Berk Vs F.I cat back system question?
 

Hey guys,

I haven't herd them both in person. Only on you tube videos.

Berk cat back and F.I cat back with 18' res both systems matched up with HFC's

Which is louder? I know loudness isnt everything its more of the tone of the exhaust note. But feedback would be great!

In my opinion, Fast Intentions sounds extremely good in person. I've heard a Fast Intentions non resonated test pipe + 12 inch resonators stainless steel mufflers in person and I was literally blown away by how good it sounded. It sounds like an exotic car mixed with the deep sound of a muscle car. It sounds unique and extremely good!

I'm getting my Fast Intentions exhaust with 12 inch resonators and carbon fiber mufflers installed tomorrow so stay tuned for video and pics.

Trust me, you will be more impressed with the Fast Intentions in all categories. :tup:

I can promise you the F.I. will be louder/more aggressive.

The drone at cruising speed was enough to reject the FI exhaust. The big gain in whp from the Berk cbe and hfc's along with great sound made the choice easy for me. If you want loud and don't mind the drone then go for the FI cbe as they also look nicer.

I've heard both F.I. AND Berk in person, albeit the Berk CBE was paired with HFCs.

First of all, they both sound awesome and I promise, unless you're extremely nitpicky or over-sensitive, neither will disappoint you or leave you with buyer's remorse.

Fast Intentions exhaust makes your car sound like a totally different car. When my friend was coming from a few blocks away, I could have sworn it was some Euro import, $90k+ car. It wasn't as deep as I like, but definitely aggressive and head-turning. Exotic is certainly the word that is used most often, and it fits well, I promise.

Berk exhaust (again, I've only heard it paired with HFCs, which is probably an unfair comparison with F.I., admittingly) has a roar that, in my opinion, fits the car perfectly. It's a very deep growl, and possibly a little less volume than the F.I. CBE alone. Very aggressive, and the roar doesn't change from 3k->7k, you just feel it deeper in the pit of your stomach as you get higher in the RPMs!

They both are relatively quiet at lower RPMs, with the Berk being the more subtle of the two below 2k RPMs. Neither have any drone above 3k. I'm not going to comment about the drone of the FI below 2k, because I've only been in a 7AT, which has a lower shift point than what most MT drivers will choose. Now that the group buys are over, they are relatively close in price.

F.I. is a lot "prettier" of an exhaust system. The welds are impeccable and the rear view of the install is breath-taking. BERK CBE definitely has a stock look to it, and while the welds are strong and the fitment is right, it doesn't have the "wow" factor when you take it out of the box. Mind you, once it goes on your car, no one sees most of what I've mentioned anyways.

Another factor to keep in mind is your future plans with HFCs/LTHs. While both, assumingly, are compatible in any configuration, getting the full system of either may result in a more complete sound and/or performance. Then again, as I'm not an expert, it may not matter at all!!!

Great writeup Matt

Agreed that was a great help.

It's the same old story really

I'm impressed with F.Is quality and customer service.

I'm impressed with Berk being stock looking and sound.

I come from a WRX / Speed 3 background so I'm after somthing tuff.

I have been advised by Tony himself from F.I to go for the 18" res if I had high flow cats. However I am in my early 20s and I wouldnt mind somthing more wild and crazy. Plus I do alot of mountain driving, I dont want my F.I cannons taking out a Wombat.

P.S Matt, what res did your mate have?

If you have any concerns that your F.I. system may be too loud, go with the 18". If you have any concerns that it may not be loud enough, go with 12". That is, of course, if you're set on choosing that brand.

I'm certainly not trying to persuade you into choosing one or the other, and I absolutely revere Tony and F.I.'s customer service and professionalism, but assuming that both systems you mention in the OP last a lifetime with no mechanical issues (neither show any signs of poor, general workmanship), what's the single factor that you have to live with every day you own the Z? The look/sound/tone of the exhaust!

The system my friend, Zsteve, has 12" resonators, IIRC.

My FI CBE with 12/resonators has about the same sound level as you would hear from a V8 mustang, just a little less throatier, but right there with them. I have HFCs to put on but have a stripped bolt so I have to find a good shop to get it off then I will see how much louder it gets. right now its about perfect tone wise. There is drone but you will get that in any exhaust that has very little bends, but this helps in the performance department. It sounds like a muscle car and looks like a ports car.

hmmm, might wait and see how the next lot of berk exhauts go out.

If I went with F.I. I think the 12" res might be on the cards for me with carbon fiber mufflers for more a sleeper look. Wouldn't mind matching it up with the berk HFC's. Seems to be very high gains with the berks.

Here is the thing with mods and gains, IMO atleast. I have heard people say that have gained 15 hp/tq from HFCs and then I have seen some only gain 5 hp/tq (FI dyno shows this). I think whatever mod you do first nets the most gains as it opens the airflow to about its max effeciency. The later mods gain some but not as much as if they were the first mod you had done. This being that the flow is already close to perfect. So a HFC as a first mod will net 15 hp/tq, a CBE as the first mod will net 15 hp/tq, and G3 intake as a first mod will net 15 hp/tq. But you will not get 15 + 15 +15 when they are all done. So iwould say if you are only going to do one mod for right now pick the one that you would like to see or hear the most first. For me that was the FI CBE as it looks bad aZZ and sounds bad aZZ.

Steve, when are you coming back to Augusta? We'll make the community happy and do a HD video of both a BERK and FI drive-by, startup, and revs.

Agreed, any high flowing exhaust needs a good intake system. I'm currently ordering the injen intake in black.


I can only find 2 videos of berk cats and fi exhaust. None are taking off.

