How can you cool the air after the MAF sensors? Just seems kinda crazy. Depending on how well the water cooler worked I would think CEL's would be thrown around some--just curious.....


Are you gonna somehow place the MAFs after the intercooler?

I see sparks coming.

I don't know what is more sad - the fact that you have no clue what was included in the 03-06 kit (intercooler included for example), the fact that it was sold cheaper through retailers, or the fact that everyone has taken your numbers as fact and used them to speculate prices.

:ugh2:

Were the kits sold for significantly less than list price when they first came out? People discussing price on the new kits are most likely gonna be amongst the first to buy them.

Depends how well Stillen does on controlling the retailers they sell to (or if they only sell direct). Vortech didn't do a very good job of controlling price. I bought my Vortech kit in 2004 for $4300 (not tuner).. Seems like there might have been a price increase along the way also, but don't quote me on that..

The more important point was the claimed lack of parts that did in fact come with the Vortech kit. Also misquoting the tuning device included and valuing (in dollar terms) the split second box versus a reflash. A straight reflash should in fact cost much less, while including something like a Cobb AP would have a higher value..

Those are good questions and they will all be answered in due time. I'm on my iPhone right now so I don't really feel like getting finger cramps pecking away lol.

Simply put there is a lot of speculation in those questions. All of which is incorrect. There are in fact two intake tubes on our kit. We just havent released all of our photos yet. When we release the photos and more technical data you will see what I'm talking about.

So I'm not the only one who found it interesting that those questions were brought up by new people in the other discussion and not in this one???

Thanks for the reply, Kyle. Like I said on the other thread, I welcome a technical conversation about the positives and negatives of both systems before I put down such a large chunk of money on either kit. I'm not on one bandwagon or another and simply want the best product I can get. Looking forward to the additional info.

I'm sure the GTM & Stillen kits will both be worth the money, I just don't like how they are putting down the Stillen kit in the GTM thread. Especially since Stillen has not really released any real info, Hp/Tq numbers, or testing reviews.

2003-2006 Nissan 350Z Supercharging Systems | Vortech Superchargers

Alright I missed the line that said "Integrated charge cooling" so the intercooler is included in the vortech kit but the prices are straight from the page. the price of the head unit can be found on the site as well. the vendors probablyy do get a price break on that but the point that it does cost significantly more than the magnusson blower from the last stillen kit is valid. an accesport costs over 600$(which we don't even know if this is what they are using), the supercharger is over the 2000 mark, a cold air intake that has the same amount of piping costs 300-600 dollars, the belts bracketry and all the other parts probably cost another 2000-3000 if you include the manifold, and intercoolers are not cheap, then there is labor and overhead, legal fees, warranty insurance, carb approval, marketing, shipping costs, it sure as hell isn't going to be 5000 and if it is stillen worked some god damn impressive haggling miracles.

I'm going to ask the same question i asked in the GTM thread and that is how come the maf sensors aren't placed ahead of the supercharger to measure the actual uncompressed air charge with IAT's split off and mounted into the manifold to measure the real intake temps, or were you able to upgrade the stock MAP sensor to gauge the pressure created in the manifold? Or are we looking at a tune that is going to modify the VE tables to simply go around that?

Well, I decided to pop into the other thread and see what has been going on over the weekend...Seems like I missed out on some interesting discussions that appear to have been edited. Darn, wish I could have seen what was said.

I am sure that there are numerous questions from everyone...Why? Because no data has been provided. To make statements right now on the performance of either kit would be asinine. We have our doubts/concerns about some of the things we've seen in regards to GTM's kit however we have chosen to sit back and see what unfolds. We have been in this business far too long to think we can tell everything by looking at a picture.

Also, I have seen this question/concern come up a couple of times so I will briefly answer it.

Why did we relocate the dual throttle bodies on to the passenger side rather than on the driver side which would have been a shorter distance to travel?

The answer is simple...Clearance...We found a spot inside the engine bay which allowed us to mount the largest supercharger possible. Unfortunately, this area is limited by the hood clearance. When I get a chance I will post a picture for you that clearly shows what I'm talking about. To mount the throttle bodies on the driver's side we would literally be running the intake piping through the engine...There just wasn't room for the piping.

I'm sure the following statement will be made "Well, GTM says they designed their supercharger to work with the car, not around it..." Right...So did we, which is why we found the largest pocket of space available in the engine bay.

By the way, what'd you California people think of that rain last week? I'm sure glad our Gen. 3 intake filters are mounted so high so no one had to worry about hydrolocking!:hello: Could it be that we thought of this when developing the supercharger as well???

Remember...We haven't posted all of our pictures and data yet!

You have some great questions and I think you will be pleasantly surprised by our answers.

Thank god somebody finally saw this it's been like 5 freakin pages since the first time I asked it. The vague answer I'll have to live with as i can understand the secrecy especially with all the warring going on

No warring going on over here! To be honest, Josh and I are texting back and forth laughing at all the nonsense.

As I said in another thread we wish GTM the best of luck with their supercharger kit. It is always great to have competition. You must remember our company heritage, numerous world championships in many different forms of motorsport...We LOVE competition!!!

yeah i'm having a ball about all this as well so long as you guys aren't getting upset. As i said in the GTM thread we love all our vendors/sponsors and don't want to see you guys fighting over anything other than price ;)

Look at my avatar...I like to keep things light hearted! LOL

and i hope you won't be upset but i'm going to be cutting up my headers and stretching them out to long tubes as currently they are pretty weak what happened there?

