Running lean under boost

shadow85 · 07-17-2018, 09:02 PM

Would like to know if anyone else with a boosted Z has experienced the car running lean under boost, and what their issue was and how they fixed it please?

Only just had my TT build finished up and currently being remote tuned by Seb, but ran into this problem of the car going lean when I tried the WOT pulls.

AAM Competition RHD TT Kit
ID1050x
Walbro 460
CJM S1.E System
Fuel Pump Relay Kit
Running e85

Below is part of am Ecutek log when I tried the pull:

My workshop has looked for possible fuel leaks and pump voltage and that seems to be all ok. So they assumed my Aero340 pump before was too small, so they changed the Aero340 to a Walbro 460 and that instantly made the car feel better and more responsive but the lean issue was still there although not as bad as before the new pump.

Seb has tried to force more fuel in the tune which also helped but as you can see from the graph it still progressivly gets more lean under the load as it increases.

My fuel pressure on idle is @42 psi, I think that is with the vaccum/boost hose connected, not sure if it should be higher?

Atm I am waiting till Monday to get it onto a dyno so we can check the fuel pressure under load, as suggested by Seb.

Has anyone had this problem before please share you experience with me, thank you!

Spooler · 07-17-2018, 09:40 PM

Looks like you don't have enough injector. Most folks get at least IDA 1300cc injectors for
for E85. I am using IDA1700cc for my build. Go through the trouble shooting process and see what happening with the fuel pressure.

Spooler · 07-17-2018, 09:44 PM

Did you get the fuel pressure gauge with the CJ Motorsports fuel system? It shouldn't take but a pull or two on the dyno if you do. Then you will know.

Jinxx · 07-17-2018, 10:03 PM

If you have the return kit you should be able to increase fuel pressure under boost ... if it was tuned correctly and started doing this you may have a vacuum leak on the fuel pressure regulator ... my fuel pressure at idle is 52 but I also have different injectors

Elmo370z · 07-17-2018, 11:06 PM

Ideal should be between 50-55, might have a small leak in your fuel
Lines.

shadow85 · 07-17-2018, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Looks like you don't have enough injector. Most folks get at least IDA 1300cc injectors for
for E85. I am using IDA1700cc for my build. Go through the trouble shooting process and see what happening with the fuel pressure.

My Ecutek log shows my injector duty cycle only reaches 50-60% under load, does that mean I still have a bit of room left in my injectors?

Also interestingly, on another log I took the other night of a semi-pull in 2nd gear, 'Injectory Duty Bank 1' dropped from 50 to almost 0 momentarily. But I think that may be another issue altogether that Seb has said may be a failsafe map dropping the throttle, which he has adjusted and sent another tune through, I have not tested that new tune but will do tonight. See below:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Did you get the fuel pressure gauge with the CJ Motorsports fuel system? It shouldn't take but a pull or two on the dyno if you do. Then you will know.

Yes I did the mini pressure gauge. That is why I am taking it for a run on the dyno on Monday to see if it is holding pressure under load.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jinxx

If you have the return kit you should be able to increase fuel pressure under boost ... if it was tuned correctly and started doing this you may have a vacuum leak on the fuel pressure regulator ... my fuel pressure at idle is 52 but I also have different injectors

Yes I have the return kit. Well I will check the pressure under boost on the dyno, see if it is increasing. It started doing this possibly the moment I got the build done and tried my first WOT pull.

The workshop it was at, said they done a leak test accross the fuel system, tensioned all lines and could not find any faults?

Jinxx · 07-18-2018, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadow85

My Ecutek log shows my injector duty cycle only reaches 50-60% under load, does that mean I still have a bit of room left in my injectors?

Also interestingly, on another log I took the other night of a semi-pull in 2nd gear, 'Injectory Duty Bank 1' dropped from 50 to almost 0 momentarily. But I think that may be another issue altogether that Seb has said may be a failsafe map dropping the throttle, which he has adjusted and sent another tune through, I have not tested that new tune but will do tonight. See below:

Yes I did the mini pressure gauge. That is why I am taking it for a run on the dyno on Monday to see if it is holding pressure under load.

Yes I have the return kit. Well I will check the pressure under boost on the dyno, see if it is increasing. It started doing this possibly the moment I got the build done and tried my first WOT pull.

The workshop it was at, said they done a leak test accross the fuel system, tensioned all lines and could not find amy faults?

I would verify the vacuum source to the regulator and make sure there isn’t any leaks ...you should see around 52 at idle and for every pound of boost it should increase one psi per pound ... on average.. depending on injector size a tune
May be different with e85 tho ... I’m speaking from 93 oct settings .... but either way idle should be 52 ish and it should increase with boost

shadow85 · 07-18-2018, 05:51 AM

Just got Sebs latest revision and my car basically resulted in the same logs where under WOT my AFR will start rich but then increase leaner under the load. But it did get rid of that sudden injector duty drop from bank 1.

