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phunk's CJM Greddy TT - Build, Info, Reviews, Etc
My name is Charles, I am a partner of CJ Motorsports. We have a very strong 350z/G35 background (and more), but we dont need to float on that, we will make ourselves here from scratch. We have only been "behind the scenes" with the 370 so far, and will be coming out from under our rock over the next few weeks with some of our work. Since we are a small manufacturer/enthusiast/development team, we work with most Z tuners, but we are not a tuner shop for the public.. just our own project cars and occasional contract projects for shops and local guys. We are constantly building custom solutions for cars, and one of our new goals is to start making more of them into retail products for the consumer and less of them as custom one-off components.
Moving forward... The car: 2009 370z Base/Sport 6MT, Black, Daily Driver. Mild body work, TE37SLs with 275/305 RE11s, H&R springs, PW:JDM shift knob, fuzzy dice. 2011 Goals: Get the BASICS on the car, get it out of the slow category, learn the ECU and how to tune it, familiarize myself all around with the car, and decide what we are going to build for the car that is also a viable product for the masses and tuners. Also figure out what we are going to build just for this car :) Oh, and try not to blow the motor while personally learning the engine management software and the timing curve for E85. Future Goals: its going to be really cool. Summer 2011 Project ("Phase 1"): Greddy Twin Turbo Kit w/ Custom CJM Wastegate Setup Uprev Osiris Engine Management Injector Dynamics id1000cc Fuel Injectors OS Giken Twin Clutch / Flywheel ZSP Heavy Duty CSC Tial BOV x2 Oil Cooler Kit Greddy Dual 2.75" Exhaust Aeromotive Stealth 340 Fuel Pump E85 Fuel HKS EVC 5 Boost Controller Status: COMPLETED - PARTIALLY TUNED RESULTS: Partially tuned 8/9/11, 524rwhp @ 8 psi, dynojet. Not comfortable with mid range / peak torque timing at all... only partly comfortable with full power timing. Researching E85 more and retuning next week. SPECIAL THANKS TO; Mike @ Greddy Performance Products Rich and Jared @ UPREV Tony @ Injector Dynamics Andrew Rubio @ Performance Motorsports |
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The Car: (pics coming soon, no good ones at the moment) Taking the plunge for the first time http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...ure37315-1.jpg Throttle Body Coolant Elimination; I did this because I hate clutter. This is one of MANY MANY steps you will watch me take over the span of this cars project to remove and relocate things. The TB coolant lines come from the coolant outlet pipe on the back of the engine. Its a cast aluminum pipe that collects the hot coolant from the rear of each cylinder head and feed it into a pipe that runs down the center of the V in the block to come out where you see your radiator cap housing. From this pipe it enters one throttle body, then to a small metal crossover pipe, to the other throttle body, then to a coolant return pipe on the passenger side of the engine. Here is the aluminum pipe where it starts: http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37336-23.jpg I pulled out the pressed in barb: http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...e37337-243.jpg I ran a 1/8 NPT Tap in there and put in a stainless plug: http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37338-25.jpg UNFORTUNATELY I did not take a picture of where we cut the barb off the coolant return pipe and welded it shut. I will one of these days. Heres all the hoses that are no longer in my engine bay: http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37339-26.jpg next time I am in there I will also remove the metal tube that brought the coolant from one throttle to the other on the back of the intake manifold. Its welded to the same brackets as the EVAP vacuum pipe, so you would have to cut it off to remove it, which is cool with me. Turbo Oil Manifold; Ive been building cars a long time. I HATE seeing Tee fittings for oil lines. I wont go into it really, but its just not racecar :) So I took a hour to hand machine a little oil manifold that mounts to the front of the oil pan. Its ugly, but its racecar. Basically, I removed the oil pressure sensor. I made a short line to feed the oil manifold from the oil pressure sensor port. I put the oil pressure sensor on the far end of the manifold. I put a fitting for each turbo on the manifold. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37341-29.jpg the back has a groove for the oil pressure sensor wires to tuck in http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37342-30.jpg Here is a terrible picture of the test fit. This is before adding the fire sleeve to each oil line, etc. Sorry it was hard to photo with the radiator and fans right in front of the engine. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37340-27.jpg Oil Filter; I modified an already great oil filter to make it more suited for the ultra high performance of a TT 370z by adding the "Xtreme" to it. This was done by hand. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37326-13.jpg Turbo System; Drivers Side turbo installed with custom MVS wastegate adapter installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37347-36.jpg Passenger Side turbo installed with custom MVS wastegate adapter installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37348-37.jpg Photo of some of the preperations made to passenger side to increase my comfort of heat management etc Notice main fuel feed line is entirely rerouted away from turbo system heat. