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[OFFICIAL] Discussion for the next new Nissan 400Z Z35?

I wish the new Z would be offered with the VQ37VHR. I would be perfectly happy. My 370Z has Stillen intakes, Fast Intentions resonated high-flow cats, Tanabe Y-pipe, and an

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Old 10-14-2020, 02:56 AM   #6001 (permalink)
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I wish the new Z would be offered with the VQ37VHR. I would be perfectly happy. My 370Z has Stillen intakes, Fast Intentions resonated high-flow cats, Tanabe Y-pipe, and an EcuTek tune from SpecialtyZ. It is putting out 303hp at the wheels, which translates into around 362hp at the crank. I also added an external oil cooler, and put in a ZSpeed CMAK clutch slave cylinder delete kit with a ZSpeed clutch and flywheel, and a Wavetrac rear diff. The car is pretty much bulletproof now, knock on wood.

SpecialtyZ told me that the 370Z engine is more robust than the VR30DDTT. The VR30DDTT is a great engine, but it is higher maintenance than the N/A VHR engine to be sure. They say it drinks more oil than the VHR. More costly to fix if something goes wrong long-term.

My guess will be that the Z will have the same two engine choices as the Infiniti Q50/Q60- 300hp or 400hp (probably tuned a little higher for each), and the Nismo would probably be around 435hp whenever that is released. I would guess the Nismo model would not be released at the start and would come later.

There's no way the cost of the 400Z will start at the same price as the base 370Z. The engine is more complex and more costly to manufacture; there will be a lot more safety features standard; the interior is upgraded. Hopefully other things like the rear diff is upgraded. Nissan isn't a charity operation and they need to make a profit on the cars they sell.



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Originally Posted by viiv View Post
I posted this in the engine sub-forum:

Test drove a 2020 Q60, I prefer the sound of the VQ37

So yesterday, my wife and I test drove a 2020 Passion Red Infiniti Q60. I did this because I wanted a sneak preview of the new Z's engine, as it's already available today in the current Infiniti lineup. What better way to do it than in a two-door Infiniti finished in the same colour as my 2020 Z.

I don't want to get into things like handling here, because the Q60 will not be the Z. I just want to talk about straight line engine performance as that is what most directly qualifies as being a sneak preview to the new Z.

Is it faster, yes. Is it aurally more enjoyable to drive. NO.

Yes you can chalk some of it up to the Q60s automatic transmission versus the excellent 6-speed in my current car.

But man, the whirring sounds of the VQ37 are what make it the best sounding and most enjoyable V6 on the planet. Sadly, the twin-turbo 3.0 lacks all of that character and makes me really wish Nissan would continue offering the current VQ37 in the new Z as a lower priced base trim level to keep the base entry level price down. I would take a VQ37 trim level, not because it's cheaper, but because of the aural experience. The only way to beat the sensory experience of the VQ is with a V8 or higher.

Numbers on an Excel spreadsheet is not what gives us enjoyment; rather its how a car arouses our senses. Automatic is faster than manual. The 3.0TT is faster than the VQ37. But I'd take the slightly slower, more sensual option any day of the week.
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Old 10-14-2020, 09:02 AM   #6002 (permalink)
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I wonder how hard it would be to put a 400Z steering wheel in a 370Z. LOL
Likely not hard at all. But I would start with the shift knob.
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Old 10-14-2020, 09:15 AM   #6003 (permalink)
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I wish the new Z would be offered with the VQ37VHR. I would be perfectly happy. My 370Z has Stillen intakes, Fast Intentions resonated high-flow cats, Tanabe Y-pipe, and an EcuTek tune from SpecialtyZ. It is putting out 303hp at the wheels, which translates into around 362hp at the crank. I also added an external oil cooler, and put in a ZSpeed CMAK clutch slave cylinder delete kit with a ZSpeed clutch and flywheel, and a Wavetrac rear diff. The car is pretty much bulletproof now, knock on wood.

SpecialtyZ told me that the 370Z engine is more robust than the VR30DDTT. The VR30DDTT is a great engine, but it is higher maintenance than the N/A VHR engine to be sure. They say it drinks more oil than the VHR. More costly to fix if something goes wrong long-term.

