honest opinions about this article ??
 

I know this might not go here but was wondering what some think of this article
on american muscle. i know its been beat to death on this subject.

but from what i take from the article is Detroit is not standing still and won'ts to
own the sports car market. and nissan is a sleep at the wheel.

at this pace imho the z will end up as just a little fun 2 seater to take the wife
out for a fun weekend drive. i'm not talking about tracking either. because the
average buyer could care less about that.

it's all about the features........... Muscle cars hit the road again - Business - Autos - msnbc.com

Love muscle cars, but feel we will be addressing the issue of peak oil from here on out. Now's the time for the last hoorah if you intend to get in on the action.

Evolution effects all. Even with concerns about oil and price of gas. Car manufacturers will find a way to squeeze better performance from smaller fuel efficient or fuel alturnitive engines. Those who don't will loose a popular segment. As long as there are two guys to compare penus sizes there will be a HP war and sports car market

You guys give it too much credit. Sports cars are still a niche market, not everyone can afford or use a car that might not handle everyday's job. Why do you think the Camrys are so much more popular than the Mustangs (in terms of sales #)

Toyota did a pretty good job at selling cars without creating a good sports car...

great cars
 

the next few years will see Chevy's response with several new Camaros.

Expect Ford to up the ante

The American consumer is the big winner

:driving:

Hopefully the FT-86 will change that next year.

I dunno... I really don't like most of the retromobiles. It's like they took one step forward in technology and five steps back in design :icon14:

I can only guess that you're in you're twenties.
The manufacturers are trying to attract the dollars of the 40-50 year old buyers with the retro designs. Cars for guys who couldn't afford them in their twenties, but now that they're financially established or in the mid-life-crisis-zone, they can shell out the bucks for a toy that reminds them of their youth and the cars they fapped to in Hot Rod magazine.

I love muscle cars. I don't know that I'd own one, but I do enjoy borrowing one from a friend from time to time. Something special about having all that power on tap, and the classic lines are fantastic.

Doubt it, gas mileage will probably drive sales in the unforeseeable future. I am not sure a 160HP rwd car will drive anything other than making a car that young professionals or college kids can afford.

I'm not a fan of the new Camaro at all. Ford did a decent job on the Mustang and Dodge got the lines right on the Challenger, but Chevy completly blew it on the Camaro.

I enjoy my Z as my daily driver and the precise cornerering capability.....but there's nothing quite like a first generation Camaro with a big cam, high compression 468 cubic inch motor (7.6L) thumping out 700HP and 650 ft/lbs of torque to peel your eyelids back when you launch it. :excited: ......oh and my neighbors love the full length headers and dual 3" exhaust when I fire it up in the morning.

Unfortunately it gets 5 MPG and needs premium gas along with octane boost, or aviation gas (which makes run REAL strong), so it doesn't get driven much anymore.:mad:

Not a fan of muscle cars...i like agility too much

i just like the ability to go 'round a corner

I also have a rule, that my house and car shouldn't weigh the same.

thus i bought a Z

I didnt like the American muscle cars of the 90's and early 2000's but recently they have all stepped up their game. Im a fan of the retro look and Im pretty sure the 2012 Boss Mustang is a monster around curves.

My biggest beef with them is how common they are. Im fortunate enough to live somewhere that I barely ever see other 370Z's.

I live in Long Island and I've only seen about 5 ion the road in 3 years

:icon18:

If you dont track your car, weight makes no difference. My prius is 300lbs lighter than my 370, so what. It's only a number.

ummm weight makes no difference?

not sure if serious, compare the 0-60 times of a stock z vs a z - 300lbs, and tell me weight makes no difference.

power to weight ratio ring a bell?

everyone's points are all valid and points well made
my post was meant to point out that while Nissan
is happy with the status as it is with the 370
Chevrolet Dodge and Ford are moving forward quickly
with their icons. IMO the next Z to compete needs to
learn a lesson from Detroit.

:iagree:

I like my Z, but I wouldn't mind a 2011 5.0.

Incorrect, and I like classic muscle cars. Moreover, I doubt consumers in that age range are the target audience. Those folks would probably rather have a classic muscle car restored too.