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37344-33.jpg Passenger Side with wastegate installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37350-39.jpg Drivers Side with wastegate installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37349-38.jpg Intercooler On there.. Things to notice... Oil cooler is now stuffed behind it :( Tial BOVs we welded on there. Little bracket securing oil cooler lines from movement and rubbing. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37323-10.jpg http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...ure37321-8.jpg Custom open dump tubes up there: http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...ure37318-4.jpg Done from the top - Yes the TB coolant barbs are still on the TBs... I will be yanking those barbs out next time I pull the intake off. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37328-15.jpg http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37327-14.jpg Clutch and CSC; Removed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37345-34.jpg Installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37346-35.jpg Installed http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...re37351-40.jpg Vacuum and Starter Cable Tuck; Start cable... youve got to be kidding me. They run that ugly thing over the top of the timing chain cover just draped across the engine. GTFO starter cable. I ran it through the cowl with the AC pipes and etc, it comes out the brake boost compartment, and down the drivers side of the bay to the starter. You cant really see it in any of my pics, because its pretty much tucked. In this first picture you can see my vacuum manifold setup and the starter cable going under it in that wire loom. My vacuum manifold and hose configuration replaced the brake booster hardpipe and handles all my vacuum sourcing needs and is tucked out of site. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...ure37316-2.jpg with the cowl panels and compartment covers on, here is all you see of vacuum lines... the bulkhead fitting going from the boost controller to the wastegates. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...h-firewall.jpg Interior Stuffs; nothing to out of this world, im not really into super decked out interiors. just an aluminum panel we made to hold the wideband and EVC. of course the cubby door shuts if I dont want to see it. Other interior mods would be the AVIC x930bt, I am not a car stereo guy this is the first expensive head unit I have ever bought, its one of my favorite parts of the car now. I have a PWJDM shift knob that you cant see in the pic. The fuzzy dice, and thats pretty much my interior mods. http://www.the370z.com/members/phunk...8-photo222.jpg |
Space reserved for product reviews
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Space reserved for whatever else I am forgetting
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In for results.
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524whp at 8psi, man...why do I even bother with this sc haha.
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it was actually more like 7.5psi but on some of the passes it would creep up to 8.0 for a moment :)
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Nice! Cant wait to see you this in action Charles!
Need that fuel starvation fix for the race car btw :) |
ahh very similar to my build! congrats.
i would like to see the pics of the tb mod |
OK i have added photos of:
THrottle body coolant elimination turbo oil manifold clutch and csc vacuum manifold setup turbo kit layout that is all i have time for today... i have a lot of work to do for the next 4 hours and then i am off to the lakehouse for the weekend. when i get back i will give you guys more cool stuff. i might write some of the product reviews while on vacation, if i do i can probably post from my phone. |
exciting thread, but what pics????? i dont see any?
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Oh let me unlock the album, guess it's set so only I can see lol
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Should work now, sorry about that
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Great thread, im in!
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awesome results!
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Good to see you are finally on the forums, Charles. We talked on the phone for awhile a few weeks back about your fuel return kit and the issues regarding inconsistent vacuum pressure when cruising due to the VVEL/throttle body issues. Have you had any more luck figuring out a work around for the issue?
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Awesome build. Once my install is complete, we can compare notes.
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Phunk, how would I go about getting the barbed fittings out of the throttle bodies? I haven't messed with them for I didn't want to break them off in the TB's. I know they can be removed for I've seen it. Nobody was around for me to ask that day.
Nice build. That's how they should be done. |
those types of barbs are a press fit. so they literally just have to be pulled out. easier said than done, but they do pull out. You have to be very careful how you load it, or you may crack the brittle cast aluminum. I usually just grab them in a vice and twist back and force to break the seal and then pull and spin.
remember one thing, there is no going back. The best you can do to add barbs again later is to tap the leftover holes and thread in fittings. |
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Sounds like a plan Dai. Not sure I want to make that move at this time though. I will see about it once I build another motor w/ forged internals........
