done

Thanks

There are 450,000 DOD employees, contractors are not included in that number. Definitely not saying they will all be affected, but I can surmise that a lot of them may have been or are in a situation that can cause them to not be able to access the internet daily. Not only that but the Military force has turnover. There are A LOT of people who deployed at least once and got out of the Military. They will definitely be more sensitive to the whole internet policy as well. This is not including Reserve and Guard numbers either as it is only including active deployments. I still think the number is significant.

But we aren't here to argue that :P I want to play these consoles to even see if it's worth my coin. But for me, now they equal territory.

The used games market was more valuable to the average gamer and to the video game industry at large than the big publishers would like to admit. And sitting on your shelf, the games are not getting played and are utterly worthless. Traded in, maybe you buy a new game with some of the money, and maybe someone less fortunate or less confident in the title gets to play a game that they wondered about but couldn't afford or didn't want to spring for initially, and maybe they love the game and then buy the sequel new when they have more money or faith in the title.

I've had several outages last more than one day, and the "if you don't have internet you can get a 360" line is just plain ignorant. If I don't have internet, I'll get a PS4 and enjoy most of the same titles that are on the XB1. Plenty of people take consoles with them on vacation. I don't, but plenty do.

I have huge problems with big Microsoft messing with little indie gamer, but whatever, opinions are like pizza toppings

Right, but PS4 will be less expensive and not require that annoying accessory.

It's nothing revolutionary if they've been doing it on PC's for a decade. It's not revolutionary. I wish that XB1 or PS4 was offering anything of real value in terms of revolutionizing the gaming market, but they just aren't. XBox is selling you convenience features, not improving the game console.

lol get off my lawn you young whippersnapper *shakes cane*

Playstation vs Xbox. The only topic that makes a discussion about pro-life vs pro-choice look civil and rational.

:icon18: as much as MrandMrs and I have been going back and forth, I still respect him and his opinions a great deal. He's a good guy :icon17:

I know I am probably late on the response

Gamestop sells used games if you are worried about losing 60 bucks, Buy the game used beat it in 7 days return it for store credit. Then guess what you don't lose all your money on a game you hate/beat in 7 days. Problem solved!

That's what gamefly is for. Every gamer needs an account so you can play those really cool games that only last 6-10 hrs without coughing up $60.

Exactly! Problem solved for all the people crying about losing money.

Regardless oh all the moaning and crying the Xbox and PS4 are going to make big sells. I am going to buy a Xbox console for the soul fact I love it. If I get deployed again and I can't play out here boo hoo. I got more stuff to worry about out here than my K/D on Call of Duty.

Is there any doubt we're all most likely going to end up with both? We're all dumb with money. Have you seen what we're willing to drop on car parts?

Exactly

I won't buy an xb1. I have self control (ignore what's in my driveway) :bowrofl:

But all kidding aside Im going with the PS4

They are not useless to me I sometimes like to throw in an old game and have fun. I have a stack of Old PSOne games I still play every once in a while. That is why I’m happy Sony is talking about doing an emulator for a lot of the classic titles. With the cloud gaming those less fortunate could have played the game without spending a dime. We also would have all had lower costs on new games because the developers wouldn’t have to make all their money off of people like me.

The 360 comment was an attempt to make light/humor on the stupid comment. It is true though. I agree the PS4 "was" a better choice if that was a feature you couldn’t live without.

I guess from all the time I have wasted trying indie games I am little sour towards them. The bulk of them lack so much. It’s almost like singers/bands that will never make it big. It is hard to break into the industry. We all lose in both scenarios. I feel a little spammed by indie titles. I need to stop now before I go on another rant. :icon17:

The Kinect will eat your soul!

It is to the console gaming market. I get what you’re saying though, you have seen it and know it is being done on the PC.

Likewise, Im having a blast with this! :happydance:

I still have a working nes, snes, genesis, dream cast,ps1&2, Xbox, gba and GameCube besides the wii, ps3, and 360.

Thats awesome! Do you have Excite Bike? I loved that game so much lol. I have owned everything except a NES. All I have left is PS1,2,3 and Xbox 360. The one I miss most is my N64. I am very tempted every time I see one to buy it.

I have an NES/SNES in boxes, but honestly I just rely on emulators if I want to relive some nostalgia, especially since I rented so many games rather than owned them.

