The horsepower race has gone nuclear: 2013 GT500

nuTinmuch · 06-06-2012, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadoquad

"Safety measures" didn't make cars lighter. It made them bulkier, less maneuverable, harder to stop. So then braking and handling had to be upgraded to keep up. Engines needed more power to be considered "fast". Then someone noticed that heavier cars with more powerful engines were brutally inefficient, and so FI became the winning move. Even archaic BMW moved into FI performance models.

I never said they did, but they were hardly the only thing inflating the weight of cars.

In fact, I'd wager they weren't even the largest factor, especially when you consider the shift in building materials used and the birth of the crumple zone.

A BMW isn't heavy because it is safe, for example, it is heavy because it is designed to be comfortable and quiet. Those design choices have way more of an implication on vehicle weight than the inclusion of something like traction control, ABS, or structure rigidity.

But that is irrelevant. My point is that it is possible to have a safe, relatively efficient, fun car. None of these things have to mean major sacrifices -- they just often do because they are the road of least resistance. But in the modern era, people are pretty demanding, and that isn't good enough anymore. We want it all, and considering the cars released in the last year or two (and a few of them in the pipeline), we're going to get 'em.

shadoquad · 06-06-2012, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuTinmuch

I never said they did, but they were hardly the only thing inflating the weight of cars.

In fact, I'd wager they weren't even the largest factor, especially when you consider the shift in building materials used and the birth of the crumple zone.

A BMW isn't heavy because it is safe, for example, it is heavy because it is designed to be comfortable and quiet. Those design choices have way more of an implication on vehicle weight than the inclusion of something like traction control, ABS, or structure rigidity.

But that is irrelevant. My point is that it is possible to have a safe, relatively efficient, fun car. None of these things have to mean major sacrifices -- they just often do because they are the road of least resistance. But in the modern era, people are pretty demanding, and that isn't good enough anymore. We want it all, and considering the cars released in the last year or two (and a few of them in the pipeline), we're going to get 'em.

We could argue about this all day, and I'd lump crumple zones in with safety measures. That's why they exist. BMW's were comfortable and quiet in the early 90's. They were also lighter.

But we're veering way off topic here. Suffice to say, the NHTSA is not my best friend.

nuTinmuch · 06-06-2012, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadoquad

We could argue about this all day, and I'd lump crumple zones in with safety measures. That's why they exist. BMW's were comfortable and quiet in the early 90's. They were also lighter.

But we're veering way off topic here. Suffice to say, the NHTSA is not my best friend.

They aren't perfect, but after being in a bad accident in a modern car, I'm a lot softer when it comes to safety stuff.

Anyway, back on topic.

Chevy Camaro ZL1 lines up against Ford Shelby GT500 on the dyno

ImportConvert · 06-06-2012, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuTinmuch

They aren't perfect, but after being in a bad accident in a modern car, I'm a lot softer when it comes to safety stuff.

Anyway, back on topic.

Chevy Camaro ZL1 lines up against Ford Shelby GT500 on the dyno

Looks like I am going to admit to being totally wrong. Ford's power + launch control = big victory at the drag-strip.

I am still not sure what to think about the track, though. The MRC suspension kicks the crap out of Fords dinosaur. But the power difference....I bet on long tracks the GT500 eats it up in the straights but on shorter tracks--especially one's with elevation changes and chicanes--the ZL1 makes the Shelby look clumsy.

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