Now if you like it, that's fine, but adopting design cues from 40 years ago in a modern car can in no way be considered a step forward. The previous generation Camaro, Firebird and Mustang were all taking on a modern shape, and then suddenly it's as if we've wound up in a parallel universe where none of that ever happened.

Hint: You don't have to build cars anymore that are as big as boats and weigh in at 4K lbs. And yet, they do.

Not my thing.

What's next? Something that looks like a model T?

It might not be your thing, but other people certainly don't mind. Just look at the sales numbers of those cars vs the Z.

hmmmm...challnger camero mustang corvette all make over or near 400hp, they can weight 4000lbs and still be faster than the z, in a straight line anyway

btw my c6 is lighter than my 370z

first off, the mustang and challenger are not faster than the z. the camaro is very close, and if the Z shed a few hundred lbs. my money would be on the z 100%

weight is one of the biggest factors.

Funny, I thought the mustang was faster. :icon14:

This gets the nod for the redzed facepalm statement of the day.

I didnt know there was such a thing! Now youre not allowed to face palm for the rest of the day though huh?

No, it just gets the biggest facepalm.

idk, when they tested them against eachother

the 370z did "13.5 seconds at 103.7 mph and the Mustang a nearly identical 13.5 at 102.9 mph"

and the z destroyed it in the slalom

could be subjective idk, however I DO know that saying weight of a sports car is irrelevant the most naive statement i've heard on these boards

Are you talking about the old mustang?

if i was a foot taller, i would be playing in the nba....... what if.......

we are talking about muscle cars, people only care about straight line acceleration.. who cares if it cant turn or stop, its plenty for their owners

it was 2010 stang vs 2009 z

Yeah I figured, I remember that test.

im saying in a straight line (no turns) the z would be faster then the 3 muscle cars mentioned IF it went on a diet. IE no mods other than weight savers.

thus weight plays a large role in straightline and slalom performance

no $hit it does. i am saying if a muscle car is making 400+ hp, who cares if it is 4000lbs as it can outdrag your z in a straightline anyway. i was more responding to the people who complain about the mustang or other muscle cars as being too heavy

I'm only responding to your statement

"If you dont track your car, weight makes no difference."

I dont track my car, and wouldn't mind my car being faster (weight is one way of accomplishing this) as would people that drive muscle cars. Why do you think they keep bumping the horsepower up. another way of acheiving performance is losing weight.

anyway...doesnt matter.

well none of the cars being discussed are really lightweight cars per se. drive a lotus elise and you will realize what less weight can do for a car. it changes how a car can drive.

the 370 is lighter than the old 350 but i never have considered it a light car. Now the Mustang, camero and porker challenger are all heavier than the Z but the V8 versions of these cars do have quite a bit more power than the Z. The fact the Z stays so close in a straight drag race is what i consider a feather in the Zs hat.

remember when the 350 was compared to the other japan boys RX8 and S2k they called the 350 the muscle car of the bunch due to its torquey engine and higher weight.

I personally am not one for straight line speed. Its too one dimensional. an all arounder is what i look for. I want a car that can carry speed into a corner scrub it off transfer its weight well and come out of a corner on the power and still feel balanced.

This is where I believe the Mustang loses in MY book. its the damn live rear axle. Ford refuses to update this just like Porsche leaves the engine in the 911 in the wrong place and GM still uses pushrods from the 1950s
Now both these companies have refined these things into some great cars. 911 GT3 one of the best track cars they say (ive never driven). and what GM does with the LS engines is incredible. even though Benz gets a lot more power out of their modern 6.3L amg engine.
The mustang has made leaps in handling with their track pack mustangs it just doesnt feel like a car should to me. My driving style so I stick with the Z. If i could make a Lotus Elise/Extige work everyday i would but they are bloody impossible to get in and out of all the time. so again I prefer the Z. but thats just one mans opinion. I say again if mustang hadnt bought a 'stang I probably would not have gotten my 370 so its all about what the driver wants out of his car

ok step down off the soapbox. im not tell anyone they are right/wrong but thats my opinion and now we can discuss:tup:

its a lot cheaper to make hp than to shave weight.......

yes and no...you can save 60lbs in the Z for almost free... spare/hardware/battery (obviously this can also be done to the competition)

weight helps in a straight line AS WELL AS around corners though, so i prefer weight savings

Whereas hp wont help too much in the twisties