I only have an xbox360 and no Wii or PS3. If I don't have a reason to purchase a second console, I won't. PC + whatever is best is more than enough of my time wasted. :) Of course, if both PS4 and Xbone do well and give me reasons to get both, I don't mind doing so. I might just have to finally cancel WoW then. :)

I wonder if we'll see new new episodes of Killzone, Uncharted and Battlefield. Im sure we will.

Man I am usually the first kid on the block with the new toys. But I think this time around I'm going to have to wait and see what the reviews are after both systems come out.

Back for some more :stirthepot: Now that Microsoft has pleased the masses with the removal of DRM and Daily online check in.....I ask myself what I want out of my gaming system. As I said in numerous posts, Multiplayer and Online experience is my driving factor. I also mentioned how put off I was by Sony's tight lips on their Online power which was garbage on the PS3. It will no doubt be better, but will it be good enough? I do not want to settle for good enough, I want the best.

I stumbled across this little bit of info tonight:

(The Xbox One vs PS4 debate will likely rage on for a long, long time. Since both consoles aren't on the market yet and wary consumers are still trying to pledge allegiance to one side or the other we can expect a LOT of Xbox One vs PS4 debates about specs and features and games before we even get to play the systems. It's already started. There are Xbox One vs PS4 spec debates and Xbox One vs PS4 launch title debates and there are plenty of fanboys on each side spewing hate and, in the middle, a lot of anxious gamers who don't want to make a $400 mistake this fall and buy the wrong system. But there is one area of the Xbox One vs PS4 debate that I think is pretty obvious: the Xbox One will have a far superior online component thanks to a strong investment by Microsoft that builds off the strength of the already-dominant Xbox LIVE network.

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Xbox One vs PS4: Microsoft Delivers 300k Server Checkmate
The number one deciding factor, right now, in the Xbox One vs PS4 specs for online gameplay is server count. Currently, Xbox LIVE runs off of about 15,000 servers. It's a big number, and as an avid Xbox LIVE user I can say from personal experience that the system is very reliable. There have only been a handful of times in the eight years I've had the service that it was down for more than an hour or two. So those 15,000 servers seem to be doing a decent job of handling the gaming, video and chatting functions of the 46 million Xbox LIVE users.

During the Xbox One reveal event, Microsoft boasted that they were ready to launch 300,000 servers on the Xbox One release date. 300,000 servers is, according to the company pitchmen, equivalent to ALL the computing power in the world in 1999. A report in The Atlantic disputed this claim, and said it's probably more like 1995. Which is still pretty incredible.

"Realistically, since they are using less powerful (but specialized) servers, and orienting ourselves on the computing powers that are common in the gaming industry," renowned computer scientist and researcher Martin Hilbert told The Atlantic, "I think the reality is rather that the computing power of this cluster is equal to the world's total computing power in 1994 or the world's general-purpose computing power in 1996. I'd say they are some 5 years off ... but nevertheless very impressive!"

Why does this server count give Microsoft the edge in the Xbox One vs PS4 online gaming debate? Because, according to a report in Ars Technica, those servers will be doing cloud computations that lift the burden of processing things like physics modeling, fluid dynamics, and cloth motion from your console. Easing the burden on the console means a reduction in latency which means, ultimately, less lag.

Sony has been relatively quiet on their server count or online capability. For all the hype we hear about Gaikai streaming and the infamous "Share" button, Sony isn't putting the hard numbers out there. Pocket-lint.com addressed online gameplay in their own Xbox One vs PS4 debate and said Microsoft is poised to deliver "a class-leading multiplayer experience."

I think the reason Sony isn't talking about its server count is because its nowhere near the 300,000 Microsoft is bringing to the Xbox One release date. Virtual or dedicated, 300,000 servers are still way higher than what Sony's using. If they were using 301,000 servers, believe me, we'd hear about it. And yes, I admit, how well everything works remains to be seen, but let's dig up some history in the Xbox One vs PS4 online gaming debate when it comes to how well the services actually work ...

Xbox One vs PS4: Xbox LIVE Has Always Been Better Than PSN
If we're going to talk about company history in this Xbox One vs PS4 specs/online gaming debate then, sorry Sony fans, you're not going to like what I have to say. But the simple fact of the matter is that Xbox LIVE is by far the superior online service.