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From the 350Z to 370Z... sick build as usual. :tup:
Do you have any dyno charts? I'd like to peek at the torque curve at different boost levels. |
Amazing results,
Best fuel system ever and amazing cusomer service,.. Good luck with your project |
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thanks guys. i do have my dyno charts from last week... but im trying to get back on the dyno ASAP. the midrange/torque curve is what i need to do all my work on with the ignition timing. my research is pointing to me that my current timing curve is way off target in those RPMs (due to E85 and my lack of experience with it). I wanted to get back on there this week but so far havent had time. perhaps this weekend or early next week i can.
as for the manifold vacuum holding steady under various circumstances, i havent yet done any logging with the intentions of keeping an eye on that and looking for any patterns or consistencies that would make it safe to say that we could use vacuum referenced regulators on this car. it will require supplemental logging equiptment since the stock ECU does not monitor the MAP sensor... well at least it doesnt appear that way as its not currently an option supported by my Osirus ROM. I think its just for the VVEL module but perhaps it is wired to the ECU... I dont have my service manual here to look at how its wired. I am hoping to have time to add to my thread in the next couple days... super busy with trying to wrap up some new products. |
How time flies! I am at 5700 miles since the turbo install. The car is holding up amazing and running very strong. I still daily drive it and daily cruise/abuse it. Its actually my only car at the moment. Weather has just been so great in Chicago the last few weeks, that I cannot stop to take a break from enjoying this car.
I haven't bothered to put it back on the dyno yet. Apparently my work on the tune so far was safe enough. Nothing seems to phase the engine. I have been running the boost to 8.5-9.5 psi occasionally. I have no idea what its making there... if i had to guess maybe 550-570rwhp since the car seems to make about 30hp per psi. But 75% of the time I am at just 8 psi anyway. My 305 RE11s are about done for. I ran maybe 8000 miles out of them. That was with about 1.5* negative camber in the rear. I havent done any typical burnouts or donuts yet, but the 370 leaves intimidating patches of rubber if I floor it in 2nd or middle of 3rd, and I am guilty of doing it for no good reason other than to just admire it in the rear view mirror often enough. Many very fast cars around Chicago have been humbled recently. Those that ask are shocked to hear the car is running less than 10psi boost on a stock engine. It seems to impress most enthusiasts, and piss off the rest. I get into it with a few good cars a week. GT500s, SRT cars, turbo Porsches, C6 Z06s.. all the typical fast cars. Without significant mods, they can forget it. Exception, an '08 997 GT2 with minor mods gave me an even run the other day, but that's no regular turbo Porsche. The twins on the 370z really put the car into an entirely different performance category. Keeping it real, many of the "fast" cars that the twin turbo 370z can now pull on, would kill the Z should they have as significant of an upgrade. But alas, 99% of them do NOT, and good luck finding them out there. Making a slow car fast while its still a pretty new model really does compound the entertainment value. I experienced the same thing in 2004 with my TT 350z. I can imagine that many of the enthusiasts that wanted to give me a go, probably had not been given a chance to even have at a stock 370z yet. While I do see them on the road, I have yet to find myself next to one let alone one willing to give a run. So I amuse myself thinking of the guys that were possibly excited to have their first 370z roast just to end up getting completely burned. I have a nice cocky "you like this" sticker on my 1/4 window to top off the experience. |
Great review. Sad for the tires though.:icon17:
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550-570whp on stock internals? Wow that is hardcore, what are your feelings on the long term longevity of running that much power on stock internals Phunk? I know a few others have done so but not with e85 and don't have your experience on the matter.
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well i cant quote any figures, since the highest recorded dyno was 523rwhp at 7.5 psi... i am just assuming its higher since the air flow to the intercooler is much better in this cool weather and i have been running higher than 7.5psi boost.