My guess will be that the Z will have the same two engine choices as the Infiniti Q50/Q60- 300hp or 400hp (probably tuned a little higher for each), and the Nismo would probably be around 435hp whenever that is released. I would guess the Nismo model would not be released at the start and would come later.

There's no way the cost of the 400Z will start at the same price as the base 370Z. The engine is more complex and more costly to manufacture; there will be a lot more safety features standard; the interior is upgraded. Hopefully other things like the rear diff is upgraded. Nissan isn't a charity operation and they need to make a profit on the cars they sell.
I agree the VQ is the better engine by miles I mean look at what SOHO is doing to these engines. I am highly doubtful we will see something like that out of the VR30. Also as far as I understand from the q50/q60 forums Infinity hasn't fixed the engine's throwing a belt and blowing up so yeah I'm going to pass on a VR30 engine in a Z. Nissan is literally about to make the recalls on the Supra look like a joke. The only reason you don't hear about the engine's blowing on a q60/q50 is because not many people have one so the issue isn't getting much attention.
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Old 10-14-2020, 10:40 PM   #6004 (permalink)
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I agree the VQ is the better engine by miles I mean look at what SOHO is doing to these engines. I am highly doubtful we will see something like that out of the VR30. Also as far as I understand from the q50/q60 forums Infinity hasn't fixed the engine's throwing a belt and blowing up so yeah I'm going to pass on a VR30 engine in a Z. Nissan is literally about to make the recalls on the Supra look like a joke. The only reason you don't hear about the engine's blowing on a q60/q50 is because not many people have one so the issue isn't getting much attention.
Counterpoint to the VR belt issue...

It does not blow the engine. The belt coming off can, rarely, cut the engine wire harness...which is a big deal. Most common issue is that the belt comes off and destroys the coolant reservoir, causing a quick leak-out of coolant and a mess.

It is caused by the AC compressor alignment being out of whack.

However, for me the other "option" to get as much power is to boost my VQ37, which by no means is any more reliable or guaranteed than a VR-equipped car. Take the cost of a relatively new 370Z and add in the cost of boosting it, the tuning, any headaches that do occur, and you now have a car nearly as expensive as what a brand-new VR 300Z will be.
In the case on my AWD VQ coupe, my only real option is to install a SC, and to date I have yet to see a SC'ed VQ37 with a properly fitted air filter, many people just run a turbo guard. I'd rather take my chances with a belt blow-out than running my daily SC'ed car without proper air filtration.

And the VQ ain't no saint either, there was several years it was built using a oil galley gasket that can cause big issues that are expensive to fix.

Fortunately Nissan has had 5+ years to deal with this issue on the VR. Seeing as how the VR is likely the only significant change to the FM chassis, I highly doubt the new Z will have recalls that look like a "joke" compared to the BMW Supra.

What worries me more than the VR motor is whether or not the dash melts like happens in the current Z and previous G. After reading up on the VR belt issue, I'm confident it has either been resolved or I personally can maintain the belt in a manner that prevents the issue. Most people heard belt squealing for a while before belt failure, and it is easy to check if belt failure is imminent.
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Old 10-15-2020, 08:20 AM   #6005 (permalink)
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Counterpoint to the VR belt issue...

It does not blow the engine. The belt coming off can, rarely, cut the engine wire harness...which is a big deal. Most common issue is that the belt comes off and destroys the coolant reservoir, causing a quick leak-out of coolant and a mess.

It is caused by the AC compressor alignment being out of whack.

However, for me the other "option" to get as much power is to boost my VQ37, which by no means is any more reliable or guaranteed than a VR-equipped car. Take the cost of a relatively new 370Z and add in the cost of boosting it, the tuning, any headaches that do occur, and you now have a car nearly as expensive as what a brand-new VR 300Z will be.
In the case on my AWD VQ coupe, my only real option is to install a SC, and to date I have yet to see a SC'ed VQ37 with a properly fitted air filter, many people just run a turbo guard. I'd rather take my chances with a belt blow-out than running my daily SC'ed car without proper air filtration.