First, I'll dismiss the haters who love to point out that Xbox LIVE isn't free. You're right, it's not free. It's $5 a month. $5! If you're living the kind of lifestyle where $5 a month is a huge financial burden for you then you're probably not gonna be getting a next-gen console for a few years anyway. There's more to life than money, and in this Xbox One vs PS4 debate I feel like the cost of Xbox LIVE is worth it because it delivers a better experience.

Let's talk reliability. As I said before, in the eight years I've been on Xbox LIVE I can't recall a time when the server was down for more than an hour or two, at most. Honestly, I can't even remember the last time I had an issue logging in to Xbox LIVE that wasn't related to my own Internet connection.

The same cannot be said about PSN.

As recently as LAST WEEK the PSN crashed because of high traffic. This time, the culprit was too many people trying to download the Last of Us demo from the PSN store. Sony had egg dripping down its face and tried to be cute about it on Twitter.

Zombies are crashing the PSN Store, huge infestation attempting downloads, PSN working to resolve promptly

— Sony Santa Monica (@SonySantaMonica) May 31, 2013

Sony fans, can you really sit there with a straight face and tell me the PSN is ready for the next generation when their servers can't handle a mass download that they had MONTHS to prepare for?

Then there's the issue of security. Obviously, in the Xbox One vs PS4 online gaming world of the future, anything can happen. But as of now, the score in the "Servers Hacked" contest the score is Sony -1 Microsoft -0. And it wasn't just some rogue hack that muddied up the system for a day or two. Reuters called it one of "the biggest Internet security break-ins ever."

In April 2011, tons of personal data was stolen from the PSN and Sony warned the 77 million registered users to cancel credit cards as a precaution. Oh, but they didn't tell everyone what was really happening until almost a week after the PSN went down, resulting in massive fines from governments across the world.

And the network was down for three weeks. THREE WEEKS! In the age of on-demand gaming and broadband speeds and online service being down for an hour or two seems like an eternity, so those three weeks must've been awful for the hardcore PS3 gamers out there. Nothing of this magnitude has ever happened to Xbox LIVE. So, when it comes the security track record in the Xbox One vs PS4 online gaming debate, once again the edge goes to Microsoft.

But what about the services themselves? Here we enter into matters of taste. I own both systems and play online with friends on both Xbox LIVE and PSN. I personally prefer to use Xbox LIVE because A.) It's less laggy (for me) and B.) I can TALK to my friends as I play. Not send text messages back and forth, but actually have conversations and feel as though they're in the room with me. Hell, Xbox LIVE lets us party chat even if we're not in the same games together, something the PSN does not do.

The Xbox LIVE interface is also much more user friendly than the PSN. Xbox LIVE runs off of tabs and live tiles and delivers a vibrant looking home screen that's easy as pie to use. The PSN interface is just lists. There is no diagonal navigation to speak of, simply scroll from tabs left to right and then scroll up and down various boring lists. It looks like garbage compared to what Xbox LIVE gives customers (for that INSANE sum of $5 a month).

But hey, I'm just one gamer with a column. My opinion on which service is better in the Xbox One vs PS4 debate is just my opinion. It's not like I'm a developer working on the most valuable video game franchise in history, right? I mean, what would the people behind a multi-billion dollar game think?

Xbox One vs PS4: Call Of Duty Developers Think It's Better, Too
If you're a Call of Duty fan, then the Xbox One vs PS4 debate is probably a pretty simple one for you. Once again, the Call of Duty franchise is choosing to favor Xbox LIVE users with exclusive content. But why? According to Activision, it all comes down to Xbox LIVE.

"With billions of hours logged online, Call of Duty titles consistently rank atop Xbox LIVE's most-played charts, making it the largest Call of Duty community of any entertainment system," the company said in a 2012 press release announcing the exclusivity deal with Microsoft.

I love America. I love democracy. And with democracy, the numbers do the talking. In this case, the numbers show that, for online gaming, Xbox LIVE delivers a better experience. The Call of Duty series is played by millions of people everyday. Black Ops 2 sold $1 billion worth of copies within 15 days of its release.

