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Z is more difficult to drive after corner balance

^ .. what he said. Sway-bars need to be connected with the car on its wheels on level ground with zero pre-load. Also, by how much did the camber change

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Old 07-09-2024, 04:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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^ .. what he said. Sway-bars need to be connected with the car on its wheels on level ground with zero pre-load.

Also, by how much did the camber change as a result of ride-height changing. Camber gain becomes larger the lower the ride-height goes.

Understeer usually comes from the rear if the car was previously well balanced so think about whether have you introduced more rear bar at the rear to impact understeer turning right. Re-measure everything (including toe, camber and caster as well as the corner weights and you should find your problem).

Also check the u-clamps on the front bar to ensure they are holding the poly-bush securely. I have had u/steer in the past as the poly bush "escaped" from the u-clamp (they were also FUBAR and were replaced - this item is now a service part - replaced every 8 events).
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Last edited by BGTV8; 07-11-2024 at 05:06 PM.
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Old 07-20-2024, 10:01 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Thank you all for comments. I did not supervise the tech when corner balance was done-I hope that all the proper steps about disconnecting sway bars were followed. Alignment was done in the same shop immediately after corner balance. Shop owner is a time attack champion and well respected in Toronto.

By "large margin" I mean 1.5-2 seconds off the pace per 85 second lap on fresh tires. V730 is slower than A520, but not by that much. I managed 1.2417 lap after I put front sway bar to "soft" (previous track day's best was 1.24.9-same weather, 2 weeks apart, front bar at "hard"). Still, car felt "difficult". My best lap on A052 and "butt corner balance" was 1.227 (front and rear sway bars at "soft")
Tires are fresh, installed about 2 months ago.

BGTV8-could you please elaborate on bolded out section? Can more bar at the rear result in more understeer-I thought it was the opposite?


Looked over my alignment sheets. Yes, I lost front camber after corner balance
Before CB L-1.8, R -2.0
After CB L -1.2 R-1.6 (makes no sense as L side is lower)
on A052 "butt balance"
L-1.6, R -1.9.

Thank you again!




Quote:
Originally Posted by BGTV8 View Post
^ .. what he said. Sway-bars need to be connected with the car on its wheels on level ground with zero pre-load.

Also, by how much did the camber change as a result of ride-height changing. Camber gain becomes larger the lower the ride-height goes.

Understeer usually comes from the rear if the car was previously well balanced so think about whether have you introduced more rear bar at the rear to impact understeer turning right. Re-measure everything (including toe, camber and caster as well as the corner weights and you should find your problem).

Also check the u-clamps on the front bar to ensure they are holding the poly-bush securely. I have had u/steer in the past as the poly bush "escaped" from the u-clamp (they were also FUBAR and were replaced - this item is now a service part - replaced every 8 events).
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Old 07-22-2024, 02:39 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obender66 View Post
Thank you all for comments. I did not supervise the tech when corner balance was done-I hope that all the proper steps about disconnecting sway bars were followed. Alignment was done in the same shop immediately after corner balance. Shop owner is a time attack champion and well respected in Toronto.

By "large margin" I mean 1.5-2 seconds off the pace per 85 second lap on fresh tires. V730 is slower than A520, but not by that much. I managed 1.2417 lap after I put front sway bar to "soft" (previous track day's best was 1.24.9-same weather, 2 weeks apart, front bar at "hard"). Still, car felt "difficult". My best lap on A052 and "butt corner balance" was 1.227 (front and rear sway bars at "soft")
Tires are fresh, installed about 2 months ago.

BGTV8-could you please elaborate on bolded out section? Can more bar at the rear result in more understeer-I thought it was the opposite?


Looked over my alignment sheets. Yes, I lost front camber after corner balance
Before CB L-1.8, R -2.0
After CB L -1.2 R-1.6 (makes no sense as L side is lower)
on A052 "butt balance"
L-1.6, R -1.9.

Thank you again!
Introducing understeer implies you have, prima facie, induced additional grip at the rear that has the front out of balance OR the change resulted in less grip at the front somehow.

You have 2 options, you can stiffen the rear bar to kill some of that extra grip OR you can soften the front bar to add some grip at front.

You could also drop the pressures at the front OR add pressure at the rear.

You can also play with the bump at the front (make the front shock softer) or stiffen the rear shock in bump to shift the balance to the front.

You could also lower the ride height at the front to increase front grip and change the balance

Since the handling change came about after the corner-weighting, it is reasonable to assume that might be the root cause BUT you also had new tyres - have you run the new tyres before the corner weighting session as now you have 2 potential root causes (are there any others) .....

Happy to continue the chat via PM if you'd like, but I don't get back here all that often.
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Old 07-22-2024, 10:18 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obender66 View Post
Thank you all for comments. I did not supervise the tech when corner balance was done-I hope that all the proper steps about disconnecting sway bars were followed. Alignment was done in the same shop immediately after corner balance. Shop owner is a time attack champion and well respected in Toronto.

By "large margin" I mean 1.5-2 seconds off the pace per 85 second lap on fresh tires. V730 is slower than A520, but not by that much. I managed 1.2417 lap after I put front sway bar to "soft" (previous track day's best was 1.24.9-same weather, 2 weeks apart, front bar at "hard"). Still, car felt "difficult". My best lap on A052 and "butt corner balance" was 1.227 (front and rear sway bars at "soft")
Tires are fresh, installed about 2 months ago.

BGTV8-could you please elaborate on bolded out section? Can more bar at the rear result in more understeer-I thought it was the opposite?


Looked over my alignment sheets. Yes, I lost front camber after corner balance
Before CB L-1.8, R -2.0
After CB L -1.2 R-1.6 (makes no sense as L side is lower)
on A052 "butt balance"
L-1.6, R -1.9.

Thank you again!
Are those rear camber figures?

seems like significantly less camber than most track Z's are running.

-3 front and -2 rear seems most common
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