Going mostly handling specific mods from here on. I don't think I'll be getting a SC anytime soon. I like the amount of power the car has right now, it works well for the track. Adding TT or SC will bring reliability down a lot and I don't want that.

Mods? Too many to list.

I'm definitely not doing TT, but I may eventually put a light SC in down the road. It really depends what the kits end up looking like (and no, I don't mean how fashionable). Probably this winter at the earliest though. For now I just want to get a proper tune now that all my basic power mods are in place (hi UpRev, I'm looking at you!), and start working on weight/handling/wheels/tires/brakes issues.

Hey wstar,

Why no TT, just no need for that much power? Price?

Install
 

HEY WHO'S DOING YOUR WORK, LOOKING FOR SOMEONE IN THE AREA THAT'S GOOD...:driving:

I think wstar has been doing his own installs.

Why are you yelling? ;) (I'm just poking fun)

LOUD NOISES!!! :happydance:

:pTT will give the maximum peak horsepower, but the drawbacks from my point of view are:

1) Very complicated compared to NA or SC. Lots more parts, a lot more to monitor and tweak, a lot more little things can fail over time, engine bay a whole lot more crowded, etc.

2) Probably makes more power than I really need if I get a big kit, and a small TT kit is probably within range of an SC's power increase anyways.

3) Turbo Lag. Doesn't matter going for max highway speed or dyno runs, but that's not my focus. I'm just not a fan of the way a TT car feels/responds when trying to finesse a car through corners in traffic and such. SC is more consistent and smooth in this regard.

Everyone has different priorities though, and for some TT might be just what they're looking for. For me, I'll either stay NA or go SC, depending on how relatively cheap/simple/reliable the vendor(s) can make the SC kits.

Edit: and yes, I've done all my own work so far. Nobody has turned a wrench on my car but me [well, me and a couple friends in the case of the header install], although I did have to go to an exhaust guy over the crossmember clearance issue, but he didn't turn wrenches, he just lit up a torch and got out a hammer. One thing I'll definitely be using someone else for is mounting/balancing tires, and setting up my alignment. Oh and having some custom stuff fabbed for the trunk (to give me more cargo room with the spare/sub gone and fit over my battery box, etc). Beyond that though, I'm going to try to do it all myself.

Exactly the kind of reply I was looking for, wstar, thanks! I never drove turbos, so I was looking for some different perspectives.

What he said!

Plus "Plans" added to first post.

Spend the turbo money on track time - you'll have way more fun *and* be much faster...

but "twin turbo" sounds way cooler than supercharger LOL

Some of the concerns are real, lag is not one of them, but when it kicks in it is harder than a sc so it does take some maneuvering to keep it straight

but the main thing is to keep it simple if tracking is the main focus of the car, a TT will add more things to worry about breaking as well as more heat to break things.

What do you guys think of NOS? I had it on a Maxima years ago, and it was a blast (no pun intended). What I liked about it is that you only used it when you wanted to have a little fun; it wasn't always on the way a supercharger or turbo is. On the down side, getting bottles refilled can be a bit of a pain. I ended up taking the NOS out and putting a supercharger in, and ended up regretting that move. Yeah, it was nice to have boost always available, but it complicated matters and I started to have reliability issues. In fact, it was such a bad experience that it kinda turned me off from doing FI ever again (unless a car comes from the factory FI). I kinda think putting NOS on the 370Z would be fun though.

I think for some it makes sense. It's an cheap and easy way to make extra horsepower for a straight line run at the drag strip or what have you.

For the track junkies it isn't an option to even have in the car as it is typically banned. I guess you could have the setup and remove the bottle for track days but it's just another complication to getting the car ready for the track.

I think calling it NOS is a bad thing, thats what I think :)

Its the cheapest power per dollar upgrade you can get, and can be very reliable with the right precautions in place (window switch, fuel pressure safety switch). Although, reliability issues with a supercharger? Did you install yourself? S/C's are generally very reliable, particularly if you aren't running some obscene amount that pushes the car past its limits...

I think it's because most people can't figure out how to type N₂O on their keyboards :)

Yeah personally I'd feel better reliability-wise with an SC than the N₂O, but I have limited experience with all of this (never on my own cars, just friends' cars). Whether I do any of the above is highly dependent on who makes the kits and how I feel about them after they're released (and even then, maybe after some testing by others).

you will switch over to permanent boost like sc or turbo after running out of NOS a couple of times LOL

Just a pet peeve of mine is all. NOS is a brand. Nitrous, is what you want to install - no need to say N2O :).

If I do an SC (which I want to do - 400 WHP is my ideal goal), bare minimum I'd be changing out the rod bolts and head bolts. Changing out the bottom end right off the bat might be silly, because that power amount isn't that drastic...I don't see why 400- WHP shouldn't be easy for this motor to handle...

I ran juice on my LS1, and it was great at the track. But thats it...I don't know, I didn't exactly street race much, it was overrated to me.

If I were to install Nitrous, I would most likely go with NOS, the brand. Hence my use of 'NOS', the name. But your point is well taken, as my question was intended as 'what do people think of nitrous', not 'what do people think of this particular brand of nitrous'.

I had a Stillen kit on my Maxima (Vortech blower), and it was installed by a performance shop. The same guy who has installed all my 370Z stuff, in fact. The issue I had in particular wasn't with the SC itself. What happened after the SC was installed was an intermittent fuel cut-off issue. I'd step on it and every once in a while, all power would just cut out. If I lifted off the throttle and nailed it again, it'd come back. But it was really annoying. I had the car dyno-tuned after installing the SC and everything. I have no idea what caused that. Maybe there was a problem with the Apexi fuel controller we were using or something. In any case, it's made me apprehensive about going down that route again is all.

