Wish I could go E85 like you did. There are NO public E85 stations in MD that I can find, so everytime I go home to visit will suck. TX has quite a few, but I may just do a race fuel mix to tide me over when I turn up the boost.

How do you like the E85? Good fuel economy? Nice power?

tune your car so it limits power per gear so you have traction and thus maximum acceleration for the amount of traction that you have.

newer boost controllers and EMS's can do this.

I like E85 in the following ways:

*cheaper than 100 octane, by far, i believe i currently pay $3.30
*once you get used to the smell, its more pleasant in a car without cats than gasoline is... my clothes dont stink after 2 hours in the car, and the entire car doesnt smell like exhaust
*higher octane

i dislike it because

*pain in the *** to get. more than half the "e85 stations" listed on the websites that locate for you, no longer carry it. i believe e85 was a trend that is dying... i was expecting it to be much more available but its actually quite a hassle to get it.
* not a huge deal but the loss in mileage is noticable once the fuel level gauge is down around 1/3, it starts moving REAL fast down once it gets there. 1/3 tank is the point where i cannot risk taking the car anywhere but towards an e85 station, because it will drop LEDs way faster than you expect and next thing you know youre empty. i have ran out of gas only once so far, luckily i had enough speed to coast into the station and stop 5 feet short of the e85 pump

if its available in someones area, i would say its great for anyone on a stock engine because with 1000cc injectors and an aeromotive stealth pump, you are able to achieve the power levels that you would want to run the stock engine on. its a rather clean combination.

literally my cars HP upgrades are only; Greddy TT, Greddy exhaust, id1000cc injectors, aeromotive stealth fuel pump, DIY osiris tune.. boom over 500rwhp all day... starts up like stock. i love the combo and e85 is part of it so that means i love it too. im sure this all could have been possible on gasoline too, but i would have chosen 720cc or so injectors and just a regular walbro 255 pump.

7400 miles turbo now!!! racking them up. over 35k on this poor car :(

you are absolutely right!!!

however, i am not at the HP level yet that i feel this is appropriate. i need at least 500rwhp to hold traction in first gear, second should be able to hold down 550-600rwhp. without this much useable power in those gears, the car will not perform how i want it to. Based on my experiences with my 350z, I think this is possible with proper alignment and 305 or wider R888s. so this is my goal! once i get into big leagues horsepower (which wont happen on the stock short block) i will definitely integrate these functions of modern boost controllers.

while there is amusement to be found in rolling burnouts, when its race time, its gets very frustrating to not get to use all the horsepower you worked so hard or paid someone else to work so hard to achieve. why spend more money to limit that power back down?!?! Not yet! For what the car has right now, I want to use it all.

White Dragon v. Phunk, oh what dreams are made of....

E85 is readily available in my area and pretty cheap. Right now I have full bolt ons and it will be awhile before I go F.I. Would I see any gains other than saving at the pump with an e85 conversion?

E85 is cheaper per gallon but you need 30% more fuel, and thus your mpg drops quite a bit. You could likely run more timing but I doubt the results would be huge over 93 without boost.

i dont think you will see any gains from switching to E85 in a bolt on car, but it might be possible. Of course you will need an Uprev Osiris custom tune to run it, it might not hurt to try!

I had no idea that you needed more fuel with that setup. I will have everything it takes to mak it happen, except a station to fill up at. Still kicking around the idea though. Thanks for the info.

hmm might make it a winter project, considering I don't daily drive the car mileage wouldn't really be an issue. I have an UpRev tune so I guess it would be a matter of larger injectors, fuel pump and a retune. I know UpRev allows for multiple maps so wouldn't it be possible to have an e85 tune and a 93 tune? Also when I go F.I. I could still use the injectors and fuel pump, it would be nice to see what an N/A Z could do and the savings at the pump would be sweet!

Performance Motorsport ran 100 octane with more timing, trust me you aren't looking at much.