I'm not saying COD is the greatest game ever. It isn't. But when it comes to the numbers it's the best-selling, most popular game out there. So, if the world's best-selling thing ever is being played most often by Xbox LIVE users, well, that pretty much puts the final nail in the coffin for Sony. After all, the people have spoken. If it was better to play games on PSN then more people would be doing so than on Xbox LIVE. But that's not the case. So, when it comes to the nex gen Xbox One vs PS4 online gaming debate, the winner is Microsoft. They have more hardware, a better service and the backing of the biggest game in the world.)

Another :stirthepot:

(ORIGINAL STORY (June 19)

Sony has temporarily taken down the version 4.45 PS3 system update that was supposed to provide "improved system stability" after a number of users reported the new firmware was bricking their systems.

"Hi guys, we're aware of reports that the recent PS3 update (4.45) has caused," PlayStation Europe tweeted out in a series of updates early this morning. "We have temporarily taken 4.45 offline and are investigating. We will announce when the system update is available for download as soon as possible and we apologise for the inconvenience."

Reports of system bricking problems began filtering in after the required update was released yesterday evening and soon filled up a 92-page thread on the official PlayStation US forums. "I updated my fatty to 4.45 now it just sits at the sparkley [sic] ribbon screen," one user wrote. "I have done multiple file restores and I am not about to reformat, or else I would probably kill myself. PLEASE tell me I am not the only one having this issue?"

Other users are reporting that booting to safe mode seems to fix some of the problems. Evidence gathered on a Reddit thread suggest the problems are centered mainly on users with large, after-market hard drives in their systems. Meanwhile, an IGN user reports that Sony support representatives are suggesting he send in his system for servicing to fix the problem at a cost of $100. We don't recommend taking that route until Sony has a little time to correct the issue through a new firmware release.

This isn't the first time a required firmware update has led to hardware problems for some PS3 owners. September 2009's version 3.00 update actually led to a class-action lawsuit from a number of users left with bricked consoles. That case was settled out of court in April of 2011 under undisclosed terms.

UPDATE (June 21): In a statement obtained by VideoGamer, Sony says that a fix for this issue should be available next week. "We have identified the issue related to the PlayStation 3 software update (version 4.45) that impacted a small number of PS3 systems earlier this week," the statement reads. "A new PS3 system software update is planned to be released on June 27 that resolves the issue. Thank you for your patience and understanding and we apologise for the inconvenience.")

I knew about this the day it happened just didnt update the thread yet. Im really not trying to start anything. I do want to see some response to this though :p

Microsoft put your hands up your the champ!

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Cant wait for the new XBOX ONE!!!

lol no they aren't

They've still taken a huge hit to their reputation and many people have been turned off. I'll tolerate extra lag for free online play and no kinect tax

Srsly, this thread has become the xbox fanboy thread, so I'm done with it. I've said my piece, and all I see now are page after page of non-news presented like it's CHECKMATE, SONY, YOU LOSE.

It was fun before, now it's just annoying.

It's all hype until release. I won't buy at release regardless. I'll wait for you early adopters to suffer all the catastrophic failures and provide reviews of the actual systems.

PS is my likely winner here, unless MS backs off of requiring a kinect.

Oh! Oh! We've brought up Sony's security! :) Being a part of the infosec world, I could argue this both ways (which is why I usually don't bring it up).

I can argue that Sony getting hacked gives them a strong lesson on how to do it wrong. But, much like security in a house is improved right after a break-in, Sony's security may have improved to shore up those issues. Sometimes it takes a kick in the pants to spark some action rather than just wishful thinking.

On the flip side, though, a break-in like that and how they handled it probably indicates an endemic problem with security, monitoring, customer assurance, uptime, etc. So while they may have overcome that hurdle in the moment, they may just not have the talent or interest in investing further into security until something else happens. If the answer to "Why secure your sh!t" is "To avoid costly downtime for our customers," then your head is still in a slightly wrong place. (In other words, security incidents that don't involve downtime or otherwise are obvious to users are hushed up...)

Then again, most companies are the same way until they are either burned or have some strong internal interest in security as an advantage/need in their industry.


In the software world, Microsoft's Windows is a far more secure product for all the attacks and attention it gets. But Adobe's products (PDF junk) and even Oracle's Java are constantly attacked and patched but are no better for it, because of endemic corporate issues and lack of caring about security in the original products.

I didn't read the entire thread, sorry if I missed it.

