Camaro gets a refresh after 1year.
 

https://www-caranddriver-com.cdn.amp...photos-info%2F

The ridiculous looking front end plummeted sales of the 2019 camaro. So Chevy fixed it.

Also there's a new LT1 V8 starting at $35k for a budget SS with some hierarchy high point like optional recaro seats.

IMO The 1LE and ZL1 remains king and queen. The first "Spuscle Cars" in history

Aren't you the guy that traded your Z for an SS? How's it holding up? Isn't the visibility worse than the Z? I enjoyed that thread, but couldn't find it just now.

Never got around to owning a Z, but I have a 4runner, G37X for the wife, and 03 G35 for my daily driving. As much as I like the Z, I can't justify trading my G37X for one. I plan on keeping both Gs as the 03 is fun and not worth much and getting a 6th gen Camaro or Corvette.

Anyways, I like this new design. As ridiculous as the 2018 looked, there are uglier cars out there (Alpha Romeos for exmaple).

Yeah I did. It's holding up way better than I thought it would. No creaks or rattles. No orange peel in the paint. The underbody is clad with shielding and bracing. And that's just the regular SS. (Though I have a 1LE suspension upgrade) The brakes are solid... The handling is just shocking. I'm 20k miles in an I am just blown away at how I can take corners and hit chicanes. It's light on it's feet for what it is... Hard to imagine putting ZL1 power to use. Stock power is already pretty ridiculous. I get 30mpg on highway when on cruise. About 16mpg in town driving semi aggressive. And visibility is EXACTLY like the Z. No different. There are improvents to visibility from the last gen car. Also the rear feels smaller than the camaro 5. So you have a better sense of where the azs is in traffic. If you position all the mirrors in the same fashion as the Z you can see everything behind you. BSM is also a reliable and excellent feature to help mitigate blind spot insecurity. My biggest gripe is the plastic is easy to scratch n the cell phone charger is bullshyt. Other than that... I'm thoroughly impressed. It really drives like a Z except faster with an adrenaline rush level of torque. The camaro bucks hard with torque in gears 2 thru 4at around 3000rpm range. If torque scares you shift AR 2k or 4k. Cuz 3k will push your back into your seat. At WOT. The transmission sounds like a DCT. The shift speed is unbelievable. But at the paddle there's a slight lag between your pull and shift response. But the upshift sound and transition is exactly like a dual clutch. I think I need to upgrade the transmission wire gauge to get a better paddle to shift reaction. I fixed the same problem in the Z with the same mod.

The only thing I miss about the Z is the size and uniqueness. But the SS and ZL1 crew is a lot smaller than the turbo and v6 crew. So in the camaro world we're not an everyday sight. Especially a ZL1. That's hella exclusive and when I see ONE in the wild I get a hard on. It just looks like such a beast. But if I ever bought a ZL1? It'll be because of looks! I'm really satisfied with 460hp. And I have plans for full bolt ins soon? So it will be around 550hp when I'm done. That's plenty enough.

ZL-1 for $45k used > this new supra. :stirthepot:

ZL-1 has all the cooling setup from the factory, unlike how the Z lacks cooling, and the new supra will need cooling upgrades once people start tuning them.

It seems to me that the ZL1 coolers are the exact same as tuners adding them to the Supra. The ZL1 is a factory tuner car, after all.

Saw this article on the 4 banger camaro. The slept on version of the trio of engines. 3300lbs with 275hp on the stiffer production chassis out right now aside from the vette.

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...first-drive%2F

I'd be happy with a base model. I saw some 4 bangers for as low as $17k and a handful under $21k. I frequent the different sections of Camaro6 and really like the 4 bangers and LT1.

In six months from now my wife is handing over the G37 to me and it will be my new DD (gonna park and keep the G35 at my mom's house lol). I'd love to get a Z, but it's outdated. Plus I have the same motor in my G so I can't justify having a G37 and Z. Don't want to part ways with my G37X. I've considered an STi (drove a stage 2 04 for almost 4 years before it was stolen), but the vQ37HR even in stock form has more top end than my turboback stage 2 STi did. Before talking my Dad into co-signing for that sti convinced him to buy me a new 05 s2k. Great car, but once I drove an STi I wanted one.

