Carbotech XP12 and XP10 with Stillan J-Hook Rotors

Nikon FM · 07-17-2011, 02:02 PM

Last week I had an HPDE and lapping evening back to back. I ran the car at Pacific Raceways which is a fairly technical track with approximately +130-140mph on the main straight into the first turn (lots of braking and then following a +100mph downhill into a couple of very tight corners (tons more braking) followed by a back straight (again +100mph) into a chicane. These back to back sections seriously heated up my rotors due to the serious friction the XP12s and XP10s generated….essentially the Stillan J-Hooks were no match for the heat and warped.

What I did not do was apply the brakes while stopped or slowly rolling so I didn't motivate the warpage.

My next course will be to add front cooling and turn the rotors….(before another rotor purchase)

Thoughts?

Trips · 07-17-2011, 02:28 PM

I'm looking into upgrading from the stock sport pkg rotors soon and would have thought the J hooks were good enough but Now it has me questioning if I should spend the extra and go 2 piece rotors since the J hooks are one piece. I do push the Z on Canyons Cruises and have learned to be easy on the brakes and let the suspension do what its designed to do. I think some form of air duct cooling to the rotors would help but I think they may not be up to the task of serious tracking. IMO

370ZNISMO#704 · 07-17-2011, 03:05 PM

Wow that is a shock, I was looking into the J's as well.
I'm thinking 2 piece as well now with a cross drilled section.
My TSX sadly can stop just as fast as my nizzy.
But I have cross drilled slot rotors with aggressive pads and steal braided lines and dot 4 fluid.
But they have more under braking noise which is weird I thought.

But Nikon thanks for the right up and I would contact stillen first before I turned them. You might loose the actual j hook slotting in it. Plus they might beable to do something for you. Plus a lot of people are against turning of sloted rotors Iduno but thanks for the info...

Hope to meet ya someday gotta check out your beast..

cossie1600 · 07-17-2011, 04:51 PM

2 piece is great if you have a race, pointless if you are just driving around town. Rotor is a heat sink, your best bet is to add ducting/cryo treat them and get the right pads

FL 4Motion · 07-17-2011, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

2 piece is great if you have a race, pointless if you are just driving around town. Rotor is a heat sink, your best bet is to add ducting/cryo treat them and get the right pads

+1.

STILL waiting for someone (stillen, am performance etc) to bring a well engineered brake ducting solution for the 370z to market....

Nikon FM · 07-17-2011, 06:37 PM

Stillen (spelled it right this time) provided a set a free metal matrix pads when I bought the rotors. On the last lapping session (June) I used the metal matrix pads with the J-Hook rotors and all went well except I didn't have the stopping power and I went through the whole pad that day. The rotors survived and worked just fine with the lame pads.

Adding the high friction ie heat generator pads did the rotors in but I had great stopping ability and still did when the steering wheel started shuddering while braking.

This situation occurred on a seriously aggressive track type setting. I don't know that the situation could be duplicated on normal roads.

370ZNISMO#704 · 07-17-2011, 07:00 PM

Lol I bet I could come drive with me and my boys we drive like there are no cops ill hit 140 all the time I've been driving that way in all the cars ive ever built. My 95 eg goes 164 mph wit 224 at the front.

But I've even had the stock rotors already shake on me under braking.
That's why I was looking for better.
Braking is what makes your car faster then the next guy how well you can come in hot and pull through that corner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikon FM

Stillen (spelled it right this time) provided a set a free metal matrix pads when I bought the rotors. On the last lapping session (June) I used the metal matrix pads with the J-Hook rotors and all went well except I didn't have the stopping power and I went through the whole pad that day. The rotors survived and worked just fine with the lame pads.

Adding the high friction ie heat generator pads did the rotors in but I had great stopping ability and still did when the steering wheel started shuddering while braking.

This situation occurred on a seriously aggressive track type setting. I don't know that the situation could be duplicated on normal roads.

Nikon FM · 07-17-2011, 07:05 PM

^ careful out there my friend

SPOHN · 07-17-2011, 07:43 PM

Not saying you are but I wouldn't hate on the rotors. They took some hard beating as it sounds with some good pads.

