ITB's?

regisbou · 06-16-2009, 01:04 AM

Would ITB's ever come to fruition for these engines?

You would think if the gain from exhaust and intakes alone are huge, imagine what ITB's would do.

Great throttle response etc.

Sure its alot of money, but with everything (I/H/E, tune, suspension, brakes, cams, motor mounts, gutting, etc) this car could have serious potential against alot of cars out there.

360whp with ITB's "can" be realistic. Now if anyone is willing...thats a different story LOL.

CBRich · 06-16-2009, 07:00 AM

ITBs are good for making power but the cost is so high and tuning is difficult.

B1nks · 06-16-2009, 01:55 PM

Also to my understanding cams are not part of the equation for the VHR because of that essentric cam being adjustable.

nogoodname · 06-16-2009, 01:57 PM

the VVEL changes as you drive...so no cam swap there

regisbou · 06-16-2009, 02:34 PM

Ohh ok. Just like the toyota's then with the VVTI. Damnit another brick wall to be in our way LOL.

But NA hp for hp will always smack FI. 330whp NA vs. 340whp turbo...turbo looses sorry

Just wanted to know if it was possible.

Thanks,

Regis

CBRich · 06-16-2009, 04:17 PM

Not like VVTI at all. There really is no cam on the intake side of this car.

regisbou · 06-29-2009, 07:01 PM

Ok so even if there really wasnt an adjustable cam on the intake side, if a CAI improves 15hp u would think ITB's would ad a nice touch as well.

They work best at high rpm's and considering the fact that these cars rev around 7.5k I am pretty sure it would be advantageous for track days etc...

I just know that on a track an good ITB setup will smack any FI setup because of throttle response and the fact that 330hp ITB'd will still smack 350hp FI.

While the FI setups will be around 500hp I see lag as an issue. But on a tight nit track the FI wouldnt be able to get to its top end/higher speed range and therefore fail in actually beating the ITB setup.

Now on a track like fujita or laguna seca the FI will have an advantage but a track like Infeneon Raceway or willow spring's the ITB in theory should be king.

Of course with a skilled driver!

And there's always the fact that they look cool as hell and they sound mean as hell lol.

DIGItonium · 06-29-2009, 08:58 PM

No because our 2 throttle bodies aren't doing anything much besides being used for emissions purposes. These things are 100% open all the time. There's a large stepper motor in the back that continuously controls the actuator for intake valve duration and lift, and that's our throttle.

regisbou · 06-29-2009, 09:17 PM

I'm confused...So even if we had 6 individual throttle bodies going directly into the intake there would be no real advantage? You know like velocity stacks etc..

I'm still confused lol

here's an example..

[img]http://jdm-insider.com/Blogs/Eric/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/itb.jpg[\img]

DIGItonium · 06-29-2009, 09:19 PM

LOL!!! This is pretty new to our cars since the G37 (first to have VVEL). Read up about it. There's videos demonstrating the system.

regisbou · 06-29-2009, 09:21 PM

I'm confused...So even if we had 6 individual throttle bodies going directly into the intake there would be no real advantage? You know like velocity stacks etc..

I'm still confused lol

here's an example...

regisbou · 06-29-2009, 09:23 PM

Ok I will read up about VVEL, I am kind of getting the picture...

It's not the throttle that directs the flow its the lift action on the valves?

Sounds complicated LOL

mrmixitup · 06-30-2009, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regisbou

360whp with ITB's "can" be realistic. Now if anyone is willing...thats a different story LOL.

You're not going to get 360whp with just an ITB setup on this car. You're going to have to go the balls-out N/A route:

Higher compression.
Agressive N/A cams.
Huge valves.
Port/polish.

Waste of money. A single turbo will do the same for 1/5th the price.

EDIT: Apparently you can't swap the cams anyway. Don't bother. Without a cam profile that can take advantage of the new setup, you're wasting your time.

mrmixitup · 06-30-2009, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regisbou

But NA hp for hp will always smack FI. 330whp NA vs. 340whp turbo...turbo looses sorry

What? You couldn't be more wrong.

VTalumni · 06-30-2009, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regisbou

Ohh ok. Just like the toyota's then with the VVTI. Damnit another brick wall to be in our way LOL.

