370 debate on Camaro board

[LiquidZ]

Oh yes people, SVT is still around. Today, SVT no longer has the presence as it did with the 03-04 Cobras and Lightning trucks but it is still around. Take a look at the SVT Raptor that was just released. It is a firm belief of mine that if it was an SVT Cobra instead of a Shelby Cobra, it would sell a hell of a lot better.

Also, the GT500 motor in itself is a "terminator" too. Evo performance (search youtube) swapped out the stock S/C pulley to one that produces upwards of 21 psi and a shot of nitrous to boot. Took it like a champ and ran 9's and 10's all day long. No change of internals either.

P.S. I'm a closet Muscle fan.

[Crash]

Yeah, you wouldn't need to change the internals. Those motors are unstoppable. I was waiting for someone to run an SVT in the gumball.

I love muscle cars just like I love performance exotics and imports. A car is a car to me, no matter where it comes from. I have those American roots when it comes to muscle cars, but I'm VERY into advanced technology too. My Dad had a 69 RS SS with a 396. I wish he still had it. I've gone through a few muscle cars too. But I think I need something different. Nissan has great build qualities in their cars, and I'll be sticking with them for a while. My daily needs to be reliable while I build my other cars.

[Zerafian]

Originally Posted by Crash

SOME of them are reasonable. Just like SOME of them are saying the Camaro will out-handle the Corvette and the 370z.

I definetly wasnt defending them...HA! But I. getting your sarcasm....and agree

[Mental Block]

^ Not to go off topic but I love your avatar!

SC ftw

[18rgcelica73]

I love the picture in his signature.

[blackdragon]

yeah its pretty cool haha

[Hypnoz]

Originally Posted by Crash

You're forgetting a VERY important factor in this math: GEARING!

Camaro SS: 408tq * 3.45 * 3.01 = 4236.876 (First gear) <--- Notice the Tq number is corrected here, it is not 424, it's 408.

370z: 270 * 3.794 * 3.692 = 3782.01096 (First gear)

NOW do the math on tq/lbs:

Camaro: 1.09lbstq/1Lbs weight

370z: 1.18lbstq/1Lbs weight

The Z CLEARLY has more torque per pound. But the numbers are still very close and the Camaro has the benefit of a live axle vs. IRS. That being said, it is DEFINITELY a drivers race and will certainly come down to the wire with both cars.

I got my information from:
Nissan 370Z Official Specs Released from Nissan 11.15.08
AND
http://krang.superchevy.com/features...ifications.pdf <--- Assuming that these are correct.

Biggest thing you aren't taking into concideration: real hp/tq from each engine.
Nissan rates the VQ at 332hp/270tq, however dyno's reveal 270whp-290whp.
Chevy rates the LS3 422hp/408tq. However, dyno's reveal 370-390whp

Roughly the Chevy LS3, if rated like Nissan rates the VQ would be rated around 449hp/434tq.

Also what about 2nd and 3rd gears?

And as others have said, the Camaro will have fully independent suspension.

Overall the Z will probably brake better, handle better and have a better interior than the Camaro. If all you car about is straight line speed than go with the Camaro because it's a proven fact that the LS engines respond very very well to mods. The VQ is much harder to extract power from per $$.

[Crash]

^^^ Don't forget about drive train loss and what not. GM drivetrains suck when it comes to keeping power. They're very heavy stock and not very efficient.

But yes, my numbers were for REAL tq. Power can't be messured the same way, unfortunately. There's a completely different math you need to use, however, you can still do the math with BHP.

But I'm sure you know it's not power that wins 1/4 mile races, it's torque. That was my goal, to show how the Z puts down more torque to the wheels per pound that the car weighs than the Camaro. Arguing beyond first gear is pointless because the Camaro will not have a close-ratio transmission. GM gears are always tall. The Z will have short gears up to 5th, so it's a crap shoot since the LSx motors make more torque at lower RPMs.

Yes, I know LSx motors make power very easily with a few little mods here and there. I used to own one. Just an intake, long tubes and a tune would give you 40RWHP with those motors. I'm all about straight line AND the twisties, which is why I made my decision, although, if it I were getting another American car, it'd be the Challenger, not a GM. I will NEVER buy another GM until their environmental and political goals align with mine.

[Hypnoz]

Originally Posted by Crash

^^^ Don't forget about drive train loss and what not. GM drivetrains suck when it comes to keeping power. They're very heavy stock and not very efficient.

But yes, my numbers were for REAL tq. Power can't be messured the same way, unfortunately. There's a completely different math you need to use, however, you can still do the math with BHP.

But I'm sure you know it's not power that wins 1/4 mile races, it's torque. That was my goal, to show how the Z puts down more torque to the wheels per pound that the car weighs than the Camaro. Arguing beyond first gear is pointless because the Camaro will not have a close-ratio transmission. GM gears are always tall. The Z will have short gears up to 5th, so it's a crap shoot since the LSx motors make more torque at lower RPMs.

Yes, I know LSx motors make power very easily with a few little mods here and there. I used to own one. Just an intake, long tubes and a tune would give you 40RWHP with those motors. I'm all about straight line AND the twisties, which is why I made my decision, although, if it I were getting another American car, it'd be the Challenger, not a GM. I will NEVER buy another GM until their environmental and political goals align with mine.

True but since there are wtq numbers available, that already takes drivetrain loss into account. The Z has a decent disadvantage.

Also I agree with your last point. Why would I buy back my own money we're giving to them?

Plus I'd rather have a Z from everything known so far.

[Crash]

Where have you seen WTQ numbers??? I've only seen crank.

[Hypnoz]

Originally Posted by Crash

Where have you seen WTQ numbers??? I've only seen crank.

Search for LS3 vette dyno's for wtq numbers and G37 or 370z for wtq for the VQ37HR

[1stNissan]

Interesting read. IMO, both cars (stock), will be neck n neck on the streets. The Z has a significant weight advantage while the SS has a huge amount of HP/TQ. The SS is close to 2 tons but has the TQ to pull it. All this bickering will be solved by the summer when both cars are out & lined up. I cant wait.

[frost]

I wouldn't say there is much (if any) bickering here, now the camaro board ... those dudes are bickering.

[Crash]

Corvette Drivetrain is NOT the same as the Camaros. Not by any means. Not the same Tranny, and will not have the same diff, suspension, etc... Not to mention that Corvettes use Torque Tubes so that the tranny is mounted in the back like a transaxle. The Camaro wheels are heavier and taller (reducing tq to the ground) also.

There will be significant differences between wheel tq between the Vettes and the Camaros. Trust me.

[1stNissan]

Originally Posted by Crash

Corvette Drivetrain is NOT the same as the Camaros. Not by any means. Not the same Tranny, and will not have the same diff, suspension, etc... Not to mention that Corvettes use Torque Tubes so that the tranny is mounted in the back like a transaxle. The Camaro wheels are heavier and taller (reducing tq to the ground) also.

There will be significant differences between wheel tq between the Vettes and the Camaros. Trust me.

Couldn't have said it better myself!