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Nissan 370Z Forum (http://www.the370z.com/)
-   Wheels & Tires (http://www.the370z.com/wheels-tires/)
-   -   Wheel Spacers 101 (http://www.the370z.com/wheels-tires/43573-wheel-spacers-101-a.html)

Antistupid 05-04-2014 03:32 PM
Thanks for the answers guys. Making my order tomorrow

tnav 05-04-2014 06:03 PM
I run V3 20mm bold on all around, car looks perfect, great for street and fun driving around canyon roads. I will however replace the studs instead, to start tracking the car.

mjm 05-05-2014 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnav (Post 2806552)
I run V3 20mm bold on all around, car looks perfect, great for street and fun driving around canyon roads. I will however replace the studs instead, to start tracking the car.
Your spacers are installed in the pic you have online? We have a virtually identical car. I'm trying to determine if 20mm is too much for the front. Your thoughts?

Driftomodachi 05-06-2014 01:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tnav (Post 2806552)
I run V3 20mm bold on all around, car looks perfect, great for street and fun driving around canyon roads. I will however replace the studs instead, to start tracking the car.
Why would you replace the studs? Bolt on > slip on with replaced studs

Haboob 05-06-2014 01:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjm (Post 2807326)
Your spacers are installed in the pic you have online? We have a virtually identical car. I'm trying to determine if 20mm is too much for the front. Your thoughts?
I think 20mm is perfect.

I ran 20mm all around. I even had my new wheels cut to the same offset of 20mm all around.


I MAYBE would have gone 25mm in the rear, but 20mm all around gives it a nice flush look and I'm okay with that. Not too much of the tire sticking out at all.

Haboob 05-06-2014 01:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driftomodachi (Post 2807820)
Why would you replace the studs? Bolt on > slip on with replaced studs
So that you can use all the threads in the lug to hold it on, otherwise you're only holding that wheel on with 50% (or less, I'm not sure) of the threads.

Doesn't seem safe, nor worth the risk, IMO.

CBRsummer 05-06-2014 08:18 AM
2 Attachment(s)
just threw wheel spacers on the ride. absolutely love how the car looks now. and it may just be in my head, but the car actually seems smoother and turn in is noticeably better.

in my reading, i didn't see anyone mention an off brand of spacer. soooo, i went to amazon looking for something cheap that may be a quality alternative to the h&r's, eibach's, etc. before you start flaming, i did this entirely for testing purposes and the gathering of information and i was prepared to return them if they weren't perfect.

i went with 20mm in the front and 25mm in the rear. total cost was $125 and shipping was free. and yes, they were perfect. so if you're looking for a quality, cnc machined, hub centric spacer at half the cost of the h&r's, i'd highly recommend these.

the 20's fit perfectly on the front but the factory stud does stick out past the spacer. they fit because the rays have recesses in the back of the wheel that allow the wheel to sit flush on the spacer. (the post on amazon says they will not fit.)
the 25's are perfect for the rear with a 275 tire. i may end up dropping down though when i replace the rear tires with something wider next summer.
i used some antiseize on all the hubs and blue locktight on the spacers nuts only.

if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!

Driftomodachi 05-06-2014 08:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haboob (Post 2807822)
So that you can use all the threads in the lug to hold it on, otherwise you're only holding that wheel on with 50% (or less, I'm not sure) of the threads.

Doesn't seem safe, nor worth the risk, IMO.
Funny, you liked my post that said this:

I wouldn't replace studs for track. Track duty sees more torsional stress on the lengthened studs which can stretch or break the studs and cause the wheel to come loose or fall off.

Bolt on spacers are torqued down on the wheel and on the spacer so there is no torsional stress on the studs.

Tell me if I'm wrong

Haboob 05-06-2014 11:23 AM
I think I liked it with the understanding that you meant spacers in general are not safe for tracking.


TapaTalk for iPhone.

JARblue 05-06-2014 11:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driftomodachi (Post 2808000)
Funny, you liked my post that said this:

I wouldn't replace studs for track. Track duty sees more torsional stress on the lengthened studs which can stretch or break the studs and cause the wheel to come loose or fall off.

Bolt on spacers are torqued down on the wheel and on the spacer so there is no torsional stress on the studs.

Tell me if I'm wrong
ARP studs are the way to go if you want to track with spacers. They're $$$$.