And the VQ ain't no saint either, there was several years it was built using a oil galley gasket that can cause big issues that are expensive to fix.

Fortunately Nissan has had 5+ years to deal with this issue on the VR. Seeing as how the VR is likely the only significant change to the FM chassis, I highly doubt the new Z will have recalls that look like a "joke" compared to the BMW Supra.

What worries me more than the VR motor is whether or not the dash melts like happens in the current Z and previous G. After reading up on the VR belt issue, I'm confident it has either been resolved or I personally can maintain the belt in a manner that prevents the issue. Most people heard belt squealing for a while before belt failure, and it is easy to check if belt failure is imminent.
well said.

however, my counterpoint to you statement is even though nissan has had 5 years with this engine and it's issues, doesnt mean they will fix it.


look at the CSC issues on the Z that they've had 11 years to deal with lol

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Old 10-15-2020, 09:20 AM   #6006 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by takemorepills View Post
Counterpoint to the VR belt issue...

It does not blow the engine. The belt coming off can, rarely, cut the engine wire harness...which is a big deal. Most common issue is that the belt comes off and destroys the coolant reservoir, causing a quick leak-out of coolant and a mess.

It is caused by the AC compressor alignment being out of whack.

However, for me the other "option" to get as much power is to boost my VQ37, which by no means is any more reliable or guaranteed than a VR-equipped car. Take the cost of a relatively new 370Z and add in the cost of boosting it, the tuning, any headaches that do occur, and you now have a car nearly as expensive as what a brand-new VR 300Z will be.
In the case on my AWD VQ coupe, my only real option is to install a SC, and to date I have yet to see a SC'ed VQ37 with a properly fitted air filter, many people just run a turbo guard. I'd rather take my chances with a belt blow-out than running my daily SC'ed car without proper air filtration.

And the VQ ain't no saint either, there was several years it was built using a oil galley gasket that can cause big issues that are expensive to fix.

Fortunately Nissan has had 5+ years to deal with this issue on the VR. Seeing as how the VR is likely the only significant change to the FM chassis, I highly doubt the new Z will have recalls that look like a "joke" compared to the BMW Supra.

What worries me more than the VR motor is whether or not the dash melts like happens in the current Z and previous G. After reading up on the VR belt issue, I'm confident it has either been resolved or I personally can maintain the belt in a manner that prevents the issue. Most people heard belt squealing for a while before belt failure, and it is easy to check if belt failure is imminent.
The blown engines aren't caused by the belts they are separate problems. I should have worded that different. The engine's are blowing up from extremely excessive oil consumption (to the point it will drain an engine dry) and bad turbo seals. There is a guy on the forum that has had his car with Infinity for month or two now and they still can't figure out why it's eating fluids. Like FPenvy said if they can't fix the csc issue in 11 years I have little faith they will fix the other issues in 5.
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Old 10-15-2020, 05:57 PM   #6007 (permalink)
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Old 10-15-2020, 09:11 PM   #6008 (permalink)
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well said.

however, my counterpoint to you statement is even though nissan has had 5 years with this engine and it's issues, doesnt mean they will fix it.


look at the CSC issues on the Z that they've had 11 years to deal with lol

I hear ya! My 2007 Titan suffered cracked exhaust manifolds. Nissan never solved that issue.
New Gen 2 Titans lose cylinder 7, Nissan won't tell anyone why.
My 2014 Q60 will eventually get a sticky dash, even though the Q60/G37 was released in 2007, and the issues became apparent in early 2010 for many people, Nissan never resolved that issue (heard it happens to Z also).

I bought my first new Nissan in 1995. Have always had some issue with them all. I have also owned a bunch of other cars. My most recent troublesome car was a 2016 GTI that was always in the shop, needed the sunroof assembly and DSG replaced by 20K miles.

To me, these issues are "manageable" as I am a car enthusiast and I work on my own cars, kind of a bummer that cars aren't better, but many of the desirable cars seem to have issues.
Heck, I even had a 2003 Toyota V6 that had some kind of warranty extension and TSB about engine sludge.

