Mods needed to support 550 WHP Centrifugal SC kit

Senna-F1 · 11-19-2017, 11:24 PM

Trying to figure out what I will need for a 550+ WHP E85 SC kit?

Not sure about some of this. Should I get the 4 bar MAP sensor? What if the Gauge I have selected comes with a 3 bar MAP sensor? Do I need both? Gauge also comes with Ethanol sensor, which I assume can be used for ECUTEK as well?

Google Doc for Details

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

turtle64b · 11-20-2017, 06:57 AM

Looks pretty good! My first suggestion is to search around for secondhand parts. Things like oil coolers and such that have no moving parts don't lose a lot of functionality over time, so get'em cheap, flush'em and then put'em on!

I took a pass on the oil pan spacer. It's not gonna really serve any purpose, especially with that oil cooler. I have a 34-row on my car and oil temps stay sub-200 daily and barely break 200 track time, even in South Carolina summer. I got a used F.I. 34-row cooler for $500 shipped.

I went S1-SE for my fuel return system and I would recommend it. I think the S2-SE (linked and priced for on your list) only adds a larger fuel return line. I have a buddy (Woo here on the forum) running the same setup as you are building for, except with the addition of the 9lb pulley, with no fuel upgrades (aside from injectors) just fine. The billet tophat is also a great choice!

For the fuel pump, I went with the Aeromotive stealth 340. 455 might be way more than you need but if you get a deal or something, no reason to pass it up.

I also chose the ID 1050x injectors. When I did my data runs on my second tune revision, I believe they were at ~50% duty cycle at my peak power production (I've put down 410/310 so far, wrong tune rev....).

I have an auto tranny, so I'll let the manual guys pipe in about the clutch.

As for exhaust, it's whatever sounds good to you, in my opinion. I went with a Borla catback and Z1 test pipes because I think it sounds great! But to each their own.

For your tune, talk to your tuner about the sensors for it. I went through SpecialtyZ and they supplied the pressure sensor. They are Ecutek and will give you tune support for a year. Also, Sebastian is pretty great as well as experienced with our setups (SC A2A).

The attached picture is a little disorganized spreadsheet of my build stuff. Everything in bold is on my car with the exception of the Z1 intake manifold.

I did my install in my garage over the course of a few days, if you have any questions, I'll be more than happy to do my best to answer them! Here's the link to my build thread: Turtle64b's Stillen Build Thread.

TopgunZ · 11-20-2017, 07:18 AM

Turtle64B did a good job stating some of the non-necessary parts and pointing to the right direction.

The only thing I would suggest is you do indeed want that 480 walbro if your going E85. I ran the 340 and it couldnt keep up and became my limiting factor. They are basically the same price and you dont want a few dollar difference in pump wasting your $1500 fuel system. The only drawback is they heat the fuel up more but E85 runs super cold so it helps even things out.

I would say if your hitting 550whp you will be well over the 375tq mark. More like 425.
I was at 525/414.

PS. I dont see tires on the list. Your going to be in neutral if on stockers..lol.

turtle64b · 11-20-2017, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopgunZ

PS. I dont see tires on the list. Your going to be in neutral if on stockers..lol.

I would post my videos of my trip to the drag strip Saturday if it was anything more than tires squealing and BOV air haha. But really. Bigger. Better. Tires. Suspension mods help too haha

bcfromfl · 11-20-2017, 08:32 AM

I'm putting together the same list as you, so I can gauge whether or not this upgrade is within my budget. I noticed a couple of things from your list.

1) It looks like you haven't checked the box for the 34-row cooler. I don't think you'd want to drive very far at this level of power without the cooler. (I see the price to the right on your list, so maybe you just missed the checkmark.)

2) You'll either need a welding shop to modify your crash bar, or purchase Fast Intentions crash bar.

Also, I don't see the Ecutek hardware on your list. Do you already have it installed? You may want to add the RJM pedal, too, and a catch can.

I'm eager to see what Topz will be putting together.

TopgunZ · 11-20-2017, 09:20 AM

I ran without an oil cooler the whole time I was supercharged and never seen more than 240*. This was a street queen car so it never seen track days. I think a lot of the "must have an oil cooler" info comes from the turbo world since they use oil to cool the turbo so it heats it up even more. I could be way off and am in no way saying not to get one, but just saying I ran without one and it wasn't a problem. I will add up north though so southern heat is different.

bcfromfl · 11-20-2017, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopgunZ

I ran without an oil cooler the whole time I was supercharged and never seen more than 240*. This was a street queen car so it never seen track days. I think a lot of the "must have an oil cooler" info comes from the turbo world since they use oil to cool the turbo so it heats it up even more. I could be way off and am in no way saying not to get one, but just saying I ran without one and it wasn't a problem. I will add up north though so southern heat is different.

I'm not sure which years/models came with the OEM cooler -- did yours at least have the OEM one?