Driftomodachi 05-06-2014 11:37 AM
I see a lot of d1gp cars with bolt on spacers. Considering all the torque that spins their wheels for drifting I feel it's safe to go with them.

mjm 05-06-2014 11:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBRsummer (Post 2807965)
just threw wheel spacers on the ride. absolutely love how the car looks now. and it may just be in my head, but the car actually seems smoother and turn in is noticeably better.



in my reading, i didn't see anyone mention an off brand of spacer. soooo, i went to amazon looking for something cheap that may be a quality alternative to the h&r's, eibach's, etc. before you start flaming, i did this entirely for testing purposes and the gathering of information and i was prepared to return them if they weren't perfect.



i went with 20mm in the front and 25mm in the rear. total cost was $125 and shipping was free. and yes, they were perfect. so if you're looking for a quality, cnc machined, hub centric spacer at half the cost of the h&r's, i'd highly recommend these.



the 20's fit perfectly on the front but the factory stud does stick out past the spacer. they fit because the rays have recesses in the back of the wheel that allow the wheel to sit flush on the spacer. (the post on amazon says they will not fit.)

the 25's are perfect for the rear with a 275 tire. i may end up dropping down though when i replace the rear tires with something wider next summer.

i used some antiseize on all the hubs and blue locktight on the spacers nuts only.



if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!

Thank you! I just ordered mine from Amazon. I've had good luck with "off brand" spacers in the past. I'll give these a try at half the price!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

igotcabada 05-06-2014 01:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBRsummer (Post 2798575)
did you order these up yet? i just jumped on here looking to answer the same question. the stillen site says the bolt on h&r's won't fit the front wheels but i could have sworn i saw people on here with them on the fronts. i just bought my z and i'm looking at the z1 spacers. 20 front/25 rear. that seems to be best looking option on the factory rays.

as i was saying :)
Just ordered the one you mentioned. Thanks for the review and post

Bonzo 05-06-2014 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBRsummer (Post 2807965)
if you plan on keeping your factory wheels, there is no reason not to throw spacers on! do it now!
Well you say this, but I do have two nagging doubts.

I'm late to the party here I know because I've been off this forum for a long while now. Just popped back in yesterday to post some pics and saw this thread.

I've long "thought" about spacers, but always dismissed them for 2 main reasons:
#1. I think in the long run they will add extra unnecessary wear on the bearings and cause premature failure.
#2. I don't like the idea of having my wheels perfectly "spaced in the center" twice. I've had big problems with "ring" spacers in the past, such a problem I said I'd never do it again. I realize these Z spacers don't have the rings, they are a solid part of the spacers, but it still makes me wonder in the long run.

Basically, I use my car as a daily driver as much as possible, and I'm afraid the spacers will cause long term premature wear on the bearings, and also cause possible "wobble" (unbalanced) problems. By this time after all these years I wonder if there are any people out there having these problems?

Am I being over cautious here or just plain dumb?

Thanks for any advise anyone can give.

Cheers ---- Bonzo :tup:

DEpointfive0 05-07-2014 05:59 PM
What level of bullshit is this?

Quote:
Because widening the track will increase wear on bearings (just like having wider wheels with lower offset), the steering is now a little bit more responsive due to a slight increase weight in the feel caused by the increase scrub radius. I'm very happy with the result both in terms of looks and handling wise (wider track). In fact the car appeared to sit lower with the wheels pushed flush to the fenders! Photos always make the car seem taller, but in person the car is a lot lower (since you're looked down at it as the last photo shows)

From:
IS250 with Spacers Installed - my.IS - Lexus IS Forum

Bonzo 05-08-2014 08:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2810047)
What level of bullshit is this?




From:
IS250 with Spacers Installed - my.IS - Lexus IS Forum
Which part are you talking about? The part about the bearings is exactly what I was talking about in my post above. There will be more wear on the bearings for certain, I guess I'm just wondering how much. I don't want to have to be replacing bearings every 50,000 miles.

As for the the other stuff, no clue.

Chuck33079 05-08-2014 08:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzo (Post 2810588)
Which part are you talking about? The part about the bearings is exactly what I was talking about in my post above. There will be more wear on the bearings for certain, I guess I'm just wondering how much. I don't want to have to be replacing bearings every 50,000 miles.

As for the the other stuff, no clue.
I know on Subarus, spacers caused premature bearing failure often. However, the hubs and bearings on them were weak and undersized to begin with and often failed completely stock. So spacers do cause accelerated wear, but on a bearing that's not a problem the question becomes "how much accelerated wear?" If it would have gone 250k without issue and now will only go 200k, that's probably ok. We just don't know. There haven't been a lot of reported failures. I won't run them but plenty of people seem to have no issues.

