Stillen HFC vs. BERK HFC

Minicobra1 · 04-13-2009, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

If you compare the photos of the two carefully, it appears that the Berks have two things that the Stillens don't. First, the port for the O2 sensors on the Berks are extended out to make them more resistant to throwing CELs. Secondly, notice that the Berks have a second set of O2 sensor ports built in for hooking up wide-band O2 sensors on a dyno, whereas the Stillens do not. Just making a couple of observations.

Edit: They also appear to yield less gain and are significantly more expensive than Berk. (Sorry Stillen/Josh/Kyle -- you know I love you guys but I have to call it the way I see it.)

Yes, I noticed the ports for the O2 sensors too, does that make a huge difference in throwing a CEL??

SOLISIMO · 04-13-2009, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minicobra1

Yes, I noticed the ports for the O2 sensors too, does that make a huge difference in throwing a CEL??

I have test pipes with that desing and havnt thrown a code

semtex · 04-13-2009, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minicobra1

Yes, I noticed the ports for the O2 sensors too, does that make a huge difference in throwing a CEL??

Well, I'll share my own past experience and allow you all to draw your own conclusions. On my 350, I ran a set of Kinetix resonated test pipes. They did not have the extended O2 port, and they'd throw CELs every 200 miles or so. The remedy was what's known as the 'non-fouler' or 'anti-fouler' method, where you take two anti-foulers and drill one out so that the other one fits into it. What you do is screw one end into the O2 sensor port, and then screw the O2 sensor into the other anti-fouler. Now, the anti-fouler you're screwing the O2 sensor is not the one directly connected the port. You're screwing the O2 sensor into an anti-fouler that is screwed into another anti-fouler, which is screwed into the port. The anti-fouler that you're connecting into, then, is 'nested' into the other anti-fouler, so it's protected from the actual exhaust gasses. Net result -- no more CELs. By welding an extended O2 sensor port right onto the HFCs, Berk is trying to make our lives easier by replicating this anti-fouler method without us having to manually go buy the anti-foulers, drill one out, etc. Now, I'm not 100% sure on this, but I think they may be missing the 'nesting' part of it. In other words, the O2 sensors are being situated back away from the direct line of exhaust gas, but I can't remember if the end of that extended port is actually blocked off or not. If it isn't, then gasses aren't actually being completely blocked off from the O2 sensors. So that would explain why some people are still seeing CELs. If it is blocked off, then it's properly replicating the non-fouler method.

Here's a DIY link to the non-fouler method:

Stop CEL With Test Pipes - Nissan 350Z & 370Z Wiki

tranceformer · 04-13-2009, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

Well, I'll share my own past experience and allow you all to draw your own conclusions. On my 350, I ran a set of Kinetix resonated test pipes. They did not have the extended O2 port, and they'd throw CELs every 200 miles or so. The remedy was what's known as the 'non-fouler' or 'anti-fouler' method, where you take two anti-foulers and drill one out so that the other one fits into it. What you do is screw one end into the O2 sensor port, and then screw the O2 sensor into the other anti-fouler. Now, the anti-fouler you're screwing the O2 sensor is not the one directly connected the port. You're screwing the O2 sensor into an anti-fouler that is screwed into another anti-fouler, which is screwed into the port. The anti-fouler that you're connecting into, then, is 'nested' into the other anti-fouler, so it's protected from the actual exhaust gasses. Net result -- no more CELs. By welding an extended O2 sensor port right onto the HFCs, Berk is trying to make our lives easier by replicating this anti-fouler method without us having to manually go buy the anti-foulers, drill one out, etc. Now, I'm not 100% sure on this, but I think they may be missing the 'nesting' part of it. In other words, the O2 sensors are being situated back away from the direct line of exhaust gas, but I can't remember if the end of that extended port is actually blocked off or not. If it isn't, then gasses aren't actually being completely blocked off from the O2 sensors. So that would explain why some people are still seeing CELs. If it is blocked off, then it's properly replicating the non-fouler method.

Here's a DIY link to the non-fouler method:

Stop CEL With Test Pipes - Nissan 350Z & 370Z Wiki

I did the same with my 350z when I added a set of Fast Intentions testpipes. It worked just fine. It was a cheap and easy fix.

But for some reason when we installed a set of Helix v2 testpipes on my friend's 350z it didn't seem to work that well. The helix testpipes he had came with the built-in extensions for the o2 sensors, they kept throwing a code for some reason.

I never did like those kind of test pipes, I prefer the ones without the o2 sensor extensions.

semtex · 04-13-2009, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranceformer

I did the same with my 350z when I added a set of Fast Intentions testpipes. It worked just fine. It was a cheap and easy fix.

But for some reason when we installed a set of Helix v2 testpipes on my friend's 350z it didn't seem to work that well. The helix testpipes he had came with the built-in extensions for the o2 sensors, they kept throwing a code for some reason.

I never did like those kind of test pipes, I prefer the ones without the o2 sensor extensions.

On these Helix test pipes, do you by chance remember whether or not the extensions were closed off at the end where they connected into the test pipes? I think that might be the key.

tranceformer · 04-13-2009, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semtex

On these Helix test pipes, do you by chance remember whether or not the extensions were closed off at the end where they connected into the test pipes? I think that might be the key.

I know exactly what you're talking about with the 'nested' anti-foulers.

The helix ones weren't closed at all, it's just an extension with threads. I wanted to try adding the non-drilled anti-fouler onto the extensions but the o2 sensor wouldn't fit on. For sh*ts & giggles we tried the drilled out o2 anti-fouler, but that did nothing. One other thing I didn't like about the helix v2's is that the o2 sensor extensions are angled down slightly, maybe 5 to 10 degrees from what I remember.

ZforMe · 04-13-2009, 10:18 AM

I just read on another thread that BERK is about to design their own cat-back exhaust. I guess I'll be waiting just a bit longer to see how that comes out. If it fairs nearly as well as the Stillen exhaust, I may be going the BERK route for exhaust (I don't plan on doing headers in either case).

ZforMe · 04-18-2009, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZforMe?

I just read on another thread that BERK is about to design their own cat-back exhaust. I guess I'll be waiting just a bit longer to see how that comes out. If it fairs nearly as well as the Stillen exhaust, I may be going the BERK route for exhaust (I don't plan on doing headers in either case).

I'm interested to find out more about what this guy said. BERK any new details???

kenhdcgov · 09-09-2010, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranceformer

I did the same with my 350z when I added a set of Fast Intentions testpipes. It worked just fine. It was a cheap and easy fix.

But for some reason when we installed a set of Helix v2 testpipes on my friend's 350z it didn't seem to work that well. The helix testpipes he had came with the built-in extensions for the o2 sensors, they kept throwing a code for some reason.

I never did like those kind of test pipes, I prefer the ones without the o2 sensor extensions.

Hmmm!! So the question is was the problem resolved for the 370s or do he Berks still throw CEL warnings??

Thanks

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04-13-2009, 10:18 AM	#7 (permalink)
ZforMe Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Memphis TN Posts: 238 Drives: 370Z Sport Auto PG Rep Power: 18	I just read on another thread that BERK is about to design their own cat-back exhaust. I guess I'll be waiting just a bit longer to see how that comes out. If it fairs nearly as well as the Stillen exhaust, I may be going the BERK route for exhaust (I don't plan on doing headers in either case).