I feel the next car has to either be new or a JDM import. The new 2020 bare bones V8 Camaro is my top choice for a new ride. I'd love a BRZ, used Z, STi, but sense I will be disappointed because they are at the same level power wise (BRZ is down on power actually) as the G37.

I owned a four eyed 5.0 Foxbody (1986) for half of 2008. Hatchback, full exhaust, white and grey. Sold it for $200 less than I bought it. The new owner manual swapped it and sold it soon after. I miss that thing as much as the STi. Most of all, that blood curdling howl of the 302.

The Camaro seems to have an old school V8 like that 5.0. I'm also a fan of NASA CMC as my buddy back then use to race a 3rd gen. If or when I get a Camaro you guys will be some of the first people to know. As much as I'd like a C6, the next car has to be new. I owe it to myself.

So many nice cars out there, but you can't have them all :crying:

The LT1 CAMARO V8... IS A MAJOR MAJOR GO!!!
 

If they had this option when I bought mine? I mighta went with it. The LT1 engine is probably the best affordable performance engine out there... And to have it at $35k? It's downright shameful. But a benefit for guys who could only afford a v6 camaro. An LT1 with a 1LE pkg gets in the door for $40k and you will tear up everybody sitting at 40k. No survivors allowed. Those thinking muscle on the cheap. Test drive this bad boy!!

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...o-lt-and-ss%2F

Man! And now there going to cancel production of the Camaro. GM sure can be idiotic at times!

That's a rumor. When GM was asked they didn't confirm or deny the rumor... I think it was started to ramp up sales to be honest. But if they do cancel the Camaro again? That would be kinda shitty. Especially now because the Corvette is mid engined now... it gives Chevy a chance to go crazy with a next gen Camaro. This generation is bananas though. The power and performance technology is gonna be a challenge to top so easily. I think the next gen has to be more about introducing a revolutionary design. We'll see what happens? Usually by this time there would be some type of hype over the next gen... If we dont hear anything by June 2020? This rumor will probably hold true?

I would think they'd give the exterior another redesign before killing it... See how that influences sales numbers. They've certainly got the rest in order. But it is GM we're talking about...

Not getting killed
 

Chevy only delayed the Camaro. Thankfully... I'm not even mad though if you really think about it.... Let's do a Chevy Enthusiast checklist.

Precursor.
We get the Chevy SS sleeper
We get the C7 in 2013
We get the Z06 in 2014
We get the Grand sport in 2016
We get the ZR1 in 2017

1. 2015 CAMARO 6 drops...
2. 2016 1LE drops on scene
3. The ZL1 drops
4. 2017 ZL1 1LE drops
2017. V6 1LE drops
Chevy SS sleeper cancelled cuz lack of true car enthusiasts...
5. 2018 the 2.0 1le drops
6. 2018. Camaro refresh.
Transmission upgrade
Needed Mylink 2 upgrade
7. 2019. Fix bombed Camaro refresh
LT1 SS Affordable sleeper csmaro v8 drops.

Not to mention Anniversary, redline, hotwheels and like 3 other special editions that have dropped.
On track warranty

Mid engine Corvette is now a reality.
Z28 chatter is starting.

I mean GM has their issues like most subpremium car companies... but I feel they've done more to serve then enthusiast market than any other company right now. Actually Dodge is about tied.

Even a 4 banger Camaro is a quick and nimble car.

I'm sure the delay has a lot to do with serving the enthusiast market with tremendous performance options yet sales are sluggish at the time they drop the most anticipated car in history. The C8 mid engined vette

Camaro Updated:

What's Really Going On With The Future Chevrolet Camaro | GM Authority

About a year ago, GM stated that no matter their interest in EV. They will still be competitive in the muscle car arena. I hope this is true? At best there might be ev versions of Corvette and Camaro while still maintaining v8 power? That's how they once talked???

