BBK Comparison thread: Brembo vs. StopTech vs. AP Racing

[bullitt5897]

Yeah chris's comment was completely ungrounded in regards to the Alliance kit. I will be tracking the car this season and pushing it to its limits. So far the brakes are living up to and beyond my expectations!

[Mike@Blackline]

yeah im not mad, i just hate statements like that because they are the same as people bashing products just because they dont cost a lot, such as wheels or even cars as a whole. and i know what AP is to the brake world, probably the best brakes on the planet given their history, though ive never used them or experienced them. i know when respect is due, and AP gets mine

and obviously id put a paycheck down because i think id win the bet and win my money back and then some

[AP - Chris_B]

Originally Posted by battlewagon

yeah im not mad, i just hate statements like that because they are the same as people bashing products just because they dont cost a lot, such as wheels or even cars as a whole. and i know what AP is to the brake world, probably the best brakes on the planet given their history, though ive never used them or experienced them. i know when respect is due, and AP gets mine

and obviously id put a paycheck down because i think id win the bet and win my money back and then some

OK. I took his comment to mean that without a reputation of performing at the highest level, it is difficult to see how grandiose claims can be supported. And I agree. I've seen a variety of systems "survive" at the hands (and feet!) of an amateur during 5 lap time attack sessions, but failed miserably when put to a more serious test. Some didn't even last that long (C6 Z06). I have heard many massive failure stories from people who thought they were saving some money on brakes. They just had no idea they were going to be spending that saved cash and more on K-rail replacement, not to mention a car rebuild.

Anyone can easily claim a product performs to their satisfaction -- great! Now can a company make a product that performs to the satisfaction of the larger market, continually develop and introduce new products, have reproducible and repeatable set of of quality procedures, manage quality gates with suppliers, ship kits and replacement parts in a timely manner, deal with packaging and shipping companies, support their jobbers, provide high levels of customer service and stand behind their products with reasonable warranties? These are just some of the issues that are underestimated far too often by companies new to the market. Just getting a few of these wrong will be their ultimate downfall.

AP has over 90 years of total automotive experience. Brembo has over 40. Both have been tested and are continually tested in the most brutal environments possible by professionals who get paid to win (not save the car), much of it on live television with nowhere to hide. Alliance??? It's a reasonable question for anyone to ask. Reputations are earned, not claimed.

Chris

[bullitt5897]

Good point Chris. I believe Alliance is out here to earn a reputation for high quality and parts that perform no matter at what level they are used.

We all have to start somewhere just like AP and Brembo did 40 and 90 years ago.

[bullitt5897]

Mike correct me if I am wrong but from my knowledge Alliance is an American based company.

[Equinox]

most companies we deal with are, but do they manufacture their products or simply engineer them?

[bullitt5897]

Equinox that would be a question for Mike. Maybe he can chime in on that question.

[ChrisSlicks]

Is Mike from Blackline Motorsports or somewhere else?

[Mike]

Blackline is the only reference I can find anywhere on the net about Alliance, and thats only on Z forums and a prelude forum.

I'm not the Mike in question.

[bullitt5897]

not the Mike that I am referring to.

Blackline is the exclusive distributor and reseller for all of alliance's products as far as I know and understand.After I talked with Mike their main focus was on the Nissan market with their brake kits. They however are looking to expand beyond Nissan in the future and can do one off kits for customers who want them.

[Xan]

I think if they start a brand they should do some better research on brand names.

Alliance Parts is a brand of Daimler Trucks North America LLC, a Daimler company.

And these guys make brake parts, but I don't think they make the brakes from this thread.

So I'm pretty sure there would be some infringement here.
It's confusing to say the least...

(for reference Alliance Brand Parts -- Truck Parts and Accessories)

[bullitt5897]

Xan the name of that company is ALLIANCE Parts... not Alliance.

I don't see any infringement there.

[Xan]

Bullitt5897, they are referred to as Alliance by everybody and they themselves refer to all parts as just Alliance. Look at their product line, they have "Alliance Brake Kits".
http://www.alliancebrandparts.com/_A...gAxleBrake.pdf

I don't know the Alliance in this thread (as I can't find any info on them), but if they want to build a strong own brand, I wouldn't have chosen a name that is so close to/the same as another company that makes brakes as well.

But more on topic, if someone can post up some more info on these brakes and the company, such as the origin and experience of the company and such, we can learn about them.

[Gary_C]

XAN,

Maybe a coincidence, but a lot of these Chinese knockoff companies do things like that to intentionally to confuse the consumer. They may not start the rumor that "Alliance" is an American made brake company, but they know that someone will spread it when they accidentally end up on the wrong site during a GOOGLE search.

Similar situation here...
DaTruth: The Chinese Are Bad For Your Health
LOL

My big gripe is that all of these new brake kit "suppliers" try to market their products head to head with the real manufacturers like Brembo, AP, PFC, Alcon, etc... (stated "SUPPLIERS", because the majority of them do not manufacturer their own products) The consumer who may not have enough cash to buy a Brembo or AP kit right this second falls for the marketing,...thinks he "saved" a bit of money,... and then justifies his purchase in the first place by making his own claims about how "it's just as good". For many people, it may actually be "good enough" for themselves, but I really get frustrated by the propaganda and false claims that may influence by someone who really doesn't know there are major differences.

The reason why people like Chris and myself have soo much pride for the brands we represent is because we know exactly what goes into the products that we offer. Whether everyone acknowledges it or appreciates it means very little to me, as long as we are able to get the truth out there. The guy who may not have been able to afford the real deal the first time around, can at least learn that there is a difference, wait a little longer to make his purchase, and get a product that may not be "cheaper" but is most definitely the better VALUE when you get down to the "nuts and bolts" of it. (almost literally )

No offense to Alliance or any other brand buying parts from over seas and slapping their name on it, but if you market your product for what it is...a low cost option for a segment of the market that can't afford better, or doesn't feel they need better...you will be a much better company for it in the long run. Over promising and under delivering will be your down fall.

[bullitt5897]

Guys, I will let Mike answer all question in regards to Alliance. However, In response to the quality of Alliance's BBK. I will have to say after holding them in my hands and installing them myself. I feel that these brakes a of very high quality! As for Performance they are performing leaps and bounds over the Stock Sport brakes which is what I was looking for. I have yet to thoroughly test them at the track as they were just installed this past weekend. I will be running a few tests when the weather clears up and after my car gets back from Forged Performance after the TT install.

I will say this... The brakes are more than capable of initiating the power assist (ice mode) *i think thats what its called* at any moment and with ALOT less effort than the sport brakes. I know the brakes have the stopping power to get the job done and after I get done with testing I will post up figures for you guys. I feel these Brakes will do an amazing job and I am shocked at the performance I am receiving for such an affordable price!

If your opposed to saving money thats fine. However, I bought mine based on reviews and from talking to people who actually owned and ran the kit on the track. Check My350z for some of the reviews they have on this kit. I have not heard of one issue or bad thing said about these brakes nor can I find any faults so far. Trust me if there is something I find wrong with the kit I will have it in my extensive review.

Until then I will hold my final judgments until I have fully tested the brakes with the street compound pads and then with the race compound pads.