VVEL Cracking?

b1adesofcha0s · 03-31-2011, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haggomyeggo

did this thread just get back on track??

It never got off track, what are you talking about?

haggomyeggo · 03-31-2011, 09:51 AM

you know what i dont get about all this cracking nonsense is why Nissan makes it so hard.

Why?
they said when the GTR was released that the ECU would be unbreakable. Yeah that lasted real long.
If someone is paying to buy your car then why should they not be allowed to change something on the car. I understand they are watching their liability but its not like once you tamper with the ECU your warranty is going to be any good anyway.
So why not let owners have the code to the ECU and let them tune away. Just make the code open source so anyone can play with it, at their own risk of course.

Jordo! · 03-31-2011, 10:02 AM

^^^^ I've been saying for years that TRD, Nismo, etc. should offer something like this. All they have to do is have you sign a waiver saying "off road use only", and possibly give up some warranty rights, and boom -- they'd have a thriving business in aftermarket tuning for consumers.

theDreamer · 03-31-2011, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haggomyeggo

you know what i dont get about all this cracking nonsense is why Nissan makes it so hard.

Why?
they said when the GTR was released that the ECU would be unbreakable. Yeah that lasted real long.
If someone is paying to buy your car then why should they not be allowed to change something on the car. I understand they are watching their liability but its not like once you tamper with the ECU your warranty is going to be any good anyway.
So why not let owners have the code to the ECU and let them tune away. Just make the code open source so anyone can play with it, at their own risk of course.

I have talked to the guys at Uprev, though it has been over a year, it seem Nissan does not directly write the ECU code/software. They setup what they want and someone else programs it (forget the company).

I would love for it to become open source, but it seems car companies are a bit dated on the tech/software side of things. They want to put all this awesome tech in cars but want to use horrible software or lock it down to a point even they have no clue what is going on.

Liquid_G · 03-31-2011, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haggomyeggo

you know what i dont get about all this cracking nonsense is why Nissan makes it so hard.

Why?
they said when the GTR was released that the ECU would be unbreakable. Yeah that lasted real long.
If someone is paying to buy your car then why should they not be allowed to change something on the car. I understand they are watching their liability but its not like once you tamper with the ECU your warranty is going to be any good anyway.
So why not let owners have the code to the ECU and let them tune away. Just make the code open source so anyone can play with it, at their own risk of course.

Tell that to Sony... Better not hack your PS3 or Sony will sue your azz.

Which actually got me thinking.. Has any car manufacturer ever came after a shop or customer for tuning their car? Is there any legal liability tuners have to worry about if they do "crack" the VVEL setup in our cars?

theDreamer · 03-31-2011, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liquid_G

Tell that to Sony... Better not hack your PS3 or Sony will sue your azz.

Which actually got me thinking.. Has any car manufacturer ever came after a shop or customer for tuning their car? Is there any legal liability tuners have to worry about if they do "crack" the VVEL setup in our cars?

I do not think so, as with Sony you are altering the actual OS to do something else, where with tuning you are just 'changing' parameters in the car which the ECU could already do itself.
Also, car manufactures can just void your warranty if they see you adjusted the ECU which is enough for them without bringing in lawyers & such.

haggomyeggo · 03-31-2011, 10:27 AM

for a long time i didnt get why manufacturers dont get the max out an engine. this was before you start thinking about things like reliability, safety, who they are selling it to, insurance for drivers. I think insurance is the main reason BMW has been underrating their turbo motors. I think Nissan did the same thing with the GTR. said it was 480 but werent shops getting like near 500 at the wheels stock??
I would think companies would enjoy the aftermarket to an extent. It shows people what their cars are truely capable of.

Jordo! · 03-31-2011, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haggomyeggo

for a long time i didnt get why manufacturers dont get the max out an engine. this was before you start thinking about things like reliability, safety, who they are selling it to, insurance for drivers. I think insurance is the main reason BMW has been underrating their turbo motors. I think Nissan did the same thing with the GTR. said it was 480 but werent shops getting like near 500 at the wheels stock??
I would think companies would enjoy the aftermarket to an extent. It shows people what their cars are truely capable of.

Reliability, driveability, emissions, and fuel efficiency.

A good tune will generally wind up sacrificing the last two for more power, while maintaining the first two.

b1adesofcha0s · 03-31-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Reliability, driveability, emissions, and fuel efficiency.

A good tune will generally wind up sacrificing the last two for more power, while maintaining the first two.

The VVEL is the way it is to balance power and emissions/fuel efficiency I believe. To get more power you will have to compromise the other two.

