 'stuck hatch' issue and the base model seats moving around __________________ 2013 Cadillac V-Wagon, RIP Z Last edited by spearfish25; 10-31-2010 at 05:27 PM.

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10-31-2010, 03:51 PM	#4 (permalink)
Educ8r Enthusiast Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Houston Posts: 397 Drives: a car Rep Power: 17	After seeing the title of this thread and being bashed by people here because of my Z complaints, sorta does the following to me...

10-31-2010, 02:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
TypeOne A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 2,682 Drives: BSM 370 Rep Power: 1852	Is the issue with the paint just from chips? What about fading or peeling clear coats? The paint on my STi was really thin and over the years the silver started to fade pretty bad.

10-31-2010, 04:55 PM	#11 (permalink)
cab83_750 Track Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: CA Posts: 887 Drives: 09 NISSAN 370Z Rep Power: 418	IMHO, to the extreme, G drivers are grandpas and Z drivers are uncles. They are apples and oranges.

10-31-2010, 05:50 PM	#13 (permalink)
c41006 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Atlanta Posts: 9,034 Drives: '10 G37 Coupe BO 7AT Rep Power: 114	I don't get how those relatively minor issues landed us with the worst possible overall reliability rating. A solid black dot I mean come on it cant be that bad