Maybe a more reliable car would be a Lexus, but as everyone knows, it is very difficult to tune and mod Toyota engines as the ECUs are locked-down big time. So, Nissan and Infiniti for me.
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Old 10-16-2020, 10:48 AM   #6009 (permalink)
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I hear ya! My 2007 Titan suffered cracked exhaust manifolds. Nissan never solved that issue.
New Gen 2 Titans lose cylinder 7, Nissan won't tell anyone why.
My 2014 Q60 will eventually get a sticky dash, even though the Q60/G37 was released in 2007, and the issues became apparent in early 2010 for many people, Nissan never resolved that issue (heard it happens to Z also).

I bought my first new Nissan in 1995. Have always had some issue with them all. I have also owned a bunch of other cars. My most recent troublesome car was a 2016 GTI that was always in the shop, needed the sunroof assembly and DSG replaced by 20K miles.

To me, these issues are "manageable" as I am a car enthusiast and I work on my own cars, kind of a bummer that cars aren't better, but many of the desirable cars seem to have issues.
Heck, I even had a 2003 Toyota V6 that had some kind of warranty extension and TSB about engine sludge.

Maybe a more reliable car would be a Lexus, but as everyone knows, it is very difficult to tune and mod Toyota engines as the ECUs are locked-down big time. So, Nissan and Infiniti for me.
yea i hear ya i do all the work on my cars as well minus tranny fluid changes since i do not have the right equipment to do it properly.

i'm still waiting to see a final production new Z and see specs on it before i make a decision.

in the meantime i keep digging into other options for the next addition to the garage.
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Old 10-18-2020, 08:11 PM   #6010 (permalink)
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Estimated pricing for the Z was just dropped on a Japanese car magazine
https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/206414
■ New Fairlady Z Estimated price
● Base grade (304ps) /4.5 million yen ~$42k USD
● Version S (304ps) / 5 million yen ~$47k USD
● Version T (304ps) / 5 million yen ~$47k USD
● Version ST (405ps) / 6 million yen ~57k USD
● NISMO (405) ~ 450ps) / 7 million yen. ~66k USD
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Old 10-18-2020, 09:32 PM   #6011 (permalink)
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Estimated pricing for the Z was just dropped on a Japanese car magazine
https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/206414
■ New Fairlady Z Estimated price
● Base grade (304ps) /4.5 million yen ~$42k USD
● Version S (304ps) / 5 million yen ~$47k USD
● Version T (304ps) / 5 million yen ~$47k USD
● Version ST (405ps) / 6 million yen ~57k USD
● NISMO (405) ~ 450ps) / 7 million yen. ~66k USD
Interesting! I tried to figure out the MSRP of the current Fairlady Z in Japan, all I could find was that they start around $40K when converted to USD. I think they may be more money in Japan. I would expect US MSRP to be lower.

EDIT, I figured out the Japanese website: https://www3.nissan.co.jp/vehicles/n...30rst000000020

Looks like the VR Z will be only slightly more than the VQ Z.
Current VQ Z pricing:
S is 4.85 million yen
ST is 5.3 million yen
Nismo is 6.52 million yen

So, approximately 6-8% more than the VQ car.
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Old 10-19-2020, 07:56 AM   #6012 (permalink)
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Interesting! I tried to figure out the MSRP of the current Fairlady Z in Japan, all I could find was that they start around $40K when converted to USD. I think they may be more money in Japan. I would expect US MSRP to be lower.

EDIT, I figured out the Japanese website: https://www3.nissan.co.jp/vehicles/n...30rst000000020

Looks like the VR Z will be only slightly more than the VQ Z.
Current VQ Z pricing:
S is 4.85 million yen
ST is 5.3 million yen
Nismo is 6.52 million yen