I'm going to put faith that GM will listen to enthusiasts like they did with camaros 5 and 6 and do what customers want?

Lastly, I'm sick of companies like GM Porsche and Nisssn pushing the EV agenda on as crowd that doesn't want EV.
Corporate Fvckin Fascists!!!

I agree! F that!!!

If they don’t push it (companies and governments), it’s not going to happen.
Demand isn’t going to shift to EV’s on its own.

For companies, it seems to be a way to differentiate oneself, and a reason for charging exorbitantly more for a car.

For government it makes it look like they are doing something to the Millennials who are more interested in a cause than a job (and, Lord help us all, are now becoming political), while pushing the time-bomb of generation and transmission capacity down the road for future governments to address.

The only losers are the consumer, who has to pay more for a lesser vehicle (“lesser” at the moment, because range and recharging capability is limited unless you live in certain regions), and the taxpayer who is no doubt going to have to foot the bill for much of this folly (incentives, road tax changes, subsidy for generation/transmission expansion, and payments to subsidize for increased overall electricity costs). But as long as producers and regulators can rely on a general lack of critical thinking, industry will move in this direction. As with most mandated changes, the move to EV will be bungled six ways to Sunday as compatibilities, timing, infrastructure and costs will not be sorted out by market forces and will therefore be inefficient.

These changes are being brought to you by the same people who draft a manifesto against single use straws while sipping their Kuerig/Tassimo coffees. Or the kids who skip school to get driven to a climate change strike/rally in their parents’ Suburbans and Land Rovers.

Funny though. We have intentional rolling blackouts just to keep the grid from exploding.... but ummm... We're pushing more EV cars. The populace is generally stupid. They support ideas before thinking of the situation in front of them. It's like a magic unicorn is supposed to suddenly wave a wand and fix the grid cuz the idea of having electric cars sounds great.

If the government wants electric vehicles? They have millions of fed cars police cars 18 wheelers mail trucks ambulances and so forth they can convert to electric power before they push this agenda on us. Let the police stations and truck companies make deals with Tesla etc... Our tax dollars spend more time in politicians pockets than in funding something like that. Then to push electric car propaganda. They force it on us Guinea pigs first than government officials riding around in a giant lithium battery. They talk about cell phones and cancer with a 3000mah battery. Imagine a 100,000 man lithium battery. Eff* them and their electrification propaganda. Give us roaring engines and track days!!!

Going back to a happy place. I found this video of a 1LE vs GS... who would win. I knew the answer to that already. And yes as a DD... the camaro is the hooligan of the 2. More fun on the street. Vette... better on track.

But price to price... a camaro ZL1 1LE and a grand sport costs the same. I'd love to see that comparo.

https://youtu.be/RWYd3Jw2zn0

Camaro is ceasing production after 2023. They just can't keep up with Ford and Dodge on sales.

1. They just increased 2% in June with the 2020 refresh

2. They shelved the project for an estimated 2 years. It's not cancelled.

3. The big 3 always fluctuate their sales numbers.

You might wanna research your info before commenting.

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...olet-camaro%2F

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...n-june-2019%2F

Here's sales over the last 5 years. With the exception of a few months. Camaro has dominated most sales...

http://motrolix.com/automotive-sales...ge-challenger/

https://www-motor1-com.cdn.ampprojec...28-canceled%2F

So I'm posting this article mainly for the last paragraph. They state Chevy and many car companies are cancelling low selling vehicles to focus more on electric and autonomous driving.

The IRONY is... Electrics and hybrids are the lowest selling cars right now!!!! The lunacy of reporting about to low selling cars and promoting the lowest selling, lowest public interest cars of all automotive generations.

The camaro z/28 seems to be cancelled. I dont see anyone pining over a chevy bolt. Fvckin morons!! They suddenly started sounding like Nissan outta left.