I just wonder if it's best for me to just keep replacing my rotors with stock ones being I probably wouldn't be as hard on them as you guys? I'm trying to be a budget minded racer. I do want some Carbotech pads. Not as agressive as you have though. I know a lot og guys talk so highly of Carbotech and how there more rotor friendly than other pads. But heat is another thing I assume?

Mike · 07-17-2011, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikon FM

Adding the high friction ie heat generator pads did the rotors in but I had great stopping ability and still did when the steering wheel started shuddering while braking.

I think its actually pad deposits on the rotors. Mine used to do this when I ran the brembos and centric rotors. The brakes get really hot, mine hot enough to actually melt the powdercoat on my wheels and make it wrinkle up from centrifugal force. Sometimes after driving in the rain, the shudder would go away until the next track day, and other times, it would come and go. When I street drove it, if I gave it a few weeks of driving between events, the shudder was gone until tracking again.

It would do it to me after two sessions on fresh rotors. Sharif said its because I was street braking and not going 100% every time, but I'm not sure about that. I do know I don't have the problem now that I have stoptechs.

SPOHN · 07-17-2011, 08:27 PM

^ After this weekend your not going to have Stoptechs. I am. You said mod swap, right?

Also, are you going to run at Road Atlanta at the end of this month?

FL 4Motion · 07-17-2011, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

Not saying you are but I wouldn't hate on the rotors. They took some hard beating as it sounds with some good pads.

I just wonder if it's best for me to just keep replacing my rotors with stock ones being I probably wouldn't be as hard on them as you guys? I'm trying to be a budget minded racer. I do want some Carbotech pads. Not as agressive as you have though. I know a lot og guys talk so highly of Carbotech and how there more rotor friendly than other pads. But heat is another thing I assume?

Carbotech has different pads to choose from, if you're going to go w/a less aggressive setup (like I am) you could just run XP8's all around. Seeing as you're "on a budget", I'd simply keep using the stock rotors and replacing them as needed since they're, what, $70 a piece? And will last longer w/a less aggressive pad.

cossie1600 · 07-17-2011, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

Not saying you are but I wouldn't hate on the rotors. They took some hard beating as it sounds with some good pads.

I just wonder if it's best for me to just keep replacing my rotors with stock ones being I probably wouldn't be as hard on them as you guys? I'm trying to be a budget minded racer. I do want some Carbotech pads. Not as agressive as you have though. I know a lot og guys talk so highly of Carbotech and how there more rotor friendly than other pads. But heat is another thing I assume?

You need slicks in order to get more from your braking system anyway, so pointless to spend $1000 on brakes and then just lock them up.

Just cryo treat a set of rotors and that's probably the best you can do. Cryotreating is $100 for each pair and a set of air ducts are around $500.

Nikon FM · 07-17-2011, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike

I think its actually pad deposits on the rotors.

I hope so, although when putting my DD wheels back on I noticed the pads where rubbing only in one spot and the lines or wear marks on the rotors were fairly uniform………………I'll drive it and see if it cleans up. In the mean time though I'll work the cooling duct idea.

Thanks

Mike · 07-18-2011, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPOHN

^ After this weekend your not going to have Stoptechs. I am. You said mod swap, right?

Also, are you going to run at Road Atlanta at the end of this month?

No Road Atlanta this month. I've spent too much on track days this summer.

Doing Zcon wednesday
Roebling Road the weekend of 20 August
VIR Sept 9-11
Road Atlanta November
and thats about it for now. Probably one event in October too.

07-17-2011, 02:02 PM	#1 (permalink)
Nikon FM Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Snoqualmie WA Posts: 973 Drives: 03 996TT Porsche Rep Power: 606	Carbotech XP12 and XP10 with Stillen J-Hook Rotors Last week I had an HPDE and lapping evening back to back. I ran the car at Pacific Raceways which is a fairly technical track with approximately +130-140mph on the main straight into the first turn (lots of braking and then following a +100mph downhill into a couple of very tight corners (tons more braking) followed by a back straight (again +100mph) into a chicane. These back to back sections seriously heated up my rotors due to the serious friction the XP12s and XP10s generated….essentially the Stillan J-Hooks were no match for the heat and warped. What I did not do was apply the brakes while stopped or slowly rolling so I didn't motivate the warpage. My next course will be to add front cooling and turn the rotors….(before another rotor purchase) Thoughts? __________________ Buddy Revell: "One man's sooner is another man's later" Last edited by Nikon FM; 07-17-2011 at 06:38 PM.

