Aside from all the arguing, just want to give credit to phunk for attempting to make something many have been looking for for quite some time. Anyone that's making new performance parts for the Z34 platform should be applauded.

Can't wait to see a finished product and what the performance gains are on an NA motor. I have a hard time believing that even the ported Z1 manifold is truly optimized for all out power and torque.

it's going to be a nice manifold

Totally agree with this,
I haven't seen anywhere about Phunk saying it would be a masterpiece but somebody else who made it look like it could be the best ever part ever made.

What Phunk as in project on the Intake manifold side, should be a very nice parts that look like you will be able to experiment with different intake runner
which is a very big bonus the rest is still unknown.

I might not know a lot but I wouldn't compare a part made on the VHR engine against a way superior engine/race car setup that has small restrictor but still make a ton of power...
cant compare apple Vs orange..

and fwiw this is my idea of a intake manifold masterpiece/benchmark:
http://performancedesign.com/wp-cont...-Intake-04.jpg

Admittedly I don't expect the one that phunk's working on to be anything like this as I doubt most Z34 owners can afford a $5k manifold.

No c6r no care

How bout stop the opinions and tell us what your making for us besides your mouth running? One good reason not to say anything.

Seriously. Either do better or stfu already.

Swing how the only two proven manifolds right now are just modified stock ones, I am curious to see how this compares. Can't wait to see the results!

I'd lose a little HP to just get a better looking piece.

My manifold is targeting high power boosted applications with it's design, and isn't exactly expected to do much, if anything, on a naturally aspirated engine. In its design intentions, it will perform extremely well. Intake manifold design generally involves choosing your compromises, which isn't difficult if you can settle on your application. For the application I have selected, staying within my experience, a forced induction manifold with bolt-in fitment in high power street cars. In this application, the factory lower runners will not serve as a limitation exceeding the value in replacing it. Curves in an intake runner is not the end of the world, nor are shape transitions. When those can be reasonable avoided, sure. However, I believe most of you wish for a manifold that fits under your hood and costs a fair price and looks good doing it.

It's real cute that some techs spent a million dollars making the c6r manifold for an engine that makes less power than my daily driver. But I am making a manifold for real people, real budgets, real cars, real life. I am not building a manifold for F1 or other top dollar venues. Their construction can simply lend as inspiration for every day product, as they have for years.

This is exactly what I'm saying Any numbers on this?

It's not just the c6r that was just an example, I'm just saying the manifold cj is making while nice, isn't on the same level as what i would call a masterpiece, he didn't say it but for some reason he feels like arguing the point. It's not a bad manifold but he himself says its going to be more of a nice affordable replacement manifold for boost, than a $5k be-all-end-all vhr manifold.

So how do you get around the electronic throttle bodies with a ITB manifold? I'm assuming to re use the motor for the existing TB and mount it with a linkage to open all the different ports.

not sure where you going with this but Phunk isn't making an ITB setup.

the picture shown in the beginning is only half of the actual part which is missing the plenum and TB flange.....

You use an ECU-controlled stepper motor to pull a cable(or pair of cables).

Most of the V8SuperCar teams use this arrangement.

I have in mind to use Jenvey ITB in precisely this manner.

From one website I found:

Charles will this plenum have any balancer somewhere?

Edit: No need for this post.

Yes that is in the design intentions.

I cant say design specifics in detail but i can give you a list of what makes a manifold a masterpiece.

Engineering is number one with the given space, it should be engineered for maximum performance for the application and as much time as possible should be given to its design. Drawing something up in cad that looks nice and should work based on past experience in a different application and basic design rules, then running it into production does not fit this criteria. Cfd, flow benching, harmonics, testing with different engine combinations, dynoing and real life testing, tweaking it to draw out those last few percent, mitigating any variables that effect the consistancy of performance, these are things that move any designed peice from being good to being a masterpiece. This is the combination of both research into what is happening and development to maximize it.

Build construction not mattering what it is made of should be designed to allow the part to best perform it functions without adding downside as much as possible. In manifold design this is a give and take with cost and sales but on a masterpiece, cost is secondary to all else. In all things a masterpiece does not regard cost divincii took years to paint his works if it wasnt perfect it wasnt acceptable. The term masterpiece is attached to such a level of work.

Because of your budget on this you dont have the time or resources required to move this manifold into the masterpiece area. I doubt we will ever see a manifold like that for our cars because the sales volume and profits are so low. When you say i dont know what it will do on an na car you basically are saying you havent spent the time to figure out what it will do and will instead just wait to see what happens and live with the result. Even in boosted applications through your design process do you have a goal in the percentage of power increase over the factory manifold? What usually happens in cases like this is you draw the best part you can based on past experience and just hope it makes as much of a difference as possible and since you had no real goals so long as it makes a noticeable amount more power than stock it isnt a failure right? Im sure it will be a good manifold the basics of design are visible and you are doing the best you can with your available resources.