TopgunZ · 11-20-2017, 10:34 AM

2009 and it didn't have the factory. I did forget to mention that I had an oil pan spacer though since I couldn't get it back off and bought a new one to sell with the turbo kit that I had put it on for. So maybe that helped more than I thought.

Jayhovah · 11-20-2017, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TopgunZ

I ran without an oil cooler the whole time I was supercharged and never seen more than 240*. This was a street queen car so it never seen track days. I think a lot of the "must have an oil cooler" info comes from the turbo world since they use oil to cool the turbo so it heats it up even more. I could be way off and am in no way saying not to get one, but just saying I ran without one and it wasn't a problem. I will add up north though so southern heat is different.

I am TT and run without an external oil cooler, though I have the OEM cooler and the GTM oil pan which acts as a gigantic heat sink and provides additional capacity.

Based on claims in this community that the OEM cooler was ineffective, I did try deleting it for a while and what I found was that this claim is completely inaccurate - the OEM cooler does quite a bit! Without the cooler, cruising at ~95mph, 87 degrees high humidity, my oil temps reached steady state at ~260F.

After reinstalling the OEM cooler, cruising at ~95mph, 83 degrees high humidity, my oil temps reached stead state at ~227F.

The OEM oil cooler definitely does make a difference, and in my case (in conjunction with my GTM pan) is enough for street driving. I can not comment on the performance in a track scenario, but I would assume it would not be sufficient.

One thing to note: In cooler weather, my oil temps were fine without the OEM cooler... I'd hypothesize that my GTM pan was cooling pretty efficiently with the cold air flow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcfromfl

I'm not sure which years/models came with the OEM cooler -- did yours at least have the OEM one?

'12+ have the OEM cooler.

Senna-F1 · 11-20-2017, 12:03 PM

Thanks so much guys! Appreciate the feedback. Let me address some of the comments.

The check boxes are options I can turn on and off, that will affect the price. Lets me play around.

Oil cooler or not: I was kinda hoping that because I normally shift around 4/4.5K, that these kits are not producing power at those revs the way a turbo would be. a BP kit would be at full boost basically, and a centrifugal is just starting to wake up. 2nd, with E85, it would be even less of an issue. New coolers are $$$, and sometimes they leak, so was hoping I could get one later if needed. My real concerns with NOT having one is making it through the tuning/dyno sessions. Can you rent one?

Fuel pump: I had read about Topz having issues with the 340, and that's why I went 485.

Exhaust: I currently just have the Nismo exhaust (Mine is a 2014 Nismo) and Beluga short tails. I don't think adding test pipes to those is a good idea. Id at least need ART pipes, but full Motordyne would be nice, Just so much $$$

Other things mentioned. Im on ECUTEK now, have the RJM pedal, 305 RE-11's, BC Coils with SPL front ARMs and SPC in the rear. Ive got Diff bushings, subframe collars, transmission mount, Yamaha axle nuts (for the clicking issue).

Im seriously thinking of putting a lift in my garage.

For you guys with AFR and Ethanol gauges, are you sharing sensors with the ECU?

Senna-F1 · 11-20-2017, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtle64b

Looks pretty good!

Thanks for all the info and offer Turtle! Wish you were a little bit closer

I don't have any friends.

Senna-F1 · 11-20-2017, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcfromfl

Also, I don't see the Ecutek hardware on your list. Do you already have it installed? You may want to add the RJM pedal, too, and a catch can.

I'm eager to see what Topz will be putting together.

Got all those already. and yes, very eager to see what's coming. Well, I have a good idea, just eager to see if actually happen. Topgunz is a very helpful and active member. That makes a difference to me when it comes to buying kits from people.

TopgunZ · 11-20-2017, 12:23 PM

Yes E85 helps the cooling aspect. And I would say you will be ok on the dyno..... Oh the kit, it's happening.

Jayhovah · 11-20-2017, 12:36 PM

got a couple of notes from your list (all of it IMO) -

Return fuel system: You may as well just remove the AAM RFS from your list completely as it does not include an external filter, which you will want for E85 and Walbro 485.

The S1.SE is also overkill for the power you are looking for. The S1.E and FAST-500E are the appropriate choices.

Clutch: You can save a chunk by going with the Z1 clutch. I have it and it works great. You may also consider sticking with the OEM flywheel... I kind of wish I had (I got talked into the light weight flywheel by members here). I don't see much benefit, but I do hear a lot more drivetrain chatter.

Exhaust: LTH is an expensive addition that is probably not going to buy you much more performance - not to mention it is laborious to install. It is currently occupying 11% of the total cost in the way you have it configured.

Tune: You will need the 4 bar sensor in addition to the one for your gauge (which will be just for your gauge).

Oil cooling: If your car is not equipped with the OEM cooler, you will need to add one. Even stock cars without the OEM cooler probably need to add on. If you have the OEM cooler, I would take a wait-and-see approach and add it if necessary.
The oil pan spacer is only going to give you additional capacity. Air external oil cooler will also do this... I would skip the spacer.