The stock intakes on our Zs aren't anywhere near as limiting as the stock cats/CBE are.

Should be there from May thru June. And Im gonna pick your brain about your job as its real close to what I have to do.

I got my Cobb accessport yesterday and I logged my air intake temps and they were only 8 -10 degrees over ambient temps so they do just as well as any aftermarket intake on keeping temps down. I put in K&N drop ins so Im sure they flow better too. I will logg my MAF but Im not sure what the numbers will mean, I need to PM modshack and see how the numbers shape up. The one thing the aftermarket intakes are doing that the stock isnt is they enlarge the MAF section a tad that tricks the ECU into adding more fuel or something like that.

The factory intakes are very efficient and are effectively cold air intakes since they source air from the same place that the G3s and Injens do (outside the engine compartment). They flow very well and are only a restriction after about 7,000 RPM.

True dat and above 7K rpms we are probably on the the down swing with power and should be shifting by then. I need to find out when the 7AT starts to loose power in each gear.

Any idea what the MAF numbers are trying to tell my dumb aZZ while Im logging them? Im not sure how to interpet the numbers.

:iagree: This would be awesome!!!!!! :tup:


EVL370...If you want a louder exhaust, then I would say go with the F. I. but you would need HFC's paried with it...The one's that I've heard are paired with HFC's and seem louder than the Berks that are paired with HFC's...

I personally like the sleeper/stock look, with a nice exotic and intoxicating sound...So I chose to go with Berk

Here's one of Minicobra1's Z....with Berk's CBE paired with HFC's...moving



Here's one with FI's on the move

Have you heard a Berk in person? No? Then how can you make the statement above?

I can promise you that the Berk will be louder/more aggressive :stirthepot:

Is there data to support this? I have not seen any data regarding gains from the Berk CBE. Anyone?

Indeed and a +1 to Matt!

Was it mentioned that the FI cbe is about 16lbs. or so lighter than the Berk?

He might not but I have. I have heard Minicobra's in person while I was standing right next to Bryan from Berk!

I WILL NOT say anything negative or descriptive about the Berk because they are obviously my competitor and that is not professional. What I can tell you is (from the outside of the car) the Berk is not as deep or smooth as our exhaust system. Do not get me wrong, the Berk sounds very nice however I feel our system has a deeper, fuller exhaust note. As far as looks that all depends on the person buying the system. Ours has a very aggressive look that in IMHO fits the car well. The Berk has a much more stock sleeper look to it. Some people want that. I do not fault them, that is why everything is subjective...

Thanks, Tony

First and foremost, our system doesn't DRONE at cruising speeds. I have sold almost 130 units in 8 months and I can count on less than one hand how many of my customers comment about drone. Yes, it can be a bit much for some and on the flip side some call me and tell me it is too quiet. On the 7AT we do get some drone while accelerating up to speed through the gears. In my opinion it is not an issue and we have many options. This is what makes life great, options to choose from so everyone is not stuck with the same thing!

Thanks, Tony

I do not know the weight of the Berk but our system ranges from 10 lbs lighter than stock to as much as 20!

The lightest option would be our straight through X with carbon fiber mufflers!

Thanks, Tony

I was looking for a real true dual exhaust. FI is way to go. My cousin has berk sounds good to me but I want something different. FI was there, and they have many options and the exhaust looks clean. Just wondering how my car is going to sounds with LTH, FI CBE. The intakes im not to sure about. Supercharger is calling me. lol

The avatar is classic bro!

Mike Bonanni posted before and after dyno results showing Berk hfc+cbe total hp gain.

"Berk Technology High Flow Cat/Cat-Back Exhaust combo is dyno proven
to make 36whp!"

I would expect FI also makes good hp gains.

No it doesn't make 36 RWH. Show me a dyno chart where the car has a baseline and then the HFC's and CBE installed at the same time with the gains in question.

Let's say for example the car makes 280 RWH (average on a dynoJet)
So show me a dyno chart where a car with Berk HFC's & CBE makes 316+ RWH! Produce the dyno chart and I will shut up!

I am not trying to stir the pot! Believe me, I have long cleared the air between Bryan (Berk) and I. We are good! However I am trying to set the record straight.

Thanks, Tony

No offense Tony, but you can't say your system "has a fuller exhaust note" and "eveything is subjective" in the same post. Against Forum rules. :rolleyes:

I'd like to dispute "fuller and deeper" comments, but the Berk I've heard (mine) was paired with HFCs, and the FI was not. I definitely would NOT say that Berk isn't full and deep, however. Far from it...

Maybe I wasn't clear enough in the post but the subjective part pertained to "the looks".

As far as sound, I have been doing this a very long time and custom built exhaust systems for hundreds of different types of cars. We have systems in production for over 10 different cars!

I think I can trust my ears to know what a deep full sound is! Either it is deep or it is not. Very black and white to me, no Grey. I never said the Berk system did not sound good. All I said was, ours was deeper, smoother and fuller...

Thanks, Tony

Fast intentions hands down

You cannot compare a Berk system with HFC's to mine without. The DB levels are too different and it is apples to oranges. If you want to make a proper comparison take both with no HFC's or both with.

Tony

I appreciate the support but you will get nowhere by just writing 4 words. Explain why you back us and you have had to heard both in person to make a proper assessment.

I am not trying to climb all over you but others will feel you are being biased without a description...

Thanks, Tony

Driving with the Fast Intentions TDX CBE for about 6 months now & I have no complains. The sound is 10/10. Straight up Rich/Exotic sound. Nice deep rumble. Performance wise, I feel it pick up EARLY. I always get people complementing my exhaust :) big ups to Tony & the F.I. team

Much better description but have you heard the Berk in person?