Intake, Header, HFC, CBE = Too Lean?

F.I. Inc. · 03-23-2010, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smallywood

Anyone running all 4 items? I hear that if you run all 4 parts you will lean the car out too much. Any feedback from members running or that have tried this set-up?

I have done extensive dyno testing and I can tell you with our headers and CBE the car does not run too lean. However, when you throw Stillen Gen III intakes into the equation it will need a re tune. The A/F will be way out of whack and in the mid to high 13 ratio!

Just to prove my point about not being too lean look at the A/F dyno chart here. This dyno chart is from my LTH thread. You can see the comparison between our HFC/CBE vs. our LTH's/CBE:

One more thing I would like to add. From just a performance standpoint, I feel that any aftermarket intake for this car is a WASTE of money.

From all of the dyno testing we have done, the gains have been very minimal and in most cases next to none! I have dyno charts that shows a car losing mid range power and some torque in trade of 3 horsepower up top.

For $500+ and the time or money to install it, I feel that you can spend your money elsewhere. Buy the K&N drop ins and call it a day!

If anyone has any questions comments or concerns PLEASE do not hesitate to ask. I can show dyno charts with many different combinations. What I can tell you is that the stock intakes do the job just fine... even with long tube headers installed.

Thank you,

Tony

Xan · 03-23-2010, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F.I. Inc.

One more thing I would like to add. From just a performance standpoint, I feel that any aftermarket intake for this car is a WASTE of money.

From all of the dyno testing we have done, the gains have been very minimal and in most cases next to none! I have dyno charts that shows a car losing mid range power and some torque in trade of 3 horsepower up top.

For $500+ and the time or money to install it, I feel that you can spend your money elsewhere. Buy the K&N drop ins and call it a day!

If anyone has any questions comments or concerns PLEASE do not hesitate to ask. I can show dyno charts with many different combinations. What I can tell you is that the stock intakes do the job just fine... even with long tube headers installed.

How come some threads and also Stillen are claiming impressive gains from the G3?

m4a1mustang · 03-23-2010, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xan

How come some threads and also Stillen are claiming impressive gains from the G3?

That's over stock, so they aren't going to show those high gains on a car that's already got exhaust mods done.

I'll take the other side and say they ARE worth it if you stay N/A as they help you eek out that last bit of power for your dyno numbers and sound really cool, but even with 18 whp gains over stock, you'll never feel it. Just look at that Stillen graph... the stock air boxes are super efficient 'til nearly redline (I think the stock pull on that Stillen graph is a little misleading -- it shouldn't fall flat on it's face like that at 6.5K) so the gains you see on paper can't really be felt because they're at the very end of the rev range.

F.I. Inc. · 03-23-2010, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xan

How come some threads and also Stillen are claiming impressive gains from the G3?

The numbers are impressive with a stock exhaust! Look at the numbers, this is a stock baseline. So the Stillen intakes uncork power in a stock exhaust application. Congratulations to all of those who are running around with a stock exhaust and Stillen Gen III intakes. I know I am sounding a little hostile and for coming off that way I apologize to you ahead of time!

The bottom line (dyno proven) once you change the exhaust system you free up the almost all of the power & torque. (I said almost all) Then you do the intakes, you will see they are not doing much of anything until close to 7000 RPM's! Like I said, I have seen cases where you lose some low end and mid range. We all know usable power is 3500-6800 RPM's, not 7000-7300!

Thank you, Tony

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

That's over stock, so they aren't going to show those high gains on a car that's already got exhaust mods done.

I'll take the other side and say they ARE worth it if you stay N/A as they help you eek out that last bit of power for your dyno numbers and sound really cool, but even with 18 whp gains over stock, you'll never feel it. Just look at that Stillen graph... the stock air boxes are super efficient 'til nearly redline (I think the stock pull on that Stillen graph is a little misleading -- it shouldn't fall flat on it's face like that at 6.5K) so the gains you see on paper can't really be felt because they're at the very end of the rev range.

You took the words right out of my mouth...

Tony

Nikon FM · 03-23-2010, 11:35 PM

Nice thread!

I'm running the Res Test pipes with the CBE (both F. I.) including K&N filters. If I was to go to the long tube headers there may be a too lean scenario? Getting a tune then would be the fix and provide a nice addition down at the mid + RPM range?

I'm curious how much more a tune would provide with my current set up as well.

drisko · 03-23-2010, 11:56 PM

I have a feeling once COBB finalizes the VVEL tuning aspect of the accessport, an intake will definitely be a worthwhile modification, since the motor in theory should be able to take in more air at the top end (assuming Nissan does not already have the cams at maximum lift).

bejan · 03-24-2010, 02:10 AM

Taken from another thread, see link below.

G37Sam drives a G37 and has Stillen G3 Intakes, FI Test Pipes & Catback and UR Crank Pulley.

He did an UpRev Tune and got 34HP and 32TQ gains.

Quote:

Originally Posted by G37Sam

Before the tune, I put down 262whp @ 7200rpm & 289 N.m
After the tune, I put down 296who @ 7600rpm * 321 N.m

I was very impressed with the numbers, but those don't mean anything if my butt dyno doesn't confirm. So I took the car out for a spin and all I could say was wow. None of the mods I ever installed ever felt like that after their install, you can feel the gains from really low. Even on 5th on the highway, it's takes less effort to speed up. On 1st, don't even dream about driving in a straight line on tarmac. We went Auto crossing today and it honestly felt a tad harder to drive due to its tail breaking loose with every blip on that throttle. I cannot be any happier to be honest, not without boost at least lol

Got my car tuned with UpRev

This is amazinggggggggggg.

03-23-2010, 11:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
Nikon FM Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Snoqualmie WA Posts: 973 Drives: 03 996TT Porsche Rep Power: 608	Nice thread! I'm running the Res Test pipes with the CBE (both F. I.) including K&N filters. If I was to go to the long tube headers there may be a too lean scenario? Getting a tune then would be the fix and provide a nice addition down at the mid + RPM range? I'm curious how much more a tune would provide with my current set up as well. __________________ Buddy Revell: "One man's sooner is another man's later"

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
DIY: Stillen header installation	semtex	DIY Section (Do-It-Yourself)	39	01-10-2017 04:29 PM
Running too lean?	G37Sam	Tuning	21	06-01-2010 10:25 AM
Stillen header issue finally fixed	1uk32	Intake/Exhaust	14	10-04-2009 06:37 PM
question about stillen header	chirojin	Nissan 370Z General Discussions	0	07-12-2009 02:38 PM
Muffler shop ? and header questions..	AceSpade77	Intake/Exhaust	3	05-06-2009 11:35 AM

03-23-2010, 11:56 PM	#6 (permalink)
drisko Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: So Cal Age: 45 Posts: 160 Drives: 09 370Z PW Tour S 6M Rep Power: 18	I have a feeling once COBB finalizes the VVEL tuning aspect of the accessport, an intake will definitely be a worthwhile modification, since the motor in theory should be able to take in more air at the top end (assuming Nissan does not already have the cams at maximum lift).