^ very well stated!

I completely disagree. There are obvious alternatives, savory or unsavory, so have at them. I think Charles has been very forthcoming with details, Spohn has helped with updates, and I don't remember the Wright Brothers promising the world a delivery date on f^%king awesome, but MAN did they deliver..

He had the last pieces anodized early this week, is sorting hoses, preparing kits. Fighting internal battles. Doesn't deserve naysaying ESPECIALLY on his thread.

Peace.

It just is what it is. Phunk first appeared on the boards talking about this product (to my knowledge, anyways) almost precisely 2.5 years ago, over here: http://www.the370z.com/track-autocro...tml#post401139

And made this statement later the same day:

It's been a litany of delays since then. I'm not trying to knock phunk personally. He's stated his reasons for the delays. But you can't knock anyone else for complaining either. It's been a *really* long time and a lot of missed date guestimates.

2.5 years is kinda nuts. Some people don't even keep a car that long, much less wait on a part for a car that long.

There's no such thing, especially in this economy, as a timeline based on "might" and "best guess", as quoted, especially when as he has stated, the roadblock has been internal and a long time going away. In any case, completely uncool to spam the guy on his own thread. Shamu did it the right way with his own thread, word to the wise.

The Wright brothers went from flying kites to the first manned, powered plane within 3 years. Unless Phunk is going to make the Z hover in the next 6 months, he's behind their schedule. We're talking about sucking all the liquid out of a container for God's sake.

I'll just say I support Phunk and his troubles for talking to him and hearing his pain from what he has to deal with sucks. Some he cant control. But he's going to be hush till its ready now. At least hel come through. Not one other has done that here.

Hey I'll be first in line to buy when it materializes. It sounds like an awesome product :) Just sayin', timeline is what it is, nobody can be faulted for being annoyed about it (or the impact it might've had on other projects).

"Well, somebody else is already doing this, and since it's America, I might as well not try"

-Steve Jobs

well get to it buddy, fix it. its just a container of fuel, surely you are capable of building a device to manage the 19 gallons of fuel inside a container.

i will do this product how i see fit. the only mistake i have made is to project dates with extreme innaccuracy. i have not taken anyones money, i have not shipped nonfunctional product, and i have not screwed anyone over.

i have simply taken a long time to release my product... mostly due to situations out of my control.

As for those of you pointing back to 2.5 years ago or whatever... guess what.. YA i had one done then. You want to see it? Because I have 4-5 or so different models we went prototyped and considered for production. I was not making that up. if we were going to make it how we prototyped it when I said that 2.5 years ago, it would have been done a long long time ago. But it has evolved into an entirely different product from what it ever was. I got excited about it, and I had to mention it. But then I thought of something better. Oops.

NOBODY is stopping you from doing this on your own. it is NOT my fault that you or any other shop is seemingly hopeless at resolving the fuel starvation issue without me. I have, on multiple occasions, offered my assitence to anyone who wants to move forward with using universal surge can products for their 370z.

WHY hasnt anyone done it? Because they are not confident in themselves and they want a full, done, tested, proven, professional product. They dont want to build their own rig and have it create new problems. They dont want some shop that doesnt understand the task to tinker around with their car and still have the same problems. and that is also why I have to make sure that everything is as good as we can think of making it from very start... because there is always room for trouble or having to make fixes, etc if situations arrise that didnt in testing. So the last thing I need to do is ship it out already knowing its lacking something.

Lets just get real here, and quit hating me over this. Honestly.. the mistake I have made was even telling you guys about it before it was ready for sale. Sorry, I shouldnt have done that. Sometimes its just nice when you are working on a PITA design, to get some encouragement. I didnt realize I was signing up for a shitstorm if I didnt get it done quickly.

I do not enjoy you guys beating the **** out of me over this. I am not intentionally holding out on you. You do not understand the environment this has been created in to know that it is NOT setup for this type of stuff. That is why I am making the required changes for next time. What do you want me to say? I have a 99% completed product here... you want me to just ship it to you right now? You think you can figure it out from here? Fine! Honestly doesnt bother me one bit if you want to finish yours up.

phunk,
You have my full support. Being the fabrication business at one time. I know the hold ups and delays that can happen when things don't work out the way you wanted. Wrong material, CNC break downs, people break downs, etc. I'll wait intil you have the way you want it. :tup:

phunk,

I agree with rusty, I would rather something take time and be done right the first time. While I haven't had an issue with fuel starve (only autocross, only home during the winter/early spring and never any track days locally then) when I am finally home to take it too a real track, I would rather have this then something half a**. Good luck with the final production, I have been following this for a while and I can't wait to see the results!

Well said. I have a new found respect for you. So when is it ready?:bowrofl: Kidding

This is the important bit, unlike certain shady vendors that have come by this board :). We're just frustrated is all.

No apologies or understanding coming from me. I'm downright tired of vendors who suggest, post, and fantasize about products we owners would like to have but then can't make them materialize. Do I think making fuel products is easy? No, that's not my trade. But you making this product doesn't make you on par with a Wright brother (the point of my previous post). After 2.5yrs of these types of 'updates', I'd say any forum member is entitled to an opinion by now.

I am still in to buy this. I have ZERO issues with waiting because I know it going to be DONE RIGHT when it's release.

im not bitter at all, im still going to buy one, take your time phunk, make it right

^ that's because you've only been here since jan 2011

I kid...

