I agree with most of what you said broski, however, I don't know if I would agree with the Cayman be that much more refined that the Z. I was drawn to the Cayman S when came time for the purchase and test drove a few of them just to be sure. The cayman interior left me absolutely COLD with all the chrome, plus the fact that I would have had to get a 2 or 3 years old Cayman S vs a brand new Nismo with more bang in terms of value + slightly more power. Easy choice.

I looked at a vette and thought it looked lean but too long. I also didn't like how it was put together. It definitely is a fast car for the money. But I'm not looking for the fastest car.

I want something that looks like it's put together like a fine watch. Although it doesn't have to be as reliable as my z, because we know a Porsche is not. I simply want the cr because of how it looks and the engineering. It doesn't come with ac or a radio, which doesn't bother me. I've never really cared how the inside looks, just the exterior. I'm not looking for the best bang for the money as we all know the Porsche is not. My z will be paid off in a couple months and I will start savings for the next z or Cayman.

Porsche stomped Nissan for PPH, though, actually, they led the class. If you want a "fine watch", then you may have found want you want.

I'd recommend waiting to see what the C7 looks like. GM has eaten a lot of crow over the interior and has stated that Audi is their target. I had a roommate with a BMW 3-series only a few years old and he says his new Chevy Cruze has a much better interior in every way. GM is turning over a new leaf, and I think you should give the C7 a good look, as well as the new Z when it comes out, and go from there.

We are reaching the tail-end of everything, and anything you buy now is about to be seriously 1-upped by the next revision of the line.

As to the C6 being long, it's no longer than a Porsche 911. Actually, it's shorter by a few inches. Further, it is roughly only 2" longer than your current 370Z. Do you think the 911 is long? How then is the shorter C6 TOO long? What about the Z? Would 2" kill it? Look how much more wheel-base you get for that 2" of length with the C6. Fine watch blah blah blah, but on the track it took Porsche 1/4 million to beat GM's $100K car. By about a second and a half. On a 7+ minute track. The 'Ring.

You did lose me on "how it was put together". I watched mine built from the frame up and the construction process made a lot of sense, and looked very well thought out. I was pleased. Currently, PPH was running 62 or something at the time. VERY low. Porsche was in the 70's for '09 or '10 I believe it was.

I doubt you meant how the parts interacted and how it was put together in the mechanical sense though, and you meant more "how it flowed"?

Probably harping on the interior. If you want what you say you do, I don't blame you. The interior in the C6 is fail. I love mine, but if we are honest, the interior is on the level with a base Cobalt.

The chassis, drive-line, and structure on the other hand, are world class. Whereas with the 370Z, you get a lot of neat and nifty quirks, but in the end I don't think it's nearly as well thought out. The Porsche is like a 370Z with a bigger budget--money to think out how to execute the design and mechanics better. The corvette, it uses a brute-force and "smart" approach. Parts are very durable, and the simplest path is always used. The LS7 V8 for example. It's the most powerful NA engine within 20# of its physical weight for under $50K (Mercedes AMG engines trump it in power a bit, and very slightly by weight, but at 250-400% the cost). People scoff at the pushrod/cam-in-block, but no-one can beat it for within eyesight of the price tag.

Anyway, I have not slept in nearly 20 hours. I'm rambling. If you want a finely crafted and tuned machine, buy the Porsche. If you want a machine that kicks *** but has a few rough edges, buy the C6. If you want to wait and see what comes out from Nissan, Ford, GM, and Europe in 2014, you can get something much better than anything currently available. Enjoy the Z. It's a nice car. Upgrade when you don't have to teeter-totter about whether or not it really IS an upgrade.

The Corvette looks bigger than it is but it's still a great looking car. No doubt a vette is more powerful than a Cayman r. The 911 is longer than the z but the 911 looks smaller. It's because the lower part of the body bulges out but the roof and cabin area tapers in a lot. And the engine is in the back so the 911 doesn't have such a high and wide hood. I love bulging fenders but I like a narrow and low hood, and a small cabin.

What I meant about put together, I meant the alignment of the sheetmetal, the spacing and the length of the gap.

Have you looked at a new 'vette?