^ yes if you were going to do E85 now with plans for FI in the future, you may as well just go big on the fuel system from the start since you are going to need a complete retune anyway. Toss in some id1000 and the aeromotive pump, i can get you a pump install kit and tell you how to mod the assembly to support the flow of the larger aero pump.

then you can tune and get the startup, idle, cruise, etc all perfectly squared away so that once you add the FI all you have to do is fine tune for the higher airflow.

yes you could have seperate maps, but that would only work if you run it until totally empty and get all the previous fuel out. converting to e85 doesnt make a flex fuel vehicle, so it has to run on straight 100% the fuel that its tuned for. of course, you dont have to like drain until completely bone dry, a couple % one way or the other should be tolerable, but i would want less than a gallon in the tank when switching back and forth.

I have been having a hard time deciding if I realllly wanted to build the motor in this thing or just "deal with" the power I can make on the stock motor until I get a different car.

Well, we picked up again on our billet intake manifold project yesterday, and I am going to need a high power car to test its limits on. So, I went ahead and ordered some pistons. I have a spare long block in my garage at home. Need to pick out some rods and get this to the machine shop.

I guess I will have lots of updating to do with my thread over the course of the next few months.

awesome, can't wait to see the results Charles. What pistons are you using and what CR?

I ordered some custom Wiseco 10:1 pistons

Nice!!

carrillo or eagle rods?

those are sort of opposite ends of the spectrum, i imagine grabbing something in the middle

Sub'd!!!
Can't wait to see what happens!:tup:

Just rods and pistons correct? Looking forward to seeing this :tup:

Oh yeah.............sub'd

I'm really interested in your build. The only other built 3.7 we know about is Mike's "1000whp" car, but there's not many details regarding his engine build. I will most likely need to build mine very soon. Stupid gremlin noises in my motor...

these are pretty noisy motors in terms of what you can hear sitting inside the car. LOTS of transmission noise in these cars.

It's not a transmission noise, unfortunately. It started after my 3rd run at the drag strip and has gotten progressively louder.

Any chance that its just an exhaust manifold leak? You have a lot of manifold plumbing for a setup like that. Manifold leaks can sometimes sound deceptive. Hopefully its nothing serious

Phunk what are your impressions on the aeromotive pump? Looking back do you feel that the fuel pump is more than up to the e85 task and do you think it will limit you in the long run? Also, starting to win over the wife on the e85 conversion, what part number is the pump? Did you use the stock fuel lines or run new lines as well?

It's the largest pump you can put in the stock pump assembly. I am probably pretty close to its HP limits on e85 and for 2012 I will go bigger. For a SC setup it will run out at a little lower HP. The 11142 is the pump that will go into the stock assembly using our CJM pump install kit or the copy. Stock fuel lines are just fine for e85, no reason to change them. 8700 miles on the e85/tt now. Still good. No worries, e85 is a very simple swap... But if you aren't boosted yet, you should wait until you are or just before... No value in the trouble otherwise!

Hey phunk,

maybe you can answer some of my questions since this build thread is exactly the direction I want to move in, and you seem extremely knowledgeable on this stuff.

How is the power delivery of this kit? I can't seem to find which turbos greddy uses for this kit - is one turbo small for responsiveness, and the other large for power? Or are they both the same? I ask because I drive a turbo'd honda civic right now, and I absolutely _HATE_ the power delivery of it. Here's a printoff of my last buttdyno (in black, red line is what I'd like in a car).

http://i43.tinypic.com/fna3ns.png

My car is essentially a light-switch car. It's slow, slow, slow.. then at 4k the turbo snaps in and it instantly doubles in horsepower. It's not a fun delivery of power, and it just results in wheelspin. Is a TT'd Z any smoother, or does it have the same effect? I would suspect it's a bit smoother being a larger motor that can get the turbos spinning sooner, but who knows. I wasn't expecting this kind of on/off power when I bought the kit, but I can only blame myself for not doing a bit more research.

Also, what's the WG pressure on that kit? I'm wondering how effective boost by gear would be on these cars? Another thing I really hate about my car is I effectively got rid of 1st and 2nd gear - they're nothing but spin gears. I really miss having the ability to romp around town in my car, as it's only a highway beast now. I'd imagine if this kit had a very small WG spring in it (3-4 psi?), you could just run that in 1st and progressively amp it up from there?