Looking year over year, the Mustang has outsold the Camaro by 20% to 60% in the last 3 years.

And although it has basically kept pace with the Challenger, if you add in the Charger (which is basically the same car with 2 more doors and a modicum more rear seat room), those have outsold Mustang. From a platform profitability standpoint, it's FCA for the win with Ford and GM pulling up as spectators.

Year..............2019......2018.......2017
Camaro......24,517....50,963....67,940
Mustang.....38,542....75,842....81,866
Challenger..28,668....66,716....64,537
Charger......45,046....80,226....88,351

USA sales from goodcarbadcar.net

Interestingly, Mustang outsells Charger in Canada! Camaro still 4th in this list. I wonder if it is US police force purchases that jacks up Charger sales down there?

At this point... it doesn't even matter...

https://youtu.be/aB197fU5vs8


Rumor became fact... Camaro as a nameplate is dead in 2023. It's been shelved to possibly come back but... things are looking bad...

For mustang fanboys... this is bad. It kills competitiveness in the muscle arena. When camaro disappeared... So did the 5.0 and the world's shittiest v6 came to ford. The Z destroyed the mustang first. But then... came the camaro. It was revolutionary as a muscle car. And now. The Camaro drives unlike any other muscle car. It rivals porsches instead of M bimmers. Who woulda thought. Without the camaro the mustang will turn into an EV SUV with a coupe back. This was the last true enthusiast market. JDM let us down 5 yes ago. We had muscle to keep us going. Now they're gucking that up too.

FCA outsells cuz they are boats with loads of room. They're not sports cars. I dont know what's the h as te on sports cars over the last decade. But these pansies need to all find a skyscraper n jump off it. The enthusiast market is dead. Only the rich will play. I just might get a ZL1 or ZR1 as an investment?

So the mustang supra and corvette will be your only options for an affordable sports car??? Oh and the Z34 in 2023? Lol. Geez...

Al OPPENHEISER the head of Camaro development. .. Reassigned to developing EV cars... Fvck THE INDUSTRY

https://www-roadandtrack-com.cdn.amp...elop-gm-evs%2F

I guess this shoulda been the first hint.

Chevy is colluding with Russia.

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...ack-edition%2F

Ok... so ummm. A strange test mule is running around in 3rd gen chassis... wtf? Is the csmaro dead or not?

Will the 7th gen be a copy of the 3rd gen?

https://gmauthority-com.cdn.ampproje...ture-camaro%2F

I think s 73 Camaro would've made the best retro camaro. But the 3rd gen had corvette like proportions. Hmmm?

https://youtu.be/eVuwfCFsBrw

The 2020 refresh is hot!

I realize what the dilemma of making a 7th gen camaro is now that the C8 is here.

Camaros for the most part have been 90% vettes with backseats. The C7 and camaro 6 got even closer in performance in this past generation.

NOW... the corvette is soooooo good. There's no way in HELL. That a camaro will be 90% of a corvette. And I'm sure they will NOT try to make a 4seat mid engine like a Lotus evora. I'm sure the vette is a subsidized car to have put it out like this. Theres no profit in the vette. They're probably taking a loss hoping that bread n butter
Sales make up for corvette losses that was created for bragging rights.

Also they know that building a Camaro they'd have to make an LT3 for FR use and offer a DCT for FR use as well. They probably dont have the budget.

Then they would have to make a Camaro 7 with at least corvette grand sport performance to make up for the lack of that 90% vette reputation. That would be the minimum performance requirement to make the camaro be what its rep has been.

Sales of the camaro is not going in the direction needed to make that good of a car. Especially now the camaro interior quality would have to bump up etc... just to sell. Making a ZL1 that costs more than a base vette but is still slower than a base vette is a huge dilemma. The camaro name has to drop till they can figure out a new identity for the camaro. The vette is just too much car for the camaro to exist.

DAMN... this makes sense!
 

