So just ordered my Stillen SC

Rob Ainscough · 09-23-2014, 08:13 PM

Does anyone ring/groove these Nissan motors to prep for FI?

Cheers, Rob.

Pro4Jackster · 09-23-2014, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

So u upgraded the v3 saw no returns except a blown motor, and the plan now is to build the motor and try upgading the v3 again to solve it? Einstien once had a famous quote about that lol best of luck tho it sucks having your car down for extended periods of time.

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YSI trim = 1600 CFM - 1200 hp - not known if it fits, redesign odd shaped inlet or cut core support.
TI trim = 1400 CFM - 950 hp - fits, 0.25" larger inlet (hope to stretch Stillens odd intake boot and reuse.
SI trim = 1150 CFM - 775 hp - fits with no mods
SCI trim = 1050 CFM - 725 hp - comes with kit

I know you already know all of this based on your posts. But why do you recommend skipping the Ti trim? It seems like a perfect fit for a built motor Stillen Kit. It should be able to support 700 whp if you can get the Stillen framework to keep up. That is overkill for a streetcar. The fitment unknowns and cost of fitting a YSi don't seem to make sense to me. Is there a part of this equation I am overlooking?

Z&I · 09-23-2014, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

So u upgraded the v3 saw no returns except a blown motor, and the plan now is to build the motor and try upgading the v3 again to solve it? Einstien once had a famous quote about that lol best of luck tho it sucks having your car down for extended periods of time.

More to it than that ...
Got an extra 65 whp + a flat 378 tqe curve from the V-3Si, 1000 injectors, fuel pump and Tune. (there was plenty more to the build)
That would have put me in the high 11's.
But the motor blew on deceleration the first pass.
Jury is still out as to the exact cause of the grenade.

Back to the drawing board ...
I've done as much homework as humanly possible regarding this ... there aren't a whole lot of 370's out there that are seriously drag racing...so there isn't much of a pool of experiential knowledge to draw on.
I'm NOT upgrading the V-3, but stepping up to the V-2Ti ... and it's performance specs meet my realistic goals...understood ?

Though I am not sure of the reference to Einstein here, except in the context of blindly continuing a repeated task and in hopes of obtaining a different result - which is one of the definitions of insane thinking or reasoning.
I will assure you that this is not the case here.

If you can supply a complete plan with parts and part numbers of all that is required that will allow me to install a V-7 in my car that will give more usable power, be reliable, and won't overpower the cars ability to keep it hooked up, maybe then we can talk more ...

I think tho' that we've both stated our cases here and perhaps should continue this discussion back channel for now just to keep on topic ...

1slow370 · 09-23-2014, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pro4Jackster

YSI trim = 1600 CFM - 1200 hp - not known if it fits, redesign odd shaped inlet or cut core support.
TI trim = 1400 CFM - 950 hp - fits, 0.25" larger inlet (hope to stretch Stillens odd intake boot and reuse.
SI trim = 1150 CFM - 775 hp - fits with no mods
SCI trim = 1050 CFM - 725 hp - comes with kit

I know you already know all of this based on your posts. But why do you recommend skipping the Ti trim? It seems like a perfect fit for a built motor Stillen Kit. It should be able to support 700 whp if you can get the Stillen framework to keep up. That is overkill for a streetcar. The fitment unknowns and cost of fitting a YSi don't seem to make sense to me. Is there a part of this equation I am overlooking?

the v3 gear case is weak and its cfm numbers are overstated, the blower itself is meh before you even get to the crappy volute designs available for it. you run to big of a compressor to fast on a v3 and it will die eventually, the v4 has a better ratio, stronger gears, larger faster bearings and is built to be abused. i know lots of guys with v1 v2 and v3 blowers(or had lol) that the chargers have "broken in" and gotten louder cuz there bearings died. 928 mospo's main buisness is rebuilding the little **** case vortechs when guys realize they are blown. vortechs cfm numbers online are good guesses at best. there is a secret way to get a v4 to put out a torque curve at the same power level as a smaller charger that will murder the smaller charger.

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Pro4Jackster · 09-23-2014, 08:51 PM

Z&I:

I had almost identical results with the Si and cogs (34T/30T) on my HR. Mine was making 450hp/375tq on a mustang dyno. It made 15 psi by 6700 RPMs and held 15 psi (belt slip) to redline. It broke a rod shortly after on the dyno. After building the motor, my next step was to either try to run a 34T/28T cog setup, or swap to the Ti trim. Then experiment with IAT sensor in Intake manifold, move MAFs, cut core support and install a larger filter as close as possible to the inlet.