Thirdly, any input/experience with that racelogic traction unit? I think if I do get a Z and go this route, which is the most likely choice at this point in time, I want to run a consistent ~500 rwhp, but I'd like to have traction when doing so. To me, that's worth the 2+ grand the traction unit costs, but only if it's actually effective.

Thanks for any help :D If it's of any consolation for the long post you just read, if I do go this route, I would feel most comfortable making the 5 hr trek to Chicago to have you install/tune it over what I have available here.

butt dyno graph.. awesome..

Right from Greddy's website:

Different size turbos to get low and high rpm response is used on in line turbo setups, ours is parallel.

Thanks. Facepalm at myself. I googled earlier and didn't see any mention of it.. googled it now and the first link says just that.

And yeah, that's the old style buttdyno. It's off by about 5%.

Feel free to school me on a TT setup. Is it not possible to use a big and small turbo on a parallel setup, then? That was always my assumption of how TT'd cars worked

Twin-turbo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Worth reading to get a basic understanding. Most setups for the Z are going to be parallel setups. The RX7 is an example of a car with a sequential setup.

Good work. Thank you for sharing the build. Hopefully I can get my G37 on the same track as this bad boy :).

Thanks. I still have intentions to add/update my original posts with all the rest of the details

It wouldnt really work out because you would build very different exhaust pressure on each side of the engine. You would run into bizarre individual cylinder tuning issues. You would also severely choke the cylinders in the bank on the small turbo side as they would have a lot of trouble breating at higher RPM, making those 3 cylinders less useful.

You could do lots of complex plumbing to get both turbos plumbed to both banks, but its not worth the hassle, weight, heat, complexity.

I used a to have an EG hatch, sleeved h22 with sc61. it was 416fwhp at around 15 psi with 93 octane... that was about 6 years ago.

power delivery is good. the Z is a low 13 second car before its turbos even start spinning... so the transition into power is not as extreme. its not laggy at all, the transition is very quick. tire spin is an issue. if you focus on proper wheel and tire configuration you can put the power to the ground. im not sure what the wastegate springs that come in the kit are, i think they are 5psi. i changed my wastegate setup. I think I put in some 5 or 5.5psi in my wastegates too. At that boost, I can hook up no problem at all. So if you setup boost by gear you will be in good shape for traction...

although I would much rather make the car hook up low gears with all my boost, which is one of my next efforts.

The race logic is an effective unit, but I would never put it on my car. the factory VDC is very good if I am ever worried I might be pushing it too hard in the twisties on the street and I want a little backup help, I turn it back on and it does its job. the Race logics advantage is that it is less intrusive when it engages under full throttle, I have used it before, its very smooth. But, why invest into holding back all the HP you just paid good money for? Instead, invest that money into making your car hook up and leave a little on the side for when your R compound tires wear out to pay for the next set or 2.

Great, exactly what I wanted to know. Thanks a lot. What are your plans to hook up in low gears, then? Wider tires, suspension? I don't want another car that is useless in 1st/2nd gear, those are my favorite around town :D

Yes proper tires and alignment. Currently I have 305/30/19 RE11s, RE11s are not up to the task of over 500rwhp. My alignment also needs to have more camber taken out. I am going to switch to a 305 R888 on my 19s for daily use. With that and less camber it should help a ton from where I am now.

For when I want to use all the power I will use a 335 or 345 drag radial on an 18" wheel, I will put it at stock ride height, and set the camber at zero when using this wheel/tire combo. Pricing out different wheels right now for my 18s.

If anyone is ever able to adjust the SRM system then I will swap out the rear end gear for a taller one.

Any more video of your turbo Z? :driving:

Nothing worth posting... Probably won't be any more until spring now... It's gotten too cold for any traction at all! The last week I haven't even driven the 370z. Longest I've gone without it since the turbo install. Buuut since I won't be out driving it, that means I'll have time to give it love, parts, and post updates. I need to get back on track for going after some 1/4 mile goals I had ... Totally just ignored that this year once I got the car boosted

awesome work!!!

What was your best time and trap speed @ the 1/4 mile track?