I gotta get a ZL1 ASAP. Muscle is going to be teslas with star wars land speeder noises.

Mo Camaro... :facepalm:

New ecu tune for traction off drag race mode for elsd
 

https://youtu.be/HPK6N1mKcck

Looking at this overview of the camaro ss LT1. I believe this car is a major major win.
Iij didnt really put into perspective that cost is a major factor of why the SS is the loser in sales. It just seems all the v8 muscle cars seem expensive until you start nitpicking features. You can get a lot of cheat sub models at a fairly good deal in challenger's and mustang's.

But drive for drive. The Camaro is by far the superior drive. It's not even close. It's so good that I can see why all the whiny babies can do is talk about visibility and price cuz theres nothing u can say bad once you open this thing up.
Not having the MRC seems like you're losing out. But not really. You're still getting 1.1 g on the skid pad and it's a solid handler as well.
A suspension upgrade of about $1600 will get u at MRC level or maybe even better?(till u hit 1LE)

The 1LT doesnt have 4 piston FRONTS but the fronts are the meat of it all. I agree with this video about dual mode if you dont just go aftermarket which may be better? But a good camaro exhaust is about $1700 so the dual mode for $900 might do well with a secondary cat delete. You wont get staggered tires and all seasons but I promise you. All season Michelin PS3AS PLUS tires are the best as tires I've ever driven. The drive like summer tires and the added value of being able to rotate for longevity is an awesome incentive. You can get double the life. A solid year if you rotate and drive aggressive. If you're relatively calm. You can get up to 2 years of life on a non staggered set up. I burn out my rears every 5 months and about 7,000 miles. Those are as tires. Summers I burn in 5 months.
Mind you... this is not a ZL1. Something to think about.

I implore anyone to take a serious look at the camaro driving experience as a sports car. Once you get past at the monstrous width and low visibility. Its unbelievable what you can accomplish for a car this size.

Lastly. None of these things affect you on a track. The visibility means nothing. If you are looking for a powerhouse affordable car.
460lbs of stock torque is loads. And a basic intake and exhaust takes your brake horsepower and converts it to rear wheel horsepower without a tune. The possibilities are endless.

Enjoy. :driving::tiphat:

I agree that this car is a beast.
If GM wants to re-design it, this is because posers want a different look and not because the capability is in any way lacking.

If it weren't for the weight and front engine, I would have considered one for the track. It's still way faster than my 4C, but I get forever out of a set of brake pads and tires compared to my Camaro friends. The Camaro's use of consumables is typical of almost any normal high HP street car on track - I'm just spoiled, is all!

Just thought I'd share. I covered 260 highway miles with 9.3 gallons of premium fuel on cruise control at 88mph. That would mean about 1 tank can get me up to 520 miles. Probably more if I maintained 70 or 75 mph.

I think that's pretty impressive considering Im now pumping 504 bhp out my car.

That's great... If it really happened. :ugh2:

Rode in my buddy's new Camaro RS. I didn't think it was possible but it has worse visibility than the Z. The front windshield is so small, I couldn't even see the stop lights unless we were at least 3-4 cars back. And that was once I lowered the seat as much as it would go. I can't imagine driving that car for a daily...

How big is the tank? I've gotten over 500 miles on a tank in the Z before. Came out to nearly 28 mpg.

edit... I see it's about the same size tank. And there's no way I could set cruise near 90 in the Z and get that. I would fully expect to see the mileage you're seeing the Camaro. More powerful engine = greater efficiency (that is... as long as you can keep your foot out of it).

When I had my Z cruise would get my about 24mpg doing 70mph The Z didnt like texas summers to much. Come fall and the Z would perk up all the way thru spring. In the summer it would feel like I lost 40hp. My mpg would increase by 2mpg in the fall

This 2020 model drove pretty dang good, week before last :tup:
Being nearly 6’6” & 275, those suede leather seats were very comfy.

And I could see just fine; blind spots are similar to the Z...but I was looking straight ahead :tiphat: