8 pages of what flavor ice cream's better Pistachio or chocolate chip! Lol

i still wouldnt get a 335/135..those cars are everywhere and i only see 400-450whp as their max...reliability is a concern..and even if you have that much power, they would probably still get smoked by a bolt on Z on a track with turns..considering the fact that a 3 liter twin turbo is making 300 hp is not impressive at all...there are better motors out there...LSX, VQ/VR, the S4's new motor, even the Evo's alum block is impressive...a VQ with twin turbo, although quite expensive is way above the level of the 135s/335s limits...

edit:oops he already picked his car..well in that case..enjoy it to your fullest...

400-450 is the max for full bolt-ons + meth on stock turbo's. There is a company that released a turbo upgrade that's in the 500's but like you said, reliability would be a huge issue after a turbo upgrade especially since they're already non-reliable, IMO.

I'll disagree with you for sake of debate about a 3.0l TT making 300hp/300tq not being impressive. Also, BMW underrated that motor and lots of people have dyno'd 280ish stock. Given the 15% drivetrain loss, that motor should've been rated some where around 330ish at the crank.

The VQ isn't impressive either IMO (330hp for 3.7l, no DI, i'll say overrated hp/tq #'s), the S4 motor hasn't even been out long enough to see where it stands let alone see it's limits, the LS and 4G/B motors are bullet proof as well as the VR.

Which VQ are you talking about? 35DE/35HR/37HR? Because I can tell you a TT VQ35DE is probably one of the most unreliable set ups on a stock motor. IIRC, they haven't tested out the limit of the 35HR/37HR but most tuners stop around 500-550ish for safety purposes and IMO that's its limit before having to build.

Surely you jest :icon18:

Last time I checked, a 3.7L making 332, vs. a 4.6L V8 making 310.... apples to oranges, got it, but 332 is almost at the peak for a naturally aspirated V6, DO NOT say those numbers arent impressive, I think they're quite good.;)

Like I said, IMO it isn't impressive, obviously your opinion differs. Who said anything about a mustang? Also, BMW made 333hp off of a 3.2l with DI back in 2001...there is a reason why the VQ motor didn't make it on Wards Top 10 Best Engines this year. Also, he's talking about the NEW S4 motor the supercharged 3.0 V6 not the B7 S4 engine.

I don't understand why this thread isn't a Z4 vs 370Z thread. If you are having a conflict of 335i vs 370Z, I say go for the 335i, you'll be happy in the end. My :twocents:

:iagree:

Whoa whoa whoa...while I will say that 332 isnt too shabby for a 3.7L V6...trying to compare it to the 4.6L V8 in the Mustang is a horrible choice. Its efficiency is a joke, and Ford has realized that. That's why the 5.0's coming back out again, and should be in the ~400 HP range.

I also wouldn't say that 332 hp is the "peak" for a V6, either...there are plenty of new technologies to be found and/or utilized. Lets not even go into the fact that Porsche's GT3 makes 435 HP with a measly 3.8L...a single tenth more than us, yet over 100 HP more...

Just food for thought :)

frost put it very succinctly, dude. That's your best bet.

My friend has a 2007 Z4M with around 3k miles on it. If you're interested in purchasing from him, just pm me. It's black.

Agreed. Now the GT3 is what I consider impressive.

And how much does a GT3 cost? my point exactly. Just for a comparo, my 07' Eclipse GT is a 3.8L and makes 263 at the crank. Point I'm trying to make is, 332bhp is damn good, especially for a 3.7 NA engine.

I had an 02 325Ci, a 04 M3 and an 07 328Xi before moving to my Z. Loved all of them and each one had it's pros and cons. I guess it all boils down to personal preference.

No, the point you're trying to make is that the a N/A 332 HP 3.7L is good for this price point. In reality, its not that great at all compared to other 6-cylinders. Case in point, the Porsche.

So, revise your point to something along the lines of, "For cars in the sub-50K range, ~330 HP for a 3.7L isn't bad at all", and its very correct :).

No sir. What I will do is say that 332hp, for a NA V6, regardless of price, is DAMN good. You have your opinion, I have mine. You choose to compare the VQ to an engine that costs 4 times as much, and in doing a comparo, you compare the average engine output for its size with other cars IN ITS CLASS, by which the GT3 is not. Now back to the point at hand, also comparatively speaking, your comparing a Flat 6 against a V6, two completely different configurations, one built for efficiency and power equally, and one strictly for all out speed applications. Case in point the VQ, excellent power while having decent fuel economy. The GT3 is a race bred car, and thats it. So to say that 332bhp for a V6 is bad, i'd say you are terribly misguided sir.

Yeeeaaah!!! Lets keep this flame war going:mad:!!!!

Just kidding. Obviously, everyone here agrees both are great cars. With their own little issues but not deal breakers. I don't own a 135 or 335 so I can't say anything about them from experience. It's not hard to find on the Internet or in magazines that both cars put down similar numbers in just about every category, so you're not losing any performance by choosing one over the other. Practicality is what you really need to decide on. And styling, because lets face it, they look completely different. And those are the questions only you can answer. No matter what you choose in the end, you will have a sweet ride.

I do agree that the V6 and flat 6 are two completely different configurations. However, fundamentally, it is still a 6-cylinder putting out a similar displacement as the VQ, and yet, putting out considerably more power. So my point remains valid - a 6-cylinder can significantly outperform the VQ, given the resources for development.

Your point, as highlighted above, is that you want to compare the VQ ONLY to motors that cost "about the same". You mentioned money situations specifically twice, and "in its class" (since we're talking sports cars here, it can be safely assumed you meant price-point, just like my LAST post said...) once. So, you yourself are alluding to the fact that you think 332 HP from a 6-cylinder is pretty good for this price-point. Which, as I already said, its not too shabby.

So, this brings up the simple question: do you honestly think 332 HP is "near the peak" for a V6? And with what motor-building background do you have to reinforce your theory?

MY point is, that you can always get more power - raising your compression and requiring a less-forgiving tune will gain power right off the bat. Using a more efficient exhaust configuration that may be less forgiving as far as emissions wise, but better flowing would help. Researching a better head design will yield more power, also.

The source for more power is always there, but of course your price point goes up. So, going off your DIRECT quote right here:

...you are wrong. Flat out, plain and simple. There are ways to make more power. I am not misguided, I am correct based off your original criteria, which was simply this: 332 HP is almost at the peak for an N/A V6. 332 HP IS, however, almost the "peak" for how little we are spending on the car.

I'd probably get the 370Z. 335i is just alright for me...a little too common looking and honestly a little bland and pedestrian. I had an E46 330Ci so I know how Non-M BMW's are. If you want a sports car get a sports car...I tested out a low mile E46 M3 w/6mt and THAT I must say was an exciting and visceral drive.

But the 370Z is damn fun to get behind the wheel of too. I tested a yellow 09 touring...no sport package but it had the 6mt trans. The combination of the more luxurious interior, better feeling transmission, and better/more instant power made it quite a bit more exciting right out of the box than my 350Z.

I tried sitting in a 330i and 135i..... and I was too fat, so in conclusion besides the fuel pump, expensive upkeep, and everyone having one I'm not getting one. Funny though when I took a TT for a drive, I was able to fit in it....and get it up to 100mph :tup:. I'll have to find a Z (or someone who has one around here) to try it out and see if my fat *** can fit :eekdance:

The new TT is a VERY nice car. Audi did well with it.

yes a very big improvement over that last gen, I would love a TTS, but 50k is up there, could buy a GTR with 12k on it for 69k. I also think that they should have do without the rear seats. At my 5'6" height I still didn't fit....I guess good for the kids? :ugh2:

Also one think I love about most of the Euro a/t gear boxes is how they add a leather boot around the stick, makes it looks nice and helps keep crap out of it.

Ehh, overpriced and no 6mt FTL. Definitely a looker though...I wouldnt mind too much at all being seen in one.

My best friend has a new 335i. We did about 5 pulls on each other, and were neck to neck every single time (he has no mods but I do have the stillen gen III intake) So in saying that, performance wise they are both equally as fast, and i mean equally. But if your looking for more functionality, go with the 4 door, sophisticated BMW. If your looking to feel absolutely amazing every time you look at/sit into your vehicle, admire all the draw dropping looks of passerbys, and feel like every penny of the 30-40k you just spent on a car was worth every penny if not more, like you stole candy from a baby, then def buy the Z. It is truely that much more of an amazing car once you own one. Where the BMW on the other hand...eh its just a plan, blah, not very interesting 4 door sedan with a flappy paddle gear box, your better off getting the best of both worlds and buying an sti/evo mr instead....hope this helps ya :)

Ever heard of the 2JZ-GTE?? 320hp and 315ftlbs of torque...that engine stock puts better numbers than the N54 and can run 800hp...this happened 15 years ago...other cars include 3000gt, 300zx and many were underrated...now find me a 6cyl engine that is NA that makes over 300hp without DI or cams...

Bobo you lost me on price point vs a Porsche? The is a huge price differential between a 370Z and any Porsche.

Thanks for the history lesson but what does the 2JZ have anything to do with what's being discussed :rolleyes:? All I was saying was that the N54 is underrated from factory and the published 300hp/300tq should be more in the range of 330hp/330tq (which is in line of the engines you listed).

In this day in age, most if not all car manufactures are using DI in there engines. So to answer your question, one of the few it not only engine(s) that makes over 300hp without DI would be the VQ. By no means is that an engineering feat especially since the VQ has the highest displacement (37HR) in its class and Nissan failed to use a technology that will make their engine better.

