Ice mode solution?

cossie1600 · 04-17-2011, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flashburn

I only ran with the V12's for my first event. I didn't have any complaints.

I have a set of Starspec's now, which I'll be using for the first time in a couple of weeks.

The StarSpec should be a world better than the V12s.

Red__Zed · 04-17-2011, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

The StarSpec should be a world better than the V12s.

No doubt. The star specs are an amazing tire. I wish they made them in bigger sizes though.

flashburn · 04-18-2011, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

The StarSpec should be a world better than the V12s.

Yeah, I'm sure. I took them out for a quick test drive this weekend, and they felt really good. I really liked running a square setup too, felt very precise.

Now hopefully I can somehow manage to avoid ice mode again.

travisjb · 04-17-2011, 05:43 PM

I'll throw one other idea out there that has helped me somewhat... spend time driving AX/track with ABS off whether your classing allows it or not... use that time to dial in your setup... tune dampers, springs, tire pressure, brake pad selection, anything you can, until you get max braking performance without ABS... then turn ABS back on... I uncovered a lot of issues with my setup this way, and although I only have a few events since doing this no ice mode yet... that plus adding cooling to front brakes seems to have helped

I generally run (softer) mintex xtreme front pads... before I was running stiffer pads, and I had a low-speed wall contact at a lower speed track that involved over-heating brakes and ice mode... switched to softer compound and all was good... at faster tracks with high-speed transitions I am still using the stiffer compound and getting my best times that way... e.g., chuckwalla where all the braking is done at high speeds and the brakes get plenty of cooling

cossie1600 · 04-17-2011, 11:07 PM

Yeah, I am still pissed off they don't make it for our cars. I think they grip a little less than the RE11, but they feel better.

travisjb · 04-18-2011, 07:50 PM

Chris, to answer your question, I'm managing the balance with pads, and relative front-rear ride height, tire pressure and damper settings... patch-work at best... the real solution is unfortunately as Grant says - expensive aftermarket competition ABS computer... alternatively, if someone knows an engineer at Bosch or really really smart hacker maybe we can get some help mod'ing the stock ABS computer

Red__Zed · 04-18-2011, 08:19 PM

Hm. I wonder how difficult it would be to mess around with the ABS unit. I've not checked to see details on it at all-- anybody know what we are working with in the stock unit?

cossie1600 · 05-04-2011, 12:14 AM

I don't think heat is a primary factor too, but heat seems to create a havoc with me where the car would pull to one side under braking. I got the ice mode at VIR, but not at the Glen. I still believe it is mainly because of the bumps over at T1

cossie1600 · 05-04-2011, 10:51 PM

Here is an easy to tell the difference between ice mode and brake fade.

Brake fade=pedal goes straight to the floor with no braking power
Ice mode=pedal sometimes goes straight to the floor, but you will hear the ABS pulsating. You cant really miss it.

ChrisSlicks · 05-05-2011, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

Here is an easy to tell the difference between ice mode and brake fade.

Brake fade=pedal goes straight to the floor with no braking power
Ice mode=pedal sometimes goes straight to the floor, but you will hear the ABS pulsating. You cant really miss it.

If your pedal goes to the floor you have brake fade, whether the ABS pulses or not. If the ABS is pulsing at the same time then you were probably locking up the rear brakes as a result of the fronts failing.

The annoying ice-mode occurs when you haven't overheated the brakes yet and the pedal stays rock solid. To me this only occurs after the brakes have warmed up and been heat soaked for at least 10-15 minutes.

cossie1600 · 05-05-2011, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

If your pedal goes to the floor you have brake fade, whether the ABS pulses or not. If the ABS is pulsing at the same time then you were probably locking up the rear brakes as a result of the fronts failing.

The annoying ice-mode occurs when you haven't overheated the brakes yet and the pedal stays rock solid. To me this only occurs after the brakes have warmed up and been heat soaked for at least 10-15 minutes.

From what I remember, I have had instances where the pedal went slightly softer and the ABS just pulsate.

ChrisSlicks · 05-05-2011, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

From what I remember, I have had instances where the pedal went slightly softer and the ABS just pulsate.

Sounds like front pad fade, the first indicator the brakes are overheating. What pads were you using at the time?

cossie1600 · 05-05-2011, 10:46 AM

i cant fade the front brakes in an autox that we dont reach 40mph and the runs are 28 secs long...

ChrisSlicks · 05-05-2011, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

i cant fade the front brakes in an autox that we dont reach 40mph and the runs are 28 secs long...

LOL, fair enough.

cossie1600 · 05-06-2011, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

LOL, fair enough.

I can't even boil water in a lot this small

YouTube - 0511 370z autox

04-17-2011, 05:43 PM	#4 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 190	I'll throw one other idea out there that has helped me somewhat... spend time driving AX/track with ABS off whether your classing allows it or not... use that time to dial in your setup... tune dampers, springs, tire pressure, brake pad selection, anything you can, until you get max braking performance without ABS... then turn ABS back on... I uncovered a lot of issues with my setup this way, and although I only have a few events since doing this no ice mode yet... that plus adding cooling to front brakes seems to have helped I generally run (softer) mintex xtreme front pads... before I was running stiffer pads, and I had a low-speed wall contact at a lower speed track that involved over-heating brakes and ice mode... switched to softer compound and all was good... at faster tracks with high-speed transitions I am still using the stiffer compound and getting my best times that way... e.g., chuckwalla where all the braking is done at high speeds and the brakes get plenty of cooling __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

04-18-2011, 07:50 PM	#6 (permalink)
travisjb A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: GSO Posts: 2,803 Drives: VIR Rep Power: 190	Chris, to answer your question, I'm managing the balance with pads, and relative front-rear ride height, tire pressure and damper settings... patch-work at best... the real solution is unfortunately as Grant says - expensive aftermarket competition ABS computer... alternatively, if someone knows an engineer at Bosch or really really smart hacker maybe we can get some help mod'ing the stock ABS computer __________________ 2009 370Z #104 For Sale

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04-17-2011, 11:07 PM	#5 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 31	Yeah, I am still pissed off they don't make it for our cars. I think they grip a little less than the RE11, but they feel better.

04-18-2011, 08:19 PM	#7 (permalink)
Red__Zed A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: window seat Posts: 28,940 Drives: Mostly on two wheels Rep Power: 121	Hm. I wonder how difficult it would be to mess around with the ABS unit. I've not checked to see details on it at all-- anybody know what we are working with in the stock unit?

05-04-2011, 12:14 AM	#8 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 31	I don't think heat is a primary factor too, but heat seems to create a havoc with me where the car would pull to one side under braking. I got the ice mode at VIR, but not at the Glen. I still believe it is mainly because of the bumps over at T1

05-04-2011, 10:51 PM	#9 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 31	Here is an easy to tell the difference between ice mode and brake fade. Brake fade=pedal goes straight to the floor with no braking power Ice mode=pedal sometimes goes straight to the floor, but you will hear the ABS pulsating. You cant really miss it.

05-05-2011, 10:46 AM	#13 (permalink)
cossie1600 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: californee way Posts: 5,380 Drives: 370, Leaf Rep Power: 31	i cant fade the front brakes in an autox that we dont reach 40mph and the runs are 28 secs long...