Bonzo 05-08-2014 09:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck33079 (Post 2810598)
So spacers do cause accelerated wear, but on a bearing that's not a problem the question becomes "how much accelerated wear?" If it would have gone 250k without issue and now will only go 200k, that's probably ok. We just don't know. There haven't been a lot of reported failures. I won't run them but plenty of people seem to have no issues.
Exactly. If no spacers gets me 120,000 and with spacers gets me, 115,000, that's not a big deal to me. But if no spacers is 120,000 and with spacers is 80,000, then that's huge. Thing is, the guys who put on spacers aren't typically going to be the ones jumping on the forum talking about how their bearings failed prematurely. That's the only way we are going to know.

If Nissan had only designed the car with a 1" wider stance on each side we wouldn't be having this discussion, and the spacer business would plummet. ;)

DEpointfive0 05-08-2014 05:55 PM
To Bonzo and Chuck.

Wow, I didn't know that... I guess it makes sense now that I think about it because the bearing gets more "flex"

Current me if I'm wrong, but that means that the Nismo will have bearing failure sooner than a normal Sport, and the sport will have bearing failure before a base model? (all things being equal)

DEpointfive0 05-08-2014 05:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzo (Post 2810694)
Exactly. If no spacers gets me 120,000 and with spacers gets me, 115,000, that's not a big deal to me. But if no spacers is 120,000 and with spacers is 80,000, then that's huge. Thing is, the guys who put on spacers aren't typically going to be the ones jumping on the forum talking about how their bearings failed prematurely. That's the only way we are going to know.

If Nissan had only designed the car with a 1" wider stance on each side we wouldn't be having this discussion, and the spacer business would plummet. ;)
I agree that if the wear is even 10% faster, who cares.

As for Nissan making the stance wider, (again forgive my ignorance,) but that means Nissan would have to make the axles and hubs/suspension assembly longer, not wheels wider (same question I posed in the post above)

Bonzo 05-09-2014 08:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2811267)
To Bonzo and Chuck.

Wow, I didn't know that... I guess it makes sense now that I think about it because the bearing gets more "flex"

Current me if I'm wrong, but that means that the Nismo will have bearing failure sooner than a normal Sport, and the sport will have bearing failure before a base model? (all things being equal)
Just like ricers who put on wheels with ridiculous offset, and you can see the wheels "bending" up. Those bearings will be shot in no time.

When car makers design the car they design it all to work together in harmony as much as possible. In this area, they design the tire/wheel/hub/bearing/suspension to all be balanced as much as possible, so the wear on the bearing takes place evenly. Change the offset and you change that balance. Putting on big fat tires and wheels with more offset looks awesome for your Saturday driver or show car, but it's not a good idea for a daily driver if you want things to last.

As for the Nismo question, I don't know. Do those wheels have more natural offset?

Bonzo 05-09-2014 08:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2811272)
As for Nissan making the stance wider, (again forgive my ignorance,) but that means Nissan would have to make the axles and hubs/suspension assembly longer, not wheels wider (same question I posed in the post above)
Correct. This generally happens and doesn't happen because to save money auto makers use common platforms for different cars, and changing that costs more money. I'm not familiar with how many Z parts get shared elsewhere (I believe the Infinity 37 is the same?) in particular, but I'm sure that was part the decision to stay a bit narrow. Just pure speculation on my part though. I've been off this forum so long I consider myself way out of the loop anymore.

DEpointfive0 05-09-2014 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzo (Post 2812136)
As for the Nismo question, I don't know. Do those wheels have more natural offset?
Nismos are wider and have a lower offset

kenchan 05-09-2014 01:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzo (Post 2812136)
Just like ricers who put on wheels with ridiculous offset, and you can see the wheels "bending" up. Those bearings will be shot in no time.

When car makers design the car they design it all to work together in harmony as much as possible. In this area, they design the tire/wheel/hub/bearing/suspension to all be balanced as much as possible, so the wear on the bearing takes place evenly. Change the offset and you change that balance. Putting on big fat tires and wheels with more offset looks awesome for your Saturday driver or show car, but it's not a good idea for a daily driver if you want things to last.

As for the Nismo question, I don't know. Do those wheels have more natural offset?
yah, but dont forget car manufacturers also build these consumer cars for all kinds of people and roads... like snowy roads where a customer might need to run chains. yah, chains on a 370z. :facepalm: thus needs clearance with the arches.

Bonzo 05-09-2014 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2812517)
yah, but dont forget car manufacturers also build these consumer cars for all kinds of people and roads... like snowy roads where a customer might need to run chains. yah, chains on a 370z. :facepalm: thus needs clearance with the arches.
Hey kenchan, long time no talk. I've been off the forum for a while now. Got back on a few days ago to post some pics in the Pearl White thread. Hope all is well with you.