Pro4Jackster · 09-23-2014, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

the v3 gear case is weak and its cfm numbers are overstated, the blower itself is meh before you even get to the crappy volute designs available for it. you run to big of a compressor to fast on a v3 and it will die eventually, the v4 has a better ratio, stronger gears, larger faster bearings and is built to be abused. i know lots of guys with v1 v2 and v3 blowers(or had lol) that the chargers have "broken in" and gotten louder cuz there bearings died. 928 mospo's main buisness is rebuilding the little **** case vortechs when guys realize they are blown. vortechs cfm numbers online are good guesses at best. there is a secret way to get a v4 to put out a torque curve at the same power level as a smaller charger that will murder the smaller charger.

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Makes sense. Are there any V1, V2, or V3 that can run the HD bearings Ive heard of? What secret, wastegate and boost controller on the charge pipe or flow restricter before the s/c inlet?

Z&I · 09-23-2014, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pro4Jackster

YSI trim = 1600 CFM - 1200 hp - not known if it fits, redesign odd shaped inlet or cut core support.
TI trim = 1400 CFM - 950 hp - fits, 0.25" larger inlet (hope to stretch Stillens odd intake boot and reuse.
SI trim = 1150 CFM - 775 hp - fits with no mods
SCI trim = 1050 CFM - 725 hp - comes with kit

I know you already know all of this based on your posts. But why do you recommend skipping the Ti trim? It seems like a perfect fit for a built motor Stillen Kit. It should be able to support 700 whp if you can get the Stillen framework to keep up. That is overkill for a streetcar. The fitment unknowns and cost of fitting a YSi don't seem to make sense to me. Is there a part of this equation I am overlooking?

Thanks for chiming in here with these specs!

1Slow's point here is that these specs are overly enthusiastic ... Much like the factory stock rating of 332 BHP is really more like 280(?)whp ...
The 280(?)whp being the more realistic when it comes to actual performance.

That being said, the Ti trim being rated at up 950 hp - actually is about 750 whp.
Still good enuff for me ... plus it will bolt right in with only having to enlarge the input piping.

Offer still stands to 1Slow' - would be willing to upgrade to the V-7 if it makes sense ... and I am willing to stand corrected.

Pro4Jackster · 09-23-2014, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z&I

Thanks for chiming in here with these specs!

1Slow's point here is that these specs are overly enthusiastic ... Much like the factory stock rating of 332 BHP is really more like 280(?)whp ...
The 280(?)whp being the more realistic when it comes to actual performance.

That being said, the Ti trim being rated at up 950 hp - actually is about 750 whp.
Still good enuff for me ... plus it will bolt right in with only having to enlarge the input piping.

Offer still stands to 1Slow' - would be willing to upgrade to the V-7 if it makes sense ... and I am willing to stand corrected.

Another thing to remember is the additional parasitic losses from the supercharger itself. A very Vortech savy member on my350z estimated he was losing an additional 10-15% to the supercharger at 17 psi. If correct, that would push the Ti's potential whp down to 600-700. Have you checked into the calculated losses when pushing the psi limits of these head units?

1slow370 · 09-24-2014, 12:06 AM

Exactly the horsepower numbers on vortechs site are overated badly hoping the ti gets you the power or KNOWING the v7 can do it easily when pullied down is a gamble i wouldnt want to make you want to spend 2000 to find out you may need to do it again?

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Z&I · 09-24-2014, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pro4Jackster

Another thing to remember is the additional parasitic losses from the supercharger itself. A very Vortech savy member on my350z estimated he was losing an additional 10-15% to the supercharger at 17 psi. If correct, that would push the Ti's potential whp down to 600-700. Have you checked into the calculated losses when pushing the psi limits of these head units?

Yes, I have considered the parasitic loss ... it is inherent with superchargers.
That's where Tubo's have the advantage in efficiency.
According to Bobby at CINmotorsport, bottom line with all factors being considered, the T-2Ti's are good for that 600-700 hp number, so, at least on paper, I'm good to go.
I'd be happy with anything close to 600 for now.
Time will tell.
Just need to keep the belts on the pulleys @ 15-16 psi.
Thanks for turning me on to the blower bracket brace you had made by Jtrans.

I really appreciate all of this input - and now I'm really really hoping I've made the right decision!

Who knows, I may have to upgrade again if 600 doesn't quite do it....

Z&I · 09-24-2014, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370

Exactly the horsepower numbers on vortechs site are overated badly hoping the ti gets you the power or KNOWING the v7 can do it easily when pullied down is a gamble i wouldnt want to make you want to spend 2000 to find out you may need to do it again?

Thanks, I've tried my best to figure this all out and make an intelligent decision based on everything I've been able to find out and learn.
Starting from scratch, I've had to filter through a lot of information and advice...double checking it all again and again.