So your standpoint is that no better manifold for a turbo 370z will ever be made and that makes this a masterpiece is that right?

Edit: thought you were talking about your own CAD photo, As for that manifold I hardly know much about that particular manifold and I don't consider myself a judge on this just that in my opinion things should be held to a much higher standard if you are to call it a masterpiece, That manifold does sound very promising from the standpoint that those are some of the highest gains I have ever heard of for a manifold to replace the already VERY good ls7 manifold with only the manifold being changed If those figures are true it is roughly an 11% gain vs the best performing factory ls manifold in the same conditions. Can't say if it is a masterpiece but can your manifold come close to an 11% bump in power on a factory motor? that would be equivalent to a manifold that adds 31hp to a factory stock Z.

Oh for christ's sake dude. Pretend no one used the word "masterpiece" and go on about your day.

People arguing over the definition of a word... BAHAHAH. That's the English language for you, its all subjective.

Now less talk about "masterpeice" and more talk about CJM manifold.

Every post he has made about me expressing my opinion over a word i feel was incorrectly used by another person, contains snide shots at me, I explain and support my opinions and he just goes well your wrong and makes a snide shot at me without any real hard arguments or facts of his own, you are right I'm done with this. We'll see how much power this thing actually makes when its done, u win Charles good luck with your manifold.

Haha finally!

Please, enough now. I respect both of you. But........................:icon14:

Edit: No need for this post.

In for the wait...

How about we all get along because we're all here for one goal: to get the most badass products on our Zs!

Don't like? Don't buy. Move along. Simple as that.

Less chit chat about stupid stuff. More badass products from phunk (and others)!

Great stuff :tup:. Can't wait to see the final product. Any guesstimate as to what it may cost?

Well, With all due technical respect to the arguing parties?

Can WE drop it? 1slow you've had your opportunity to say what you've had to say and have gotten a very good informative reply.

I would like this to move forward without the arguing.

The interested members deserve more than this.

Looking forward to the progress on this manifold :tup:


Thank You.

Well.........that escalated SLOWLY.

So the bottom line with this manifold project is that there is no need to re-invent the wheel, right? As long as it is all metal, I'm good. My M370 has to go.

It will be an all-metal construction. CF plenums is a possible option down the road depending on cost... but I cannot get a quote on it yet until the design is further along.

Hoping to come in under $2000

Cool. I will hold off on the questions until you are closer to completion...........

This will be a full bolt on without buying anything else that is required to get it running?

In the next few years, I plan to piece together parts to try and get 700+ whp. Either that or just let project X deal with it.

I am sure it will take some things besides the intake manifold itself. Plumbing type things. Example; throttle body coolant elimination, EVAP plumbing, PCV plumbing, brake boost hose, etc. However, these are things I would sort out and sell in an installation kit just as I do with my road race pump. This way it could accommodate different types of customers.

Charles, just print it :)
3D Printing at the cutting edge of racing | Racecar Engineering

Jesus Charles...when you are done, I'll pitch in to get you a patent on the thing.... :stirthepot::stirthepot::stirthepot:

Looks great, I may order when I will need a dual pump RRP setup....along with more of your work bud!

Yeah, but would it be a masterpiece like the one 1slow370 couldn't tell us about because reasons, but is so much better than everything anyone has ever done before or in the future? :rofl2:

3D printing is amazing technology. So much that it actually scares me. I have done a lot of 3D printing in the plastic injection molding side of my career, but I have only done very little with it for auto parts. I printed the fuel rails for the GTR for test fit since I had only a short time with the car and the rails are HUGE -8 rails with tight clearances... I didnt have time to make the billet prototypes and their fixturing because the car was leaving soon. So I used rapids to test fit and then sent the car on its way and shipped him finished parts later.

There are applications where 3D printing is great, and its often very cost effective. But for this intake manifold, its actually simple enough for me to print out life scale prints of the manifold on paper and just cut out with scissors and hold up to the car! You would be shocked at how quick and effective that can be! That is how we designed the DE manifold in the area that crosses over the timing chain cover with very tight clearance. Then we machined its outter surfaces out of sheets of MDF glued together to do a physical test fit. The CNC can machine away that stuff so fast and you get a head start on some of your actual part programming.

Thanks! I am finalizing the S2 and S3 versions of the RRP right now. Shipping the first one tonight!