As for the longevity, Ive got to say that if it holds up for me, I cant imagine how it would break for anyone else. I say that for a few reasons. For one, I have a serious problem. I have a hard time not constantly flooring it everywhere I go. I have a hard time not giving it a run with any car that wants to. I cant go more than a few minutes at a time without at least giving it half throttle away from a light (half is enough to wag the tail around 1st and 2nd). I really just boost it, a LOT. Most guys I know are much easier on their cars. One close look at my car and you can see its been through it, and driven hard. I would never, say, ROAD RACE the car at this power level on a stock engine, I do not think the engine would make it more than a few laps (but maybe im wrong, maybe it would never break). But I wouldnt hesitate to run the boost at like 4psi and road race it. Another reason is, I still have a LOT of tuning to do on the car. While it runs and drives really well, I would never have given a customer back their car how it currently sits. There is way too much refinement to put into the tune. I think the car will only get smoother and more powerful from doing so, but its already good enough that I am being lazy about it since its my own car. Since my highest actual dyno number so far is 523rwhp at 7.5psi... I will say that I would have no reservations what so ever running the car at 525rwhp turbocharged. Definitely well within the safe-zone there. |
Great results!
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e85 on a TT Z, damn the simple idea gets me hyped.
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I am not sure if I mentioned it earlier in the thread or not, but I put over 200 hours into the install. I could have tossed it in with probably 50 hours work, but to spend such little time on my first rodeo with the 370 would result in a half *** job. I think I could do it again just how I did or better in about 80 hours now, and probably 50 the next time. The engine bay is different enough from the 350z that I had to learn new tricks, angles, custom tools, for working about the difficult spots. With all that time spent, I would be rather upset if I had to open my hood for anything at all! I am proud to say that the hood has only been opened to either show someone the install, change/check the oil, and, well, thats it. I have not had a single mechanical problem requiring any attention. Nothing has needed any adjustment. I believe this setup can be very reliable for DD. Key points for reliability being: 1: tune quality 2: oil/fuel/etc fluid quality and maintenance 3: high quality plumbing (this means quality hoses, no crappy fragile T fittings, no crummy vacuum hoses, proper heat and abrasion protection to all OEM and added hoses). 4: quality hardware and gaskets. i dont usually use anything given to me in spots where i expect it to last. i can expand on this if anyone needs. 5: keep it simple, dont over complicate. some people tend to just buy everything they can find.... part A doesnt fit right with part B, or you overwhelmed the installer and they rush through the last of the stuff, etc. use what you need, get it tuned and done. if you need something else later, add it then. In regards to oil temperature, I for sure need a larger or a second core now. The last few days have cooled off significantly, we are in the 60s/70s, oil temp for street use has been no concern. However, last week and labor day weekend it was high 80s low 90s. I could keep the oil around 200 degrees if I drove it like an old man all over the place... but within about 30-40 seconds of hard driving, I was at 220 and climbing. I really dislike passing 220 because I believe that is when power reduction begins in the ECU tuning. I swear I used to feel it when NA, and I swear I still feel it now. |
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I love it. The 100 octane I used to run in my 350z was twice as much. With the E85, you do definitely notice the reduction in gas mileage, there is no denying it. But its not so bad, it doesnt bother me. Only one thing about it sucks... my 370z, the fuel level reading is a lot more sensitive on the lower end then it is on the top end. I can drive forrrrrever on the first half tank. the second half tank... not so much. I can barely get anywhere. If I leave my house with 5 dots on the gauge, seriously 20 min later I am at 2 dots and need to get fuel ASAP because I am almost out. Last week I actually had a hilarious close call, my car ran out of gas 5 feet from the E85 pump. I know I was going to die any second I actually blew 2 stoplights and a stopsign on the way.. The car died a half block from the station but I was goin 50 or so, I was able to coast in and navigate all but the very last turn up to the pump. LOL a lady at the pump next to me helped me push it up! |
How complicated is it going over the e85? Thus far you're the first and only one, is it as simple as running the right injectors, fuel pump and lines and tune?
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You pretty much just need to make sure you have enough fuel pump and injectors, then fill the tank, and retune.
While the 370z fuel system isnt "rated" for E85, there is nothing about it that is going to have a significant reduction in lifespan that will you notice except maybe the fuel pump itself. While walbros and aeromotives and DWs seem to do OK with E85, I have been told that none of them are actually rated for it, and lifespan is reduced.. but supposedly not enough that anyone would care. All of the factory plumbing is fine for E85 though, its all coated steel, teflon, and nylon. We will see, this is my first E85 ride! |
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