My engineer's and I talked about that but to be honest I don't remember. I think it's something to do with all of the parts added together they kind of get washed out or something like that...I don't remember for sure though.

ok i think the headers may have a benefit(in their stock form) for say a mid-mount turbo or extremely high rpm situations where the short runner length and increased primary diameter would allow the exhaust pressure to plenum out so to speak, seeing as the vast majority of the bends are done and the tube straightens out by the collector i think they have promise as adapted long tubes maybe a future offering you guys could manage as all that is required are extension tubes and a new flange to follow along the cat's path. minimal refixturing and a healthy (possibly) bump in the mid to low end curve.

Edit: you could always call them the Stillen headers Gen. 2

Stillen, receive your intercooler core yet?

Forgot to mention: I remember somebody asking whether or not the stock strut tower brace on the 370z would fit with the new intake manifold. Any news regarding the issue?

Clearance on the strut tower brace should not be a problem. My engineer's designed it to work with the stock strut brace.

Unfortunately the intercooler will not be arriving until Thursday or Friday. We followed up with our vendor a couple weeks ago and they said "Oh yea, no problem! We're right on track!" Then last week we received different news! We told them to work through the weekend non-stop until they were completed with our prototype. We should be seeing it this week though. If not, I will be making a trip up there myself! LOL.

By the way:

I'd like to clear up a misunderstanding. Our explanation of why we chose to go with a new intake manifold only relates to OUR supercharger system. I was trying to explain that we couldn't simply run a Y-pipe design off the back of the blower. Also, because we ran the air-water intercooler system we had to think creatively about getting the intercooler inside the manifold. Which again, is the #1 reason why we rebuilt the manifold. We wanted to get the intercooler inside the manifold.

GTM mounted their supercharger on the bottom of the engine and utilize a front mount air to air intercooler system so they were able to retain the factory intake manifold. We chose to mount our supercharger inside the engine bay and go with an air to water intercooler system.

Also,

I don't want to step into GTM's thread again, I don't think it's appropriate for me to be in there...But, I do want to say that the assumptions regarding the mounting locations of our MAF sensors were incorrect. We are not mounting the MAF sensors in the charge pipe. We have decided to go with a draw through sensor. I will have another full explanation as to why we went that route.

I'd say that was adequately handled.

Hopefully its the price question we're going to be surprisingly pleased to hear the answer to. Can't wait to see the finished product and some numbers Kyle. It's actually pretty calming to see so much engineering going into something because at least we know you thought about all the issues and there won't be any surprises for us costumers.

yay draw through someone is actually using a MAF sensor like it should be. Can't wait to see the divorced IAT sensors I hope you guys can find a fast acting one with a small open thermistor to provide prompt accurate readouts instead of the canned gm ones. At least with the intake charge metering of draw through it will have enough information to be able to calculate the actual amount of air in the manifold without an upgraded MAP sensor (which i would still like to see)

Thanks for the clarifications, Kyle.

I used to have a blow through on my STI big turbo kit, it worked soo much better than the original MAF setup..

that was because you were most likely running a big blow off valve and everytime it opened you screwed up your AFR by exhausting the metered air

My Audi TT used a recirculating diverter valve to keep unused air in the system to keep boost up (good for STS too?), and not blow it out into the atmosphere. Is this a viable option for SCs?

Open-atmosphere BOVs sound so cool, though, haha!

I share the same feelings about the engineering that went into the kit. The fact Stillen even went to CAD to design their intake manifold shows their attention to detail.

Anyways, I hope to see some up close and personal pictures of the kit on a 370Z soon!

I would like to answer this question however, due to the obviously competitive nature of this subject I am going to have to respectfully acknowledge your question but answer it indirectly.

Blow off valves will be an option for the supercharger system however, as 1slow370 pointed out it can cause the afr's to jump crazy rich because you are releasing metered air that you are taking away from the engine. Therefore the engine will supply the appropriate amount of fuel for that amount of air but since you've released it you will be extremely rich. This can actually cause the car to stall at low speed. Which is why we will be offering a dual stage re-circ/blow-off valve. It will be an option.

There is more to this explanation as well but again...We aren't ready to release more info. yet.

most low pressure centrifugal setups won't even need a blow off valve which is why it is good that it's optional. They come in handy though on bigger setups but you would just recirculate it from the compressor tube back to the inlet tube after the MAF which would force the air being sucked into the sensor to stand still leaning out the fuel tune

Hey man you need to fix your avatar, the sliders dont work.:yum:

Hahaaa, he prolly did that on purpose.

lol.. I've been trying to use the damn scroll feature on his avatar all day!! j/k

Kyle I know you said your not ready to go into more detail yet, but I want to hear your explanation on the BOV's. I love the sound of them but have heard a lot of comments about running rich. I am sure someone else can answer this too, but is it really a big concern? Rich is better than lean as far as engine life is concerned correct? Is it merely a problem with running rich and stalling out or can the problem go further than that?

Anyone?

You will like our optional dual stage blow off valves. At low speed, cruising through a parking lot or something, they act as a re-circulating system. But, at high speed like when you're actually driving, they will vent to atmosphere. There is no concern about stalling or anything when driving at high speed because it happens so quickly it's only when you're going slow that the loss of air and excessive fuel can cause the car to stumble and potentially stall.

It would basically be like if you took a breath of air and there was a valve opening up in your throat before it got to your lungs...It would cause you to stumble and fall...

That is a pretty good analogy.:rofl2:

Ya, my damn valve just didn't open right in my throat and I bout choked on my Mt. Dew.. I think I'm with you!

I like what your sayin about the dual stage (sounds nice)....Sign me up!! I can't freakin wait to pull the trigger on one of these bad boys!

Damn, Im gonna miss my SSQV. Is the dual stage external vent a tweet or a sneeze? Not that it makes a difference, but the little ricer in me is wondering :)

lol I'm right there with you RCZ... I'm trying not to be "that guy" but damn I want it to freakin blow the dust off the road when I shift!