That was my point...I'm merely saying, you can make a powerful 6-cylinder. Regardless of brand, if you have the money, it is possible.

So, when I hear someone say that 332 HP is near the "peak" for an N/A V6, I cant help but laugh because if money is no object, then that certainly is not the case. No, the Porsche isn't a V6, but it was the first 6-cylinder I thought of. Regardless of configuration, you can certainly make an N/A V6 more powerful than 332 HP...that for sure.

Besides, does someone actually think that the Porsche GT3's 3.8L makes 100+ more HP than the 370Z's 3.7L just because its a flat-6 versus a V6? Lawl to you, if so...

So this thread's got me thinking, is the 370Z underpowered for its purpose or is the 335i just damn fast for a sedan/coupe touring car? I mean it seems like the 335i isn't lagging too much behind the 370Z in handling either, so what's the point of getting the 370Z other than wanting a "pure" sports car by sacrificing seats, noise, etc?

It's not underpowered at all. If you're looking for a car close to or below $30,000, then the 370z is the answer. It sets the benchmark for its class and is also the best bang for your buck while the 335i sets the benchmark for entry-level sports coupe.

IMO, Sports car and sports coupes shouldn't be compared because while the sports car is more raw, has better feed back, more driver oriented, the sports coupe is more refined, convenient, while being able to provide "sports car" like attributes. That being said, the decision should be made by the persons preference and not by which car is "better".

I think its all of personal matter. Since both are about the same for power and performance here are what I'm listing as areas that can help choose what is best for your needs and wants. (strictly IMO)

Seating:
370z-if you are single and don't have alot of friends, this is your car. Why have the extra weight of two usless seats in the back? It'll also make you feel like your a man..... :bowrofl:.....not really, but it does give you the sports car feel.
335i-if you have friends, and are always out and about handing at clubs or bars, the two extras seats are helpful. (more pockets of gas money ;)) It's also helpful for any 'emergency' situations when you and group of friends or family are going somewhere and space is scarce in other friends cars.

Brand name:
Sometime in your past life you've been a brand whore....but sometimes you got to realize that your fav. company is just not giving the goods *cough* toyota *cough*. So if you are looking for the car you want you'll have to do a comparsion with all the different brands, and see if they offer what you want.

Pricing:
No brainer, if its new vs. new your probably going to go for the one that gives you more bang for the buck. I guess the same can go you you can find the more expensive one used for about the same price.

Repaires:
Can you afford the upkeep of the car? More stuff you can DIY like oil change, but when it comes to the routine check ups, the euro cars can be as much as what your paying monthly.

Interior Quality:
Want luxury and lots of options or doable interior that just gives you the basic stuff.

I think you can get my drift....its all personal tastes. I left out alot of other stuff like realiability, fiancing, insurance, but im too lazy. As for me, I think the biggest difference would be the routine maintenance, I would opt for the cheaper one, and also exclusivity....lots of people have 335i around here vs. the two 370z i've seen here. Ok thats my rant....I'm going to eats some PB M&M and sip on some hot cocoa with a shot of espresso :excited:

Well, some would argue the Z keeps getting fatter, and hence the increased power is less effective. Others would argue that the 335i is a twin-turbo 6-cylinder, and by that very virtue would more than likely be a quick car with lots of potential.

Either way, I wouldn't say the Z is underpowered too much at all. Its all in what the car was designed for in the first place - its obvious what the Z is for, but the 335i is a bit more vague. In reality, it was made for men who want a little more umph from the car they daily drive to work and to the golf course. But can it take corners the same as the 370Z? Hardly. But you post a very good question - what IS the point in buying the Z over the 335i? To many, image. A 2-seater sports car to many is viewed as a sign of youth, maybe even a bit rebellious nature in this time of practicality.

You pretty much nailed it since that's the whole reason I opted the 370Z over the G37 now that I think about it.

What's the point? Here's mine: I save a ton of money and I get Japanese quality/reliability. Underpowered? I think not! :tiphat:

Anything less than an LS2/LS7 is underpowered, IMO.

Anything less than a top-fuel dragster! :icon17:

I got the Z because my golf bag fits perfectly in the trunk. :tup:

+1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!

n54 - 100hp/liter

vq - 89hp/liter

You can argue NA, but the VQ is quite a bit larger. Big advantage up top. While the n54 starts losing power, the VQ really starts grunting.

Perceptions are just that. Drive an MX5 and you'll love it. I also had a modded 240z and thwat was brutal. I am also looking forward to eventually purchasing a 370z. Am I a girly man, gtfo.

Our Zeds in Australia are loaded and there interiors are luxury. So the compo with the 335 and Zed interior are moot. Both are Luxury.