Reason I ask, is because when I looked at them in 2005, they looked horrible. Now in 2011/12YM, they are a lot better. Still, carbon-fiber and SMC will not be as precise as metal. Then, it's lighter and won't dent like metal, either. It's a trade-off.
All the gaps on my car were plasti-gauged and adjusted several times over at the factory. I watched. You would shat a brick if you knew how those panels were adjusted, lol.

It's obvious you don't want a 'vette, and from what you say I don't think you would be happy with one, I'm just throwing out info, that's all. Not trying to somehow "convince" you. Your mind is made up and that's cool, different strokes and all that.

If you're thinking Cayman, consider the Cayman S, if you like that then you'll love the Cayman R.

I wouldn't mind a GS Vette. I think a z06 would be too much car for me.

Cayman are great cars, but I am just not sure if it is much of an upgrade over the 370. The car is more nimble, has a better sounding engine, more refined, nice than the 370. Yet the trade off doesn't seem to justify the cost. Of course you can say the same about the 350 HR owners jumping to 370. If you can afford it and you want it, I don't think you will be sad over the move. At the same time, don't expect anything more than the Porsche nametag.

The Cayman feels way more nimble than the Z, with almost the same power to match.

The Corvette is the same width as the 370, but it feels a lot bigger and wider. The Corvette is a LOT quicker than the 370. Now that's an upgrade in terms of performance, yet there was something about the car I personally didn't feel comfortable with it. Maybe it's the attention or just the fact the car is scary to drive fast. I am getting too old to crash into things, I will stick with my slow 370. Personally the car I would get is the Audi TTS, but once again I would be paying money for an AWD drivetrain without much gain in performance overall.

I get 0 attention on the road. My Ram-Air F-body got more. Love the 'vette for that reason. There are a lot of them around and people don't hassle you over it and want to talk to you about it and take your time everywhere you go to pump gas. If you want people riding your nuts get a Viper or something.

As to fast, yes, the car is scary. Just keep your foot out of it and you will be fine, though. The car is VERY docile when you are acting sensible.

Drove the GS, Z06, and ZR1 at Spring Mountain. The GS is definitely not as fast as the Z06 and ZR1, but I was following the instructor while driving a ZR1 and he in the GS and on the back straight I certainly didn't run him down like I thought I would. There is an undeniable difference in how they drive, but it's not as sound as you might think if you line up to a Z06 on the freeway in a GS. Yes, the Z06 will win, but it's not like you can't hurt yourself in any of them. 385whp in a 3300# car is a lot. Yes, 440whp in a 3200# car is more, but the GS isn't childproof or anything I guess is what I'm getting at.

In the 370, I get a lot of nice car it looks cool.

In the Corvette, I got a lot of "nice car, I have a Corvette (C4 mainly) or my bro has one".

Yeah, for some reason most uninformed people have a neutral-to-negative view of the corvette. Porsche is exactly the opposite.

I asked some female family members what they thought about vettes, and their answers were along the lines of: cheap/crappy quality/what you get if you cant afford a porsche/etc. They were all surprised to learn (1) how much corvettes actually cost, and (2) how good their performance is. I would bet that if presented with the question "which would win a race around a typical race track - a corvette z06 or a porsche boxster," the majority of the population would choose the boxster.

Anyway, having driven a Cayman S I have to say it's a great car. But if I were upgrading from a Z, I would want something with a lot more power than that.

yeah, but this is what you get with having a brand. right or wrong, thats the way it goes sometimes. its like supporting a certain politicial party without ever listening to facts and do your own research, most people are dumb in this world....

Pretty much!

I had some woman I took on a date ask me "Is this car expensive?" I replied "Well, that depends on the definition, what's yours?" her response was "$25,000 or more." I replied "Well, then it's somewhat expensive."

and I'll be wary of any woman on a date asking me if my car is expensive unless it's a one-night stand :p

/\ this!

The only reason I picked her up in the 'vette is because it was a nice day, I wanted to drive it, and I had already decided that some 40 year old (I'm 25) who told me that her former husband "worshiped her" was not a bitch I wanted to entertain any longer. It was a last date thing. That and she kept trying to get me to take her to every high dollar restaurant in town. It was annoying as **** and while okay, she didn't have the looks or personality to warrant celebrity treatment. Minor acting career or not.

I'm going to resurrect this post from a million years ago; lets if anyone replies.
I've had my 370Z 6Spd since they first came out. DD, its got 166k miles on it, and it is bulletproof. Nothing wrong with it and I still love it to death but after almost 11 years, it may be time to start thinking about a new car (that, plus the wife has finally kind-of agreed that I can get another 2 seater).

I'm looking at the (982) 718 Cayman base or S; either new or very lightly used certified. It will be a DD primarily, and I plan on keeping it for a while, as you can see, I do that.

Curious whatever happened with any of you guys/gals who were considering or who ended up buying/upgrading/whatever from the Z to the Cayman/Boxster?

When this thread was born. These posts were somewhat true. But the 718 came and it outclasses the Z by a lot. New generation. But with the new Z around the corner? Hmmm. I think the Z may be funner.

If you are OK with Porsche running costs, they are a beautiful car and positively well sorted.
The 6 really sounds better than any 6 cylinder should.
The 4 (especially in GTS trim) goes better than a 4-pot has a right to.

But unless you are going to do all the maintenance yourself, bring a tub of petroleum jelly along when you pick the car up from service. It'll make life easier.

Sport Chrono package seems to be a must. Beyond that, I don't know much about the options. Just that a-la-carte costs tend to be crazy priced.

I test drove a 2008 Cayman S loved it, handles like a go-cart my z fells faster though but the cayman s more refined. Last year I was looking for a 2009 and up Cayman S as it has more hp at 320hp but they are hard to find.

More power can be added and fairly cheap for considering Porsche tax!

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I agree, but the interior of the 06-08 was really bad all pictures of the switches paint chips and bad quality plastic, sort of like the 350z interiors

I’m glad I’m getting some feedback. I genuinely love the Z, it is a good and loyal friend. It’s just you know, it’s been a looooong time.

I don’t really “need” a new car today, but will soon enough, maybe another year or two at the most—like I said, it’s been a loooooooong time. Cost is an overall concern. Maintenance cost is a concern, I understand that maintenance is more costly on the Pcar; it’s not going to break me or anything, but I am fiscally conservative and it does give me pause.

I’ve really only had my eye on two cars over the last few years the Vetter and the Cayman. I think I’ve outgrown the Vette, they look spectacular, although I’ve really done no real research on the C8, but I honestly just don’t see myself driving one at this point. I test drove the 718 base and GTS recently. Realistically I’m in the market for a base, but having skipped on the Z Sport last time, I am aiming to spring for the 718S (if that’s where I end up).

Here’s the thing, I wasn’t blown away by it. I mean it handled FANTASTICALLY, much better than the Z; you feel the less weight, you feel the crips, on-rails style turning. The power was there, definitely in the GTS (and hence the S), not completely sure there wasn’t turbo lag at the bottom of the tach in the base though. Like I said, I’m not sure. Need more seat time. Dealer has me attending a Porsche Experience event at a nearby track next week; although this will primarily be a DD car, and I haven’t done any significant track time since my autocross days more than a decade ago, I have driven that track before. I guess I’ll see how I feel after the track event. I also plan on asking for an extended (over the weekend or similar) test drive. I guess I just feel that if I’m consider getting (my first) Porsche, and spending what is a lot of money to me, I should be blown away (for lack of more colorful language) but so far I’m not sure that I am. The question I keep asking myself is, is this a big enough (if at all) of an upgrade after more than a decade? Is this “upgrade” worth the money?

Alright, I’m going to stop ranting. Again, if anyone has any personal experience they’d like to share, I welcome it. Thanks in advance.

PS. I should note that I am aware a new Z “may” be in the works, but 1) I don’t see it coming out for at least 3 years, 2) as much as I love the Z, and as LOYAL as I am to the Z (I mean common you guys must see that), I feel like life is to short to be driving basically the same car your entire life.

I felt the same way after driving a 718 S a couple times, on streets and highway. It felt very... German. And slower than the Z. The handling difference was noticeable and the transmission is absolutely superior. Basically perfect.

The four cylinder is really unexciting. It is turbocharged, so I imagine there's easy power to gain, but I can't imagine what it costs to modify a Porsche.

Then take maintenance and insurance into account... to me the 718 S is great as a millionaire's toy. If you can drop 80k on a car and not feel it, I would. For the other 90% of us, it makes no sense.

Then there's the fact that you have no easy access to the engine compartment in the Cayman. That right there was a deal breaker for me when I was shopping for a sports car 3 years ago. That's like having a hot girlfriend and you can never see her junk.....:rofl2:

If you want a P car then you got to be willing to pay and put up with all that comes with it. Another overlooked car not quite on the scale of the Porsche for consideration is Lotus. They are very nice cars and handle almost as well and come with a Toyota Camry engine.

What Porsche and what Lotus?

Thanks for input everyone, keep it coming, especially those who test drove and/or own(ed) one.

To answer everyone's questions, no sadly, I can't drop $80k on a car and not feel it. I can in theory afford the Pcar, and frankly, if I end up going this route, I'll prob be looking for '17 or '18 low miles car anyway as people say the initial depreciation is downright depressing. I can do the basic maintenance myself, plus a friend (see below) just told me of a guy who used to work at Porsche who has for years now had a garage 10 min away from me where he specializes in german cars, and is reasonably priced.

Side story: hung out with a few friends yesterday, one has an '08 (I think) Cayenne which he got of a lease about 4 yrs old and 40k on it, he now has 155k on it and is looking to sell it, wants to get a Panamera. I got good idea of repairs and maintenance that he's had to do on it. Then so happens that another acquaintance had a '14 Panamera -- drove that last night -- that he is currently selling b/c he just bought an '08 911 4S Cab (in retrospect, although almost no alcohol was involved, this may have been the funnest Halloween ever :)

Then walked into the office this morning and one of my bosses is there with a brand new 718 Boxster S fully fully f'in loaded. Just drove that also and I'll say it sure is an impressive car if I can swing for the S with not to mention some of the performance options.

I have no intention of modding the car in any way. I'm looking for a DD primarily, and hope to start doing at least a few track events a year, which would of course require brakes, brake fluids, tires. But between the Z already being a great cruiser/GT car, and the uncertainty of what's happening in the US over the next year or two with the 718 models featuring 4T I AM REALLY TORN.

Depends on what the shopper is looking for. If it were me, I would be looking at a used 911 Carrera S. There are plenty of them on the market and in good condition. My first pick in Lotus would be the Evora given my size, followed by the Exige.

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It's definitely a tough decision. First world problems, though! ;-)

I was where you were at before buying the 4C. That car won my heart, and I couldn't do the Cayman after seeing the Alfa. But it's not really a suitable daily - neither is any Lotus although the Evora comes close (but is still a Toyota made of Tupperware). If we could get it here, the new Alpine 110 might be a suitable comparison. But we can't, so it's moot.

Will the Cayman give you enough storage? The Z is positively cavernous by 2-seater sports car standards. And not particularly low or small to get in and out of. I test drove a GT4 the other day (again, couldn't see myself parting with my 4C for it, nice as it was). it definitely is going to be more difficult to live with than the 370Z. Also, consider the visibility out of the mid-engine car if you are dailying it. Backing out of parking spaces and merging/changing lanes "by the force" gets old fast, if that sort of thing figures into your commute.

The Porsche is a performance car which you can track, and also comfortably cruise anywhere in. The more performance-oriented you spec it, the less daily/GT-worthy it becomes. If you want something with amazing performance and is still a comfortable daily, then you move into 911 territory (or a McLaren, or a Merc AMG GTR, or even go with a less expensive performance saloon car in an Alfa Giulia Quadrifoglio, or a BMW //M-something or Audi S5..., any of which will match or better the Cayman you are looking at in terms of performance and handling). I know - I'm not making your decision any easier! :-P


When the decision comes down to dollars / performance / and utility there are always compromises to be made. I always liked the saying "Good, cheap, fast - pick 2" with regard to having work done. You can have a good job cheap, but it won't be fast, or a fast job cheap but it won't be good. Or a good job fast, but it won't be cheap. I think you'll find a comparable result in your deliberations!