07-17-2011, 03:05 PM	#3 (permalink)
370ZNISMO#704 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Seattle Posts: 466 Drives: Nismo10,EgH22,TSX04 Rep Power: 14	Wow that is a shock, I was looking into the J's as well. I'm thinking 2 piece as well now with a cross drilled section. My TSX sadly can stop just as fast as my nizzy. But I have cross drilled slot rotors with aggressive pads and steal braided lines and dot 4 fluid. But they have more under braking noise which is weird I thought. But Nikon thanks for the right up and I would contact stillen first before I turned them. You might loose the actual j hook slotting in it. Plus they might beable to do something for you. Plus a lot of people are against turning of sloted rotors Iduno but thanks for the info... Hope to meet ya someday gotta check out your beast.. __________________ 2010NISMO•305.9whp 250tq Osirus•STANCE GR+•and Camber & Toe bars•KICS R 20mm•VOSSEN CV3 20"-10.5x4•Stillen GENIII•AAM S-Line Nimso mid-pipe•CarbonSignal Sponsored car•EVOR F1mirrors•NST short shifter•Zspeed Nismo under tray.

07-17-2011, 06:37 PM	#6 (permalink)
Nikon FM Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Snoqualmie WA Posts: 973 Drives: 03 996TT Porsche Rep Power: 606	Stillen (spelled it right this time) provided a set a free metal matrix pads when I bought the rotors. On the last lapping session (June) I used the metal matrix pads with the J-Hook rotors and all went well except I didn't have the stopping power and I went through the whole pad that day. The rotors survived and worked just fine with the lame pads. Adding the high friction ie heat generator pads did the rotors in but I had great stopping ability and still did when the steering wheel started shuddering while braking. This situation occurred on a seriously aggressive track type setting. I don't know that the situation could be duplicated on normal roads. __________________ Buddy Revell: "One man's sooner is another man's later"

07-17-2011, 07:05 PM	#8 (permalink)
Nikon FM Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Snoqualmie WA Posts: 973 Drives: 03 996TT Porsche Rep Power: 606	^ careful out there my friend __________________ Buddy Revell: "One man's sooner is another man's later"

07-17-2011, 07:43 PM	#9 (permalink)
SPOHN A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Covington, GA Age: 45 Posts: 14,844 Drives: Waiting on next Z Rep Power: 221	Not saying you are but I wouldn't hate on the rotors. They took some hard beating as it sounds with some good pads. I just wonder if it's best for me to just keep replacing my rotors with stock ones being I probably wouldn't be as hard on them as you guys? I'm trying to be a budget minded racer. I do want some Carbotech pads. Not as agressive as you have though. I know a lot og guys talk so highly of Carbotech and how there more rotor friendly than other pads. But heat is another thing I assume? __________________ Last edited by SPOHN; 07-17-2011 at 07:52 PM.

07-17-2011, 02:28 PM	#2 (permalink)
Trips Administrator Join Date: May 2009 Location: Disneyland, Ca Posts: 8,728 Drives: 🔰 Rep Power: 10	I'm looking into upgrading from the stock sport pkg rotors soon and would have thought the J hooks were good enough but Now it has me questioning if I should spend the extra and go 2 piece rotors since the J hooks are one piece. I do push the Z on Canyons Cruises and have learned to be easy on the brakes and let the suspension do what its designed to do. I think some form of air duct cooling to the rotors would help but I think they may not be up to the task of serious tracking. IMO

07-17-2011, 04:51 PM	#4 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 29	2 piece is great if you have a race, pointless if you are just driving around town. Rotor is a heat sink, your best bet is to add ducting/cryo treat them and get the right pads

07-17-2011, 08:27 PM	#11 (permalink)
SPOHN A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Covington, GA Age: 45 Posts: 14,844 Drives: Waiting on next Z Rep Power: 221	^ After this weekend your not going to have Stoptechs. I am. You said mod swap, right? Also, are you going to run at Road Atlanta at the end of this month? __________________

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