Spooler · 07-18-2018, 07:02 AM

You'll find it. Something wonky is going on.

shadow85 · 07-18-2018, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jinxx

I .... but either way idle should be 52 ish and it should increase with boost

Seb has told me 42psi idle is fine with the vacuum connected. He said if I remove the hose it should increase to ~50psi.

I am wondering if I can adjust the pressure by increasing it by an increment of 5psi and see if that will help stop the leaning out issue?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

You'll find it. Something wonky is going on.

Any ideas?

Spooler · 07-18-2018, 12:08 PM

Seb is the man, follow his lead.

shadow85 · 07-18-2018, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Seb is the man, follow his lead.

Will do!

shadow85 · 07-23-2018, 03:08 AM

Is voltage suppose to drop in spikes?

Can anyone check out this graph and let me know if it is normal?

Spooler · 07-23-2018, 11:23 AM

Wow, it looks like you may have a bad cell in your battery. The voltage shouldn't drop like that. Bad batteries can cause some strange things.

shadow85 · 07-23-2018, 02:59 PM

Could that be the reason I am going lean under boost? Maybe battery is not supplying pump with enough voltage?

07-17-2018, 09:02 PM	#1 (permalink)
shadow85 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Australia, Austra Posts: 917 Drives: 15' 370Z A/T AMM TT Rep Power: 24	Running lean under boost Would like to know if anyone else with a boosted Z has experienced the car running lean under boost, and what their issue was and how they fixed it please? Only just had my TT build finished up and currently being remote tuned by Seb, but ran into this problem of the car going lean when I tried the WOT pulls. AAM Competition RHD TT Kit ID1050x Walbro 460 CJM S1.E System Fuel Pump Relay Kit Running e85 Below is part of am Ecutek log when I tried the pull: My workshop has looked for possible fuel leaks and pump voltage and that seems to be all ok. So they assumed my Aero340 pump before was too small, so they changed the Aero340 to a Walbro 460 and that instantly made the car feel better and more responsive but the lean issue was still there although not as bad as before the new pump. Seb has tried to force more fuel in the tune which also helped but as you can see from the graph it still progressivly gets more lean under the load as it increases. My fuel pressure on idle is @42 psi, I think that is with the vaccum/boost hose connected, not sure if it should be higher? Atm I am waiting till Monday to get it onto a dyno so we can check the fuel pressure under load, as suggested by Seb. Has anyone had this problem before please share you experience with me, thank you!

07-18-2018, 05:51 AM	#8 (permalink)
shadow85 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Australia, Austra Posts: 917 Drives: 15' 370Z A/T AMM TT Rep Power: 24	Just got Sebs latest revision and my car basically resulted in the same logs where under WOT my AFR will start rich but then increase leaner under the load. But it did get rid of that sudden injector duty drop from bank 1. Last edited by shadow85; 07-18-2018 at 06:20 AM.

07-18-2018, 12:08 PM	#11 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,503 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684391	Seb is the man, follow his lead. wideglideleon and shadow85 like this.

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07-17-2018, 09:40 PM	#2 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,503 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684391	Looks like you don't have enough injector. Most folks get at least IDA 1300cc injectors for for E85. I am using IDA1700cc for my build. Go through the trouble shooting process and see what happening with the fuel pressure.

07-17-2018, 09:44 PM	#3 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,503 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684391	Did you get the fuel pressure gauge with the CJ Motorsports fuel system? It shouldn't take but a pull or two on the dyno if you do. Then you will know.

07-17-2018, 10:03 PM	#4 (permalink)
Jinxx Track Member Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: South Carolina Posts: 699 Drives: 2017 nismo 370z Rep Power: 3375	If you have the return kit you should be able to increase fuel pressure under boost ... if it was tuned correctly and started doing this you may have a vacuum leak on the fuel pressure regulator ... my fuel pressure at idle is 52 but I also have different injectors

07-17-2018, 11:06 PM	#5 (permalink)
Elmo370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: st. petersburg Posts: 5,707 Drives: 09 nissan 370z Sp M6 Rep Power: 295377	Ideal should be between 50-55, might have a small leak in your fuel Lines.

07-18-2018, 07:02 AM	#9 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,503 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684391	You'll find it. Something wonky is going on.

07-23-2018, 03:08 AM	#13 (permalink)
shadow85 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Australia, Austra Posts: 917 Drives: 15' 370Z A/T AMM TT Rep Power: 24	Is voltage suppose to drop in spikes? Can anyone check out this graph and let me know if it is normal?

07-23-2018, 11:23 AM	#14 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,503 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684391	Wow, it looks like you may have a bad cell in your battery. The voltage shouldn't drop like that. Bad batteries can cause some strange things.

07-23-2018, 02:59 PM	#15 (permalink)
shadow85 Track Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: South Australia, Austra Posts: 917 Drives: 15' 370Z A/T AMM TT Rep Power: 24	Could that be the reason I am going lean under boost? Maybe battery is not supplying pump with enough voltage?