In the end, if your heart is set on the Porsche, and you can at least live with its cost to buy and maintain and the compromises that it may demand of you, then go for it. That is the kind of decision that you need to make with your heart, and not your head.

There's no wrong answer, except to wait because you're afraid of making the wrong decision!

Interesting thread. Looking forward to more input.

Oh, and be wary of Rennlist - it's not nearly as friendly, helpful, and accommodating as this board. ;-)

^^^Agreed!!! I am glad you jumped in as I forgot about the Alfa...great car for the not so tall. As for the Audi s5 I own a 14 and the car rocks but you will pay the same kind of tax that comes with a P car. Or you can just do a v8 Corvette. The reviews are amazing and it is supposed to rival the German and Italian supercars in street manners. $80k will get you all the upgrades.

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can't lie

i have eyed the Evora GT, the latest version with less weight, titanium exhaust i believe, and wider front fenders

tight driver's compartment might be the biggest drawback because all reports are the handling is nuts

@ZCanadian Thank you for your post! I wanted to quote portions of it and comment on them, but you're so spot on, and your comments are so well and thoughtfully written that I would just end up commenting and complimenting and agreeing with every sentence/phrase of your post.

That said, a few choice quotes still deserve it.

Yes, first world problems for sure. I, like I am sure many others, work hard, and life is not easy, but man, man, we are lucky, life could be much much worse...knock on wood. It's Friday, and I recommend everyone take a minute and reflect on that.

Very true, I've done my research and due diligence. It comes down to a heart driven decision.

This is interesting, but decision paralysis is a real thing, and right now I'm leaning towards waiting until at least the spring/summer to see what happens to the 718 line in US.

Oh man, for sure! I can already see that after hanging out there for the last week or two. I have to say, online forums are not known for bringing the best out in people, but I've been a member here since early 2009 and this forum is the best!!!

Yes, yes, yes! More input folks please!

PS: Whereas the BMW M/Audi S something were cars I always wanted in the past; I want one more "impractical" 2 seater in my life before I end up driving something that's a 2+2 sports coupe/sedan. Also I am of very little opinion of the reliability of BMW/Audi/Merc--I would not buy those cars with the intention of holding long term. I know I'm considering a potential gamble in that regard on the Porsche. Lastly, I like the classic look of the sports car, which is what the Z, the 718 (and for that matter the 911) offers; I'm not dying to get into a sports coupe in terms of appearance.

If I were to get a Porsche, it would HAVE to be a flat six.

The 2019 or 20 Audi TT is a bad *** car. It is much faster than the Cayman and handles almost as well.

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Agree 100%. I’m not a fan of the new 718 turbo 4’s with fake engine sounds and all.


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I agree on the sound front - the Porsche flat 6 in the 981 Cayman is a special engine. With the sport exhaust, the noise is thrilling.

Which is fine as far as it goes. But performance-wise, the 718 with turbo 4 cylinder literally runs rings around it's older sibling.

Comparison at this link:
http://www.zeperfs.com/en/duel4516-6344.htm

Hilights (981 first, then 718) - both are the "S" PDK variants:
0-100Km/hr times 4.7 vs 4.1 seconds
0-200Km.hr times 16.9 vs 14.3 seconds
60-100Km/hr times 5.0 vs 3.5 seconds
80=160Km/hr times in 4th 11.8 vs 8.1 seconds
" " " in 5th 15.0 vs 10.3 seconds
Nordschleife times 7:55 vs 7:46
Laguna Seca times 1:41.26 vs 1:40.05
Braking distances are in some cases better on the older model, but that could be attributable to test conditions.


I'd like a car that sounded nice AND performed, but hey, if I had to choose between sound and fury, then fury wins every time for me. YMMV.

The TT maybe faster but it is one hideous and fugly car. Never was a fan of those cars they remind me of an upside down bathtub.

They new look way better now than the older ones. I am just providing options and as someone stated before I will choose function over form pretty much every time. That said it has to be sexy as well and that is why the Z is in the sweet spot.

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