Don't mean any personal harm to phunk... good guy falling on hard times, I get it... if this product works out and he's willing to sell to me, I'm in. I do ask that he gets a little more serious with his communication on timing, however

ok so ive only been here since then, and only had my Z since nov 2010, but first time on track i got it to starve on less then full tank, causei have alot of past track experience prior to 370 ownership, its no less frustrating to me.

maybe because my time attack car, which is a focus, had such a tiny aftermarket for anything, this to me sounds like small potatos to me compaired to race level stuff that wasnt avalible for my focus chassis that either took forever to come out, or i just ended up having to be made custom. so i understand everyone who is serious about buying this product is anxious, but take a step back maybe and a deep breath. hell i had to deal with not even being able to buy wheels wide enough cause of bolt pattern for the focus, waiting two years to save up money and have wheels made then shipped over. thats just one example, and its prolly why i guess im not as bothered

I'm frustrated too but still willing to wait and just deal with it in the meantime. Today I consistently hit fuel starve with a dot over 3/4 tank (about 5 gallons when I went to fill up). Having to do that a few times per track day sucks, but it's manageable until we get this fix. I support you phunk.

Ok Shamu, tell us what we're looking at.

Looks like a homebrew solution to keep a small amount of fuel near the pickup when the tank tries to starve it.

a bucket of paint ftw! lol

Sorry for not meeting your expectations. Maybe the Wright brothers worked at a better pace... but my product is going to last a lot further than 120 feet.

close. i wouldnt touch that setup with a 10 foot pole but i can tell what they are doing. that photo is on the drivers side of the tank, opposite from where the main fuel pump resides. They have a canister secured poorly with stainless wire, using a couple check valves that will (in theory) allow fuel in the canister but not out, and a fuel pump pickup for an additional pump that is transfering fuel to the passenger side (main fuel pump).

this solution will not last, as their transfer pump is going to be running very dry most the time, especially if used for any street driving where once below a half tank, the driver side is completely empty (thanks to the factory transfer siphon) unless you slosh it over on a right hander. sure you could put this pump on a toggle switch and only use it when on the track... but this is not the type of solution that any professional business would market as a product, its an unreliable bandaid.

"solutions" like this are exactly why i needed to make something.

Install kit and technique was finished today. Changed the size of one of the fittings, ordering more right now. Should be here by Friday. Going to ship 2 of the units out Friday as long as the fittings show. I might wait for those 2 guys to finish install and give me feedback before shipping the rest.

Best Post of the year.. LOL Way to go phunk. love the 120 foot. LOL :bowrofl::bowrofl::bowrofl::bowrofl::bowrofl:

http://www.the370z.com/attachment.ph...1&d=1345664676

:tup:

awesome news!

machine time, material costs, parts costs, installation components costs, etc.. were all worked out today.

we have all the pricing setup now. i will make it public thursday or friday. i just want another day or two to look at it a few more times and decide if its final.

ordered up enough of the installation materials for the first few kits... supposedly they being 2nd day shipped today. so its looking pretty positive that the first 2 are going to be able to ship out Friday. these 2 guys are thinking they should be able to get to the installation right away. so I am hoping that while I am working on packing up the rest of the kits and getting them ready to ship, perhaps I can get some installation and testing feedback from them before shipping the rest just to make sure everything looks OK.

to come up with the installation parts, i had to go ahead and do a mock up installation on a spare 370z fuel tank we have here. the work on the drivers side of the tank turned out not to be as bad as I thought it was going to be... probably no big deal. the passenger side is a little more of a pain IMHO. whats left to be seen is how much more difficult it is to do inside the vehicle, since its obviously more convenient to do to a tank sitting on a table.

a little photo i took when beginning the mockup install. as you can see i cut open the top/middle of the fuel tank so that we could see whats going on and also provide better photos for installation directions. even though you will not get as good of a perspective in your tank, this makes it easier for us to show you what you are working with inside there when i take more photos.

notice the corner of the baffle pointing at the level sensor... it has to be bent out of the way a little or the level sensor arm will contact it and then the fuel gauge would be unable to read full. i wanted to avoid having to do that, but mounting the level sensor on the outside diameter of the canister compared to how it hangs stock, left us very little room to play for giving the sensor full swing.

this unit is my personal one... the retail ones are anodized blue and not beat up.

Once a few other people test it and it works well i need one too!!!!


---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=34.046195,-118.464554

Mines already done. But I would like to see what 034 comes up with anyway.

:tiphat: #1 complete.

It was supposed to be Pink! Back to the drawing board! :)

Very pretty, phunk! Can't wait!

Looks too nice to be hidden away.

nice looking part!

and away they go! :happydance:

thanks!

ya i have always specialized in fuel system related components and unfortunately, most of them, you cannot see once they are installed. Brandon and I did some killer billet intake manifolds for the 350z/G35 just so that we could have something that sits in plain site. it doesnt get any better than a massive polished billet intake manifold with relocated throttle etc, to really stand out and grab some attention. we had to compensate for 90% of what we build getting stuck inside gas tanks or tucked away hidden deep in the engine bay. I have attached a photo of said intake manifold (along with the billet Y adapter we machined.. unseen there is the billet upper endtank on the intercooler we also did when building that Y pipe). We actually have CAD development started on a VHR intake manifold... it is unknown if we will move forward with it until this winter. I will need to use my car for the R&D on it, and I havent decided yet if I will be keeping the car.

the funny thing with this particular product... i wish i could be there to watch everyone try and install it so carefully without scratching it up. the edges on the tank are so sharp and the parts are maximum size to get the most displacement... its going to be really hard to install this without scratching it up. its going to be like playing the old game "operation". i bet that down the road, when some guys start parting out their cars to get new ones, and they remove this kit and post it for sale... its going to look so scratched up that prospective buyers are going to be asking "what the hell happened to that thing??"