But NA hp for hp will always smack FI. 330whp NA vs. 340whp turbo...turbo looses sorry

Just wanted to know if it was possible.

Thanks,

Regis

Can you explain....

From my point of view a turboed engine has a much flatter power curve beginning at a much lower rpm than an N/A engine. More power for a longer amount of time = faster car.

06-16-2009, 01:04 AM	#1 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	ITB's? Would ITB's ever come to fruition for these engines? You would think if the gain from exhaust and intakes alone are huge, imagine what ITB's would do. Great throttle response etc. Sure its alot of money, but with everything (I/H/E, tune, suspension, brakes, cams, motor mounts, gutting, etc) this car could have serious potential against alot of cars out there. 360whp with ITB's "can" be realistic. Now if anyone is willing...thats a different story LOL.

06-29-2009, 08:58 PM	#8 (permalink)
DIGItonium A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 3,800 Drives: 09 Z34-TT 6MT Rep Power: 42	No because our 2 throttle bodies aren't doing anything much besides being used for emissions purposes. These things are 100% open all the time. There's a large stepper motor in the back that continuously controls the actuator for intake valve duration and lift, and that's our throttle. __________________

06-29-2009, 09:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	I'm confused...So even if we had 6 individual throttle bodies going directly into the intake there would be no real advantage? You know like velocity stacks etc.. I'm still confused lol here's an example.. [img]http://jdm-insider.com/Blogs/Eric/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/itb.jpg[\img] Last edited by regisbou; 06-29-2009 at 09:20 PM.

06-29-2009, 09:19 PM	#10 (permalink)
DIGItonium A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 3,800 Drives: 09 Z34-TT 6MT Rep Power: 42	LOL!!! This is pretty new to our cars since the G37 (first to have VVEL). Read up about it. There's videos demonstrating the system. __________________

06-16-2009, 07:00 AM	#2 (permalink)
CBRich A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: SC Posts: 2,464 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 544	ITBs are good for making power but the cost is so high and tuning is difficult.

06-16-2009, 01:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
B1nks Track Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Houston,Tx Posts: 721 Drives: 2009 370Z Base 6MT Rep Power: 507	Also to my understanding cams are not part of the equation for the VHR because of that essentric cam being adjustable.

06-16-2009, 01:57 PM	#4 (permalink)
nogoodname Lifetime Premium Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Montreal Posts: 22,357 Drives: E46 M3 Rep Power: 1764	the VVEL changes as you drive...so no cam swap there

06-16-2009, 02:34 PM	#5 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	Ohh ok. Just like the toyota's then with the VVTI. Damnit another brick wall to be in our way LOL. But NA hp for hp will always smack FI. 330whp NA vs. 340whp turbo...turbo looses sorry Just wanted to know if it was possible. Thanks, Regis

06-16-2009, 04:17 PM	#6 (permalink)
CBRich A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: SC Posts: 2,464 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 544	Not like VVTI at all. There really is no cam on the intake side of this car.

06-29-2009, 07:01 PM	#7 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	Ok so even if there really wasnt an adjustable cam on the intake side, if a CAI improves 15hp u would think ITB's would ad a nice touch as well. They work best at high rpm's and considering the fact that these cars rev around 7.5k I am pretty sure it would be advantageous for track days etc... I just know that on a track an good ITB setup will smack any FI setup because of throttle response and the fact that 330hp ITB'd will still smack 350hp FI. While the FI setups will be around 500hp I see lag as an issue. But on a tight nit track the FI wouldnt be able to get to its top end/higher speed range and therefore fail in actually beating the ITB setup. Now on a track like fujita or laguna seca the FI will have an advantage but a track like Infeneon Raceway or willow spring's the ITB in theory should be king. Of course with a skilled driver! And there's always the fact that they look cool as hell and they sound mean as hell lol.

06-29-2009, 09:21 PM	#11 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	I'm confused...So even if we had 6 individual throttle bodies going directly into the intake there would be no real advantage? You know like velocity stacks etc.. I'm still confused lol here's an example...

06-29-2009, 09:23 PM	#12 (permalink)
regisbou Base Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 22 Drives: 06 Scion Xa Rep Power: 15	Ok I will read up about VVEL, I am kind of getting the picture... It's not the throttle that directs the flow its the lift action on the valves? Sounds complicated LOL