Bobo, any other reasons you would like to run a SC over a turbo? I feel like a SC would be better for me as well. I think I would better appreciate the power/reliability/cost of a SC over a turbo.

I was just wondering.

Actually the oxide is the important part of N2O. Nitrogen is an inert gas, it is the extra oxygen molecule that separates under heat and pressure that is important.

Probably the bigger issue is will the block take the extra heat generated and what are the resulting oil temperatures going to be.

Turbo's are a great option too, but unless you're running a smaller turbo, down-low power tends to suffer, and turbos tend to peak more. I'm interested less in peak power, than I am with power across the whole band. In which case, SC's are a fantastic way to build instant power down low (which is something the 370 needs badly...). Its unfair to say really, but I feel going for twin turbo setups is, in many cases, ridiculous because its only for people who want to shoot for the moon and say they made *insert huge number here* WHP WOO HOO! Will it ever be utilized? Probably not.

Also, running a turbo will require changing out your exhaust manifold, and may make passing emissions testing a royal PITA, and seeing as Im in a state that requires that, its not worth it. Whereas, a supercharger is quite happy with stock exhaust manifolds and a nice cat back :)

Thats a couple reasons right there for ya.

I'm just yankin' your chain dude!

BTW, why not NX or another brand that gauges its shots based on wheel horsepower instead of crank?

Actually, it drops intake charge temperature, and the only very noticeable effect is increased cylinder pressures (which is the thing you need to worry about). Particularly, using such a big shot to just blow a rod through the block. Burning a piston/piston ring can happen too of course. Either way, the key is to make sure you're spraying enough fuel to compensate, and to not use such a big shot that your bottom end wrecks itself.

The blue bottles that NOS uses would match the color of my car better, that's why. (I'm just kidding.) I haven't really researched all the different options on N2O, to be honest. NOS is just the brand that I used on the Maxima, so it's what comes to mind any time I think of nitrous oxide.

Nitrous Outlet tends to make some quality kits, that are well priced. Might look into them too. I think they gauge their shot based on WHP, also...

PS - sorry for whoring up your journal btw, RCZ :)

Yes intake temperate does drop (because it's an expanding gas) but burn temperature is higher due to the highly oxygenated atmosphere and additional fuel burn.

It's usually not a problem as you're only doing this for a few seconds at a time typically.

hey no problem I know its hard to stay away from the best journal in the universe..

its useful info, I dont mind.

Oh geez...:rolleyes: Hey man, I'm still 15th runner up!! :hello:

Of course Im kidding. Im kinda sad today... Im about to run out of gas from the tank I filled up over the weekend with 108 Octane race gas....

Interesting ... did the car respond well to the race gas?

I'm guessing it did, which is why he's sad that it's about to run out.

I wouldn't expect it to without a tune. The MAS/MAF whatever in the intakes and the A/F meters in the headers can retune for a lot of things, but I don't think they're capable of retuning themselves for higher octane. I would suspect all it does it buy you extra insurance against knock/detonation.

x2

Dont forget the wonderful race gas smell, too...mmmmmmm...

LOL, maybe he was just enjoying getting high on the fumes :happydance:

I was also under the impression that the car only "detuned" for low octane to prevent knock. If it can up-tune as well that would be really cool.

I think the issue there is that the car doesn't have any way to 'sense' the increased octane to account for it. It can sense too little octane, but only the hard/indirect way, by noticing knock and backing off to eliminate it.

Hence the need for a different flash/tune to take advantage of race gas. One of the things I like about the UpRev stuff I was reading is that they can store up to 5 maps in your reflash and you can switch them via the cruise control buttons without reflashing again. You can have an easy-going map for light driving and/or questionable fuel, an all-out on 93 pump gas map, a 108 race gas map, a valet map, etc.

Really? You sure you're not thinking of Cobb? It'd be cool if UpRev can do this.

IIRC, Cobb's switching uses their handheld unit and takes a little while (not long though). UpRev's reflashed ROM has all the maps preloaded, it just moves a little pointer when you use the cruise control switches, pretty much instant.

You can read about UpRev Osiris feature-list here: Osiris - Tuner - Osiris - Default Store View

Edit: Link to Osiris User Manual: http://uprev.com/documentation/Osiri...Guide%20V2.pdf

Edit again, paste from the above manual:

Cool! Looks like you have to buy your own license though. I'm going to be spending $800 to have my car dyno tuned with UpRev as it is. If Sharif (Forged Performance) can upload additional maps, cool. But if he can't, I don't think I'll be spending another $900 for this ability.

All of the Osiris versions support map switching. I don't know what the licensing details are on tuners using the feature of course.

well, the point of using race gas is to just have an additional margin of safety at the track. When the car is flat out for 20 minutes in 100 degree weather reaching high temps... that's when it is most prone to knocking. Racegas on an otherwise stock tune is just an additional line of defense. If you guys track the cars, its nice to at least mix some 5 gallons or so of 108 octane gas into your 93. You will end up with about 98 octane and thats pretty good for the car...


Also about the osiris..I used to have a UTEC on my sti and you could literally just switch a little remote dial with numbers on it to switch maps. The osiris system looks pretty cool too, I am going to have that... definitely going to have a track tune, a race gas tune for the track, valet and everyday.

Also...my brake light is turning on whenever I put the clutch in during hard acceleration....like when the cars weight shifts back...almost as though brake fluid is sloshing around, maybe in the reservoir?