It's been a year now since first deciding to upgrade the stock Stillen kit.
Seemed a simple 2 week project initially, but has now grown in to an enormous undertaking.
It WILL be nice to drive the car again tho' !!!

mikey1600 · 12-24-2014, 01:40 AM

So had my kit on now for a few months, next lot of upgrades are in the works; this will be done in the next 3-6 months.

stock clutch is getting smelly! so not driving it too hard lately, just the odd run here and there, waiting on my new clutch kit to arrive (probably 4-5 weeks cause of xmas/new years), getting a southbend stage 3 daily kit with the lighter flywheel etc. Will get this in, have tune double checked at another shop recently recommended to me, A/F ratios atm look a bit high, but it's safe so it's fine at the moment.

While clutch is going in or soon after, I'm waiting on some pricing back from the Australian vortech distributor who does all the work here to upgrade the impeller on the unit + changing to a slightly smaller pulley again from the 9lb stillen kit, upgrading fuel system to E85 with a CJ Motorsports kit and get it re-tuned for the E85 all at the same time.

will let you guys know when done

JWillis72 · 12-24-2014, 08:22 AM

So you are going higher boost than the 9lb pulley and the impeller upgrade? You are aware this has ended in some blown motors? I'm interested to see this tried and hope it works for you.

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ANMVQ · 12-24-2014, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWillis72

So you are going higher boost than the 9lb pulley and the impeller upgrade? You are aware this has ended in some blown motors? I'm interested to see this tried and hope it works for you.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Some I think all did, Didn't they, Yes I'm in that BOOM boat :/

mikey1600 · 12-26-2014, 02:16 AM

yeah, no one was running E85 though, were any of the blown guys running the frozenboost heat exchanger upgrade as well?

09-23-2014, 08:51 PM	#290 (permalink)
Pro4Jackster Base Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NW Houston Posts: 130 Drives: '08 350Z Rep Power: 13	Z&I: I had almost identical results with the Si and cogs (34T/30T) on my HR. Mine was making 450hp/375tq on a mustang dyno. It made 15 psi by 6700 RPMs and held 15 psi (belt slip) to redline. It broke a rod shortly after on the dyno. After building the motor, my next step was to either try to run a 34T/28T cog setup, or swap to the Ti trim. Then experiment with IAT sensor in Intake manifold, move MAFs, cut core support and install a larger filter as close as possible to the inlet. __________________ Jtranbuilt '08 Z [Jtran PT7075 Single - Fujitsubo - Transgo - Wilwood - TE37SL - BC Racing]

09-24-2014, 12:06 AM	#294 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7250	Exactly the horsepower numbers on vortechs site are overated badly hoping the ti gets you the power or KNOWING the v7 can do it easily when pullied down is a gamble i wouldnt want to make you want to spend 2000 to find out you may need to do it again? Sent from my HTCONE using Tapatalk __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

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09-23-2014, 08:13 PM	#286 (permalink)
Rob Ainscough Base Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Concord CA Age: 59 Posts: 14 Drives: 15 370z Sport Tech Rep Power: 10	Does anyone ring/groove these Nissan motors to prep for FI? Cheers, Rob.

12-24-2014, 01:40 AM	#297 (permalink)
mikey1600 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 503 Drives: MY11 370z Black Rep Power: 15	So had my kit on now for a few months, next lot of upgrades are in the works; this will be done in the next 3-6 months. stock clutch is getting smelly! so not driving it too hard lately, just the odd run here and there, waiting on my new clutch kit to arrive (probably 4-5 weeks cause of xmas/new years), getting a southbend stage 3 daily kit with the lighter flywheel etc. Will get this in, have tune double checked at another shop recently recommended to me, A/F ratios atm look a bit high, but it's safe so it's fine at the moment. While clutch is going in or soon after, I'm waiting on some pricing back from the Australian vortech distributor who does all the work here to upgrade the impeller on the unit + changing to a slightly smaller pulley again from the 9lb stillen kit, upgrading fuel system to E85 with a CJ Motorsports kit and get it re-tuned for the E85 all at the same time. will let you guys know when done

12-24-2014, 08:22 AM	#298 (permalink)
JWillis72 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Fort Myers FL Posts: 2,002 Drives: 2009 370Z yellow 7AT Rep Power: 44	So you are going higher boost than the 9lb pulley and the impeller upgrade? You are aware this has ended in some blown motors? I'm interested to see this tried and hope it works for you. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

12-26-2014, 02:16 AM	#300 (permalink)
mikey1600 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 503 Drives: MY11 370z Black Rep Power: 15	yeah, no one was running E85 though, were any of the blown guys running the frozenboost heat exchanger upgrade as well?