GZ3 · 03-31-2011, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1adesofcha0s

The VVEL is the way it is to balance power and emissions/fuel efficiency I believe. To get more power you will have to compromise the other two.

i'm alrite with this! I already have test pipes so why stop here....I want as much power as i can wring out of this car

jnaut · 03-31-2011, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haggomyeggo

for a long time i didnt get why manufacturers dont get the max out an engine. this was before you start thinking about things like reliability, safety, who they are selling it to, insurance for drivers. I think insurance is the main reason BMW has been underrating their turbo motors. I think Nissan did the same thing with the GTR. said it was 480 but werent shops getting like near 500 at the wheels stock??
I would think companies would enjoy the aftermarket to an extent. It shows people what their cars are truely capable of.

4 days ago i saw a 2012 gtr put down 487 to the wheels(100% stock) on the same mustang dyno i put down 320.

haggomyeggo · 03-31-2011, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jnaut

4 days ago i saw a 2012 gtr put down 487 to the wheels(100% stock) on the same mustang dyno i put down 320.

i love nissans...

b1adesofcha0s · 03-31-2011, 02:39 PM

I remember hearing that one of the reasons the GT-R's power was rated at 485 bhp was due to the fact that each engine is hand made. This meant that each engine performed differently, but they all made at least 485.

Skeeterbop · 10-18-2011, 08:45 PM

Any updates on the vvel crack?

NewYorkJon34 · 10-18-2011, 10:15 PM

I dont believe anyone is trying to crack the VVEL system anymore, GTM gave up, & recently I believe UpRev gave up as well. Sad day for us all

03-31-2011, 10:02 AM	#138 (permalink)
Jordo! A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2010 Location: nirvana Posts: 6,394 Drives: 2023 NATM Rep Power: 419	^^^^ I've been saying for years that TRD, Nismo, etc. should offer something like this. All they have to do is have you sign a waiver saying "off road use only", and possibly give up some warranty rights, and boom -- they'd have a thriving business in aftermarket tuning for consumers. __________________ Enjoy it. Destroy it.

03-31-2011, 02:39 PM	#148 (permalink)
b1adesofcha0s A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: MD Posts: 40,963 Drives: HypeTrain Choo Choo! Rep Power: 142	I remember hearing that one of the reasons the GT-R's power was rated at 485 bhp was due to the fact that each engine is hand made. This meant that each engine performed differently, but they all made at least 485. __________________ Project: b1adeZmobile (2009 370Z) \| Uprev Tune by AAM Competition \| Berk Exhaust Project: b1adeZmobile 2.0 (2014 C7 Z51) \| Corsa Xtreme Exhaust

10-18-2011, 08:45 PM	#149 (permalink)
Skeeterbop A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Fort Bliss, TX Age: 41 Posts: 1,440 Drives: 2011 GM 370 base SP Rep Power: 17	Any updates on the vvel crack? __________________ Srenity: "Yeah no rest needed to spread the love when your 20 that's for sure...."

10-18-2011, 10:15 PM	#150 (permalink)
NewYorkJon34 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Naples, Florida Posts: 3,041 Drives: 09 Fairlady Z Rep Power: 1066	I dont believe anyone is trying to crack the VVEL system anymore, GTM gave up, & recently I believe UpRev gave up as well. Sad day for us all __________________ NewYorkJon34's Ultimate Z Build

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03-31-2011, 09:51 AM	#137 (permalink)
haggomyeggo A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: IL Posts: 1,723 Drives: Steves old cars Rep Power: 18	you know what i dont get about all this cracking nonsense is why Nissan makes it so hard. Why? they said when the GTR was released that the ECU would be unbreakable. Yeah that lasted real long. If someone is paying to buy your car then why should they not be allowed to change something on the car. I understand they are watching their liability but its not like once you tamper with the ECU your warranty is going to be any good anyway. So why not let owners have the code to the ECU and let them tune away. Just make the code open source so anyone can play with it, at their own risk of course.

03-31-2011, 10:27 AM	#142 (permalink)
haggomyeggo A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: IL Posts: 1,723 Drives: Steves old cars Rep Power: 18	for a long time i didnt get why manufacturers dont get the max out an engine. this was before you start thinking about things like reliability, safety, who they are selling it to, insurance for drivers. I think insurance is the main reason BMW has been underrating their turbo motors. I think Nissan did the same thing with the GTR. said it was 480 but werent shops getting like near 500 at the wheels stock?? I would think companies would enjoy the aftermarket to an extent. It shows people what their cars are truely capable of.