Spacers are the last "aesthetic" mod I would love to make, but I've always been hesitant about it due to the bearing thing. I would love to have more info about it.

From all the pics I've seen, I think I would prefer 15 up front and 20 in the back (I'm not a fan of any poking). But the 15's up front have to do the longer lugs, which looks like a pain. What I'm considering doing is buying 1 pair of bolt on 20's and putting them on the front and back on the driver side only to see what they look like. From there I can either buy another set of 20's, or go down to 15 for the front, or even go up to 25's on back depending on what I see. Might cost a little more freight but at least I know where I'm going.

But I won't be able to do this until the fall at best. Too much other stuff going on right now.

Like I said, hope all is well with you.

Cheers --- Bonzo :tup:

kenchan 05-09-2014 02:30 PM
hey bonzo :tup:

actually id do 15 front / 10 rear bolt replacement type on the sport 19's if stock ride. :)
it would look very clean.

or just get the nismo set and run no spacers. that's a very nice setup too for stock height.

Bonzo 05-09-2014 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2812600)
hey bonzo :tup:

actually id do 15 front / 10 rear bolt replacement type on the sport 19's if stock ride. :)
it would look very clean.

or just get the nismo set and run no spacers. that's a very nice setup too for stock height.
Thanks for the info. Like I said, I'm in no rush right now so I'll probably do some more looking around. Wife wants a new kitchen don't cha know. :rolleyes:

kenchan 05-09-2014 02:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzo (Post 2812616)
Thanks for the info. Like I said, I'm in no rush right now so I'll probably do some more looking around. Wife wants a new kitchen don't cha know. :rolleyes:
:rofl2: hahahaha

pseftis 05-09-2014 06:13 PM
Running 20f 25r spacers right now on my stock tires.
Thinking of going with Michelin PSS 245/40 f and 285/35 r
Will i have to put smaller spacer for that to avoid rubbing and camber wear?

kenchan 05-09-2014 06:52 PM
how about you just install the new 285/35's and go to 20mm on the rear if they rub? :)

pseftis 05-09-2014 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2812932)
how about you just install the new 285/35's and go to 20mm on the rear if they rub? :)

Well I will be putting 285/35 in rear. But don't want to have to buy new spacers. Anyone have this setup with no issues? Also, hearing good things about the Bridgestone r-11?! Anyone try both tires? Use car as daily driver. May track it this year.

DEpointfive0 05-09-2014 08:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pseftis (Post 2812948)
Well I will be putting 285/35 in rear. But don't want to have to buy new spacers. Anyone have this setup with no issues? Also, hearing good things about the Bridgestone r-11?! Anyone try both tires? Use car as daily driver. May track it this year.
Once broken in they're noisey as fúck. You were warned

pseftis 05-10-2014 12:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2812984)
Once broken in they're noisey as fúck. You were warned

Which ones are noisy??? R11s or Michelins?

axmea? 05-10-2014 12:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pseftis (Post 2813228)
Which ones are noisy??? R11s or Michelins?
R-11's

DEpointfive0 05-10-2014 12:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pseftis (Post 2813228)
Which ones are noisy??? R11s or Michelins?
You mentioned RE11s, I'm referring to RE11s

Michelin doesn't really make noisy tires besides maybe their cup tires

pseftis 05-10-2014 12:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2813245)
You mentioned RE11s, I'm referring to RE11s



Michelin doesn't really make noisy tires besides maybe their cup tires

Thanks! Going with Michelins then :)

axmea? 05-10-2014 12:32 AM
After replacing my OEM Rays for a set of AG wheels and leaving the extended studs on the hub, I thought of selling my 20mm spacers. Glad I did not. I'm also glad I kept my OEM lugs. I could not find open ended shank style lugs to hold my spare (I figured you would need shank style lugs for your spare). I needed the spacers and OEM lugs to make sure my spare would fit and hold.

Haboob 05-10-2014 02:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by axmea? (Post 2813264)
After replacing my OEM Rays for a set of AG wheels and leaving the extended studs on the hub, I thought of selling my 20mm spacers. Glad I did not. I'm also glad I kept my OEM lugs. I could not find open ended shank style lugs to hold my spare (I figured you would need shank style lugs for your spare). I needed the spacers and OEM lugs to make sure my spare would fit and hold.
That's good to know.

I guess I'll be keeping mine, and throwing the lugs and a spacer in with the spare tire, just in case.

pseftis 05-12-2014 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pseftis (Post 2813246)
Thanks! Going with Michelins then :)
Michelins PS2 better than Michelin PSS????

kenchan 05-12-2014 02:03 PM
thats not wat tirerack says.... ?


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