Will the 300k servers host, instead of relying on the user with the least latency to host (eg, COD)?

If the bit about the servers doing more heavy lifting in general makes online matches faster/smoother/bigger, then Xbox one just for that.

Tapatalk ...

Microsoft Windows has been more secured, but it is still not "secure" because of some of their design decisions. But some of its rep as insecure is undeserved. Most attacked because most popular, as I'm sure you know.

But I don't have faith in any game console for security

Just pre-ordered my PS4/ Battlefield 4 edition for $499 and pre-ordered two more games.



Fvck Xbox. lol :stirthepot:

and firearms??? lol:tup:

Honestly with everything going on I'm still leaning towards the xbox. I had a PS3 at the same time up until the network was down for a month and I got hacked. They are new to the game when it comes to this part of the field. I personally can not trust that. It's like our cars would you want the proven mechanic or the guy that sounds good? Can Sony take over as the champ yes, do they have the qualifications yes, will they have the support to back it up is the question?

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Because they were easier to target. And then there was the time that the whole network was hacked. Then there was the time that everyone lost their game data and had everything reset that was saved.

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I've had my xbl account compromised before. Are you saying that doesn't happen?

No it does happen on xbox to. But they shut down my account, reimbursed me, and then some. On the PS3 they just said sorry pretty much just told me to grab the vaseline

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And before we get on the wrong foot these are my accounts of when I had one. I am considering the PS4 cause I do believe that you learn from your mistakes just at this moment I'm leaning towards the xbox. After they come out I kind of hope that Sony blows Microsoft or of the water so they can be knocked down a peg. Cause I will say this about Microsoft they are way out of range when it comes to putting the customer first.

As in prices for their services such as movie rentals and so on.

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I believe the reason why MS is expanding the servers so aggressively is not for Xbox Live. The big reason is the cloud computing. what many of you fail to realize is what do you need 300,000 of them for? Many of you are bringing up these poll times. MS isn't stupid and they realize this. Nearly the entire internet switches and routes at line speed. What does that mean? It means these routers can make a decision and route your traffic as fast as it can come in; likewise the switches. Having 300k servers allows them to strategically place them in major cities and provide adequate coverage around the world. 30ms timer to send data back and forth is plenty of time. Unfortunately, that basically guarantees games will stay at 30fps and not make the jump to 60fps. Just a little food for thought.

What does all that mean?

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Sony is not free anymore man!

Sorry if im sounding like a fanboy I do not think I am. Just discussing my points of why im choosing the Xbox One for online games. Please do not forget im getting both systems at launch. I will give a fair unbiased opinion on both as well.

The 300k servers will act as computing power and dedicated severs for almost all of the games. No more host migrating when the player host drops out :happydance:

There is no good reason to hack a console the way they are designed it is nearly impossible to plant a worm or virus. Even if they did nothing could be recovered that is of any use. All critical data is stored server side.

You are thinking to narrow minded, the 5Tflops is also theoretical which is how it has been advertised as far as I have seen. Time will tell how well the system does @ 4k at least the ability is there.

Yep my account got hacked and they took care of me. I could of had my account back the same day but I happened to be out of town on vacation so I told them to leave it locked out until I got home.

Bingo someone knows his stuff :tup:

Please do not get offended at the information I am posting, I promise as soon as I get numbers and server power from Sony I will be posting it here. I have no intent of being a fanboy and have tried discouraging any comments that lean that direction.

We all just want accurate details and as much information that can be gathered before launch. Lets keep it up! :tup:

I forgot to mention Sony (even though it was not immediate) did handle their security breach the correct way. Did it benefit the online community? No. In the large scope of the problem it was the best method they had and like others mentioned are even stronger now.

They also offered a very nice insurance policy (free of charge) to those effected. Only a handful of fraudulent activities were reported none of which were confirmed to be part of the incident.

Good info, thanks!

One thing I don't get is the fps limit.

Back when I would PC game, Q2 and counter strike I recall running Linux just to force sync my monitor refresh rate to 120hz and the graphics card to 120 fps. If you connected to a local fast dedicated server, with say 30ms latency things seemed very smooth/fast. Maybe I wasn't really getting 120fps, or maybe consoles are different, but why are we limited to 30 fps with 30ms latency on consoles?

Tapatalk ...