So, approximately 6-8% more than the VQ car.
I don't think overall the price hike is bad if these estimated numbers are correct. However I am a little surprised they might only do the 400hp version in the top trims. I understand you can tune it or buy a JB4 to bring them up to that HP. However I think it would have looked much better for them to have gotten it in the sport trim level. Would have looked great for them to have a ready to go 400hp car for under 40k. Still 43~44k for a 400 hp car isn't bad. Also who's not going to look at this an go I can spend less money and get a NA engine with 10% more HP ? I'm just not understanding the reason for putting the 300hp engine in the new Z.
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Old 10-19-2020, 02:04 PM   #6013 (permalink)
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I don't think overall the price hike is bad if these estimated numbers are correct. However I am a little surprised they might only do the 400hp version in the top trims. I understand you can tune it or buy a JB4 to bring them up to that HP. However I think it would have looked much better for them to have gotten it in the sport trim level. Would have looked great for them to have a ready to go 400hp car for under 40k. Still 43~44k for a 400 hp car isn't bad. Also who's not going to look at this an go I can spend less money and get a NA engine with 10% more HP ? I'm just not understanding the reason for putting the 300hp engine in the new Z.
The breakout of the trims and pricing makes perfect sense - even moreso than the 370Z's pricing ever did, because you're getting something tangibly and measurably better in the top trims that more aligns with what potential buyers might throw their money at. The 300hp version of the VR30DDTT is also cheaper to produce, contributing to a less expensive entry level model.

On the low end, you have a 300hp version that is an improvement over the previous generation car in virtually every way. More tech, more power under the curve, better standard equipment. It will also be price-positioned to play in the BRZ/MX5/EcoBoost Mustang space. The BRZ starts at $28k, and I believe even the 370Z is a superior vehicle (for what is less than 10% more money right now, new for new, base trim to base trim, excluding any available incentives). Whatever vanilla toyota juice gets pumped into the "all new" BRZ doesn't sound like it will even compare to the leap the powertrain will make from the 370 to the new Z. For those that want to mod, the choice will be a no brainer - the Z will have a far higher ceiling than any of those other choices.

On the high end, you'll have a Nismo that makes 100hp+ more (what did so many people gripe about with the current Nismo again?), providing value for costing more and putting it within punching distance of any of the mainstream sports cars in that price range with respect to power output.
We'll also already have a pretty well established aftermarket with AMS and other players that have been active on the Infiniti Red Sport cars.

You'll have a car that's a significant improvement and far more competitive that can compete in two spaces. That's better than what can be said for any point in the 370Z's lifecycle.

While that covers the segment itself, your potential buyer profile also widens. There are those that may be swayed from another brand with the value proposition of the lower end package, and there are those that will be placing a Nismo order the day the books open and bringing it to Z-Con the first chance they get. You can satisfy and retain your cult following of Z buyers (Nissan's first objective as it's their only sure bet on any profitability whatsover) yet allow yourself an opportunity to increase the size of that cult following.

If the car mag in question turns out to be correct, then I will have called this from the beginning and stand by my assessment that this is the right move, and we'll have a Z platform that stands to be in the most potentially profitable position since the Z32. Which brings me to my next prediction -

I think we'll see the return of the 300ZX. I might be wrong, but it would be neat if I wasn't.
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Old 10-19-2020, 02:31 PM   #6014 (permalink)
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i'm slightly confused is S and T are for "sport" and "touring", then why would the plain sport model be a 300hp model?

i know it lines up with Q60 300hp vs Q60RS having 400hp.

buttttt if you toss a "sport" name on it why only 300hp and ST will have 400?

touring was always the way they denoted the upgraded seats.

idk nissan always blows it with the trims especially when they updated it in like 2013 or whatever.

originally the sport touring on the 09-12 models was perfect. i hope thats how they do it again. also curious as to if the GTR brakes will be on sport or touring or only a nismo option.
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Old 10-19-2020, 06:29 PM   #6015 (permalink)
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Do you guys know that in Canada, the base 370Z originally cost 40,000. Then for the 2017 model year (in lieu of an updated car I guess) they cut the price by 10 grand, bringing it down to 30,000. Then when they had to add the factory backup camera to the 2019 base model, they raised the price by $500 from $30,000 to $30,500.

I predict in Canada at least, with the new model, it will be back to 40k for the base model.

This is also a lesson that you get nothing for free. They didn't throw in the factory backup camera for free when they were compelled to add it for the 2019 model year, they actually raised the price by $500 to account for the camera and the Gentex mirror.

I predict, 35k USD/40K CAD for the base model.

Last edited by viiv; 10-19-2020 at 06:33 PM.
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