TopgunZ · 11-20-2017, 12:52 PM

I agree on the LTH. The stock headers flow excellent and shouldnt be looked at till 600whp. Get Motordyne ART pipes instead and save $1000 in parts and $$$ in labor...or headaches. I think it will sound better too.

My SouthBend stage 3 QUIET DISK was amazing and I didnt have any chatter combined with the JWT flywheel.

11-20-2017, 07:18 AM	#3 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6833	Turtle64B did a good job stating some of the non-necessary parts and pointing to the right direction. The only thing I would suggest is you do indeed want that 480 walbro if your going E85. I ran the 340 and it couldnt keep up and became my limiting factor. They are basically the same price and you dont want a few dollar difference in pump wasting your $1500 fuel system. The only drawback is they heat the fuel up more but E85 runs super cold so it helps even things out. I would say if your hitting 550whp you will be well over the 375tq mark. More like 425. I was at 525/414. PS. I dont see tires on the list. Your going to be in neutral if on stockers..lol. turtle64b, Z Runner and Senna-F1 like this. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM Last edited by TopgunZ; 11-20-2017 at 07:21 AM.

11-20-2017, 08:32 AM	#5 (permalink)
bcfromfl Enthusiast Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Youngstown, FL Posts: 256 Drives: 2015 PW Nismo 6MT Rep Power: 8	I'm putting together the same list as you, so I can gauge whether or not this upgrade is within my budget. I noticed a couple of things from your list. 1) It looks like you haven't checked the box for the 34-row cooler. I don't think you'd want to drive very far at this level of power without the cooler. (I see the price to the right on your list, so maybe you just missed the checkmark.) 2) You'll either need a welding shop to modify your crash bar, or purchase Fast Intentions crash bar. Also, I don't see the Ecutek hardware on your list. Do you already have it installed? You may want to add the RJM pedal, too, and a catch can. I'm eager to see what Topz will be putting together. Senna-F1 likes this. Last edited by bcfromfl; 11-20-2017 at 10:01 AM.

11-20-2017, 09:20 AM	#6 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6833	I ran without an oil cooler the whole time I was supercharged and never seen more than 240. This was a street queen car so it never seen track days. I think a lot of the "must have an oil cooler" info comes from the turbo world since they use oil to cool the turbo so it heats it up even more. I could be way off and am in no way saying not to get one, but just saying I ran without one and it wasn't a problem. I will add up north though so southern heat is different. overtureZ and Senna-F1 like this. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS* - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

11-20-2017, 10:34 AM	#8 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6833	2009 and it didn't have the factory. I did forget to mention that I had an oil pan spacer though since I couldn't get it back off and bought a new one to sell with the turbo kit that I had put it on for. So maybe that helped more than I thought. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

11-20-2017, 12:23 PM	#13 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6833	Yes E85 helps the cooling aspect. And I would say you will be ok on the dyno..... Oh the kit, it's happening. wideglideleon and Senna-F1 like this. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

11-20-2017, 12:03 PM	#10 (permalink)
Senna-F1 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Cary, NC Age: 53 Posts: 425 Drives: 370SC,EliseSC,MR2T Rep Power: 49	Thanks so much guys! Appreciate the feedback. Let me address some of the comments. The check boxes are options I can turn on and off, that will affect the price. Lets me play around. Oil cooler or not: I was kinda hoping that because I normally shift around 4/4.5K, that these kits are not producing power at those revs the way a turbo would be. a BP kit would be at full boost basically, and a centrifugal is just starting to wake up. 2nd, with E85, it would be even less of an issue. New coolers are $$$, and sometimes they leak, so was hoping I could get one later if needed. My real concerns with NOT having one is making it through the tuning/dyno sessions. Can you rent one? Fuel pump: I had read about Topz having issues with the 340, and that's why I went 485. Exhaust: I currently just have the Nismo exhaust (Mine is a 2014 Nismo) and Beluga short tails. I don't think adding test pipes to those is a good idea. Id at least need ART pipes, but full Motordyne would be nice, Just so much $$$ Other things mentioned. Im on ECUTEK now, have the RJM pedal, 305 RE-11's, BC Coils with SPL front ARMs and SPC in the rear. Ive got Diff bushings, subframe collars, transmission mount, Yamaha axle nuts (for the clicking issue). Im seriously thinking of putting a lift in my garage. For you guys with AFR and Ethanol gauges, are you sharing sensors with the ECU?

11-20-2017, 12:52 PM	#15 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6833	I agree on the LTH. The stock headers flow excellent and shouldnt be looked at till 600whp. Get Motordyne ART pipes instead and save $1000 in parts and $$$ in labor...or headaches. I think it will sound better too. My SouthBend stage 3 QUIET DISK was amazing and I didnt have any chatter combined with the JWT flywheel. Senna-F1 likes this. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

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