Don't forget youre AWD so you'll lose more whp through drivetrain loss, add that to different dyno, plus weather, etc etc.

Not really, The X is RWD till the rears slip( but ny dynos are alway squiggly, AWD fighting the dyno so some what right) . I made pretty good numbers already 412WHP is good for a auto. But I will lose more for the SPD, but your right dynos and wealther make a huge difference but 50??? LOL :tiphat:

This doesn't make sense. The HP output is a function of how much air and gas you can use. 12 psi is 12 psi no matter who builds the supercharger. The only other big factor would be the hp drain form spinning the SC and I highly doubt there is that big a diff between the two. Now where in the RPM range it makes power is another story, but peak power is dependant on peak air pressure and having enough fuel pressure to keep up with it.

^ on top of that would the STILLEN charge pipe with a single 2.5" pipe be able to handle all that air.

Not sure what you meant by "makes no sense" I was just saying basically we'll see if the Stillen kit can make that much WHP. I'm going to see 12PSI and will have enough fuel to support it ,We will how ever see if the single inlet pipe can deal with it.

10-11 PSI with my Maf's maxing out at 6600 rpms because of the small intake that Stillen kit uses. Just making that bigger would make more power and not max out the Maf's.

Thanx again man,, I was tossing arount the idrea of maybe splitting the tube after the SC, or would I have to spit it before and after, What size, Two 2 inch pipes or what?

If your going to do anything I would start with the small intake and get a 2.75inch one made for the maf's.Vince from R/T Tuning and my self talked about doing this just never got around to it.

As far as splitting the tube after the SC I wouldnt do that tell you do something about the first bottle neck in the system.

When I had the kit I thought about all kind of thing's to do to it making it a blow through set up instead of draw through like it is. It should have been blow through from the start.

Ok Will do,, I will look at the intake where the MAF's are but arent the Still twin tubes 2.75 now? An that would still go down to one tube to meet the SC? An sorry but can you explain Blow vs draw through? I have read a lot about it but not sure what it means really, I mean really think about doing this while the car is apart , Thanx Cliff

found a article about this.

Draw through vs. Blow through MAF

There are two ways of configuring a mass air meter in a centrifugally supercharged or turbocharged vehicle. Here are the pluses and minuses of each setup.
Draw Through

A draw through meter, as MAFs come from the factory, is less affected by bends in the pipes and reducers near the MAF. Remember that the Mass air meter relies on laminar airflow to get a good signal. A draw though meter must use a bypass valve – it bleeds off boost and recirculates pressurized air from in front of the blower/turbo to behind it. It must be done this way because the air has already been metered. If a bypass is dumped to atmosphere it will result in huge rich spikes that will kill drivability.

A draw through meter is a longer way from the engine. Add in an intercooler and there may be an unacceptable delay in what the mass air meter reads and how the engine responds. On a turbo vehicle, the turbos natural ‘spin down’ will create backwash through the MAF that cannot be tuned around. In worst cases, you must convert to blow through to get rid of this.

On a draw through setup you need to recirculate the bypass air when using it with a turbo or centrifugal supercharger. Designing a decent bypass can sometimes be tough - you need to route the return air line as far away from the MAF as possible, and even situate the pipe so it is blowing air at an angle away from the MAF and maybe add an air shield inside the pipe. With an intercooler, you'd need to most likely add two bypasses, one ahead of the IC and another after the IC. This can result in a plumbing nightmare. Bypasses must be big enough to handle all the air. Bypass problems will result in horrible drivability that usually cannot be tuned around - if you suspect a bypass problem, graph a log of MAF volts where the problem occurs. If it looks like a seismograph during an earthquake - that's your problem. Naturally if you run a twin screw or roots style blower, or are NA, your only option is draw through and on those systems, they work just great.

Blow Through

A blow through meter is more affected by pipe size and bends. This is especially true when using a draw through style MAF, i.e. with a housing in blow through. This is much less true when using an '05 style slot MAF as they are a lot more forgiving of bends. A blow through setup vents after the blower, but before the MAF, so the unmetered air can be dumped to atmosphere with a BOV, not requiring extra plumbing to bypass the air. This makes plumbing much easier.

Overall, blow through systems work well. When properly designed, they do NOT reduce the range of the MAF as internet misinformation leads some people to believe. Contrary to internet misinformation, a properly designed blow through system will be easier to tune and live with than a draw through setup. A properly designed blow through setup has the same diameter piping as the MAF’s diameter in straight sections if you are using a draw through style (factory style MAF with a housing). If the MAF is 90mm, use 4” pipe. It may not be practical to use 4” pipe for the entire inlet, but what must not happen is to use reducers right at the MAF or have bends close to the MAF. Use as long a section of the same size pipe as can fit, then do any reducing away from the MAF. The BEST alternative for a blow through MAF is to use an '05 Mustang style slot MAF, and in 3, 3.5 or 4" tube. The larger the tubing the more range the MAF has but it also has less low end resolution. Using a 'performance' style MAF such as a Professional Mass Air Systems HPX MAF will increase range even further. Note that even with a Diablosport MAF.ia the '05 style MAFs will NOT output to battery voltage, they have a limit of 6v. Using the HPX will negate this disadvantage as will going to larger diameter tubing for higher HP vehicles.

It's not a great idea to use an HPX MAF setup in a 4" tune on a lower HP car, it doesn't make it better to do this, just adds range at the expense of resolution. Always plan your MAF setup so that you will be using 80% of the theoretical range of the MAF.

Using an '05 style MAF in an earlier vehicle will require some additional parts. The MAF flange welded into the pipe and a late model pigtail. These are available from online vendors.

If my memory serves me any good there small like 2.0-2.25. Next time you have you bumper off just look at them there tiny. It does get a little bigger after it goes into one. But from a tuning stand point, the pipe being bigger after the fact is to late.

Blow through is how this car is set up from the factory ,and all the other aftermarket kits are designed on these cars. GTM TT Greddy TT GTM supercharger Boosted performance Mid mount S & R single turbo. Stillen is the only kit that is making the car do something it was not designed to do re-locate the maf's to the front.

Having the Maf's out front you cant read intake car temp with a long from uprev. They also max out at a lower HP level because of the size location/small pipe.

Blow through you can vent to atmosphere on our cars draw through Stillen set up you can not.

This is one of the reason's I sold the kit and did not put it back on my car with the built motor I am driving around with now.

I do think there can be more power had from the Stillen kit ,but you have to change thing's with the kit. Stillen is not on these forums anymore for support nor are they putting out any other stages of the kit.

Thanx a lot man,, So let me see if I get this. So I can just make the intake to the SC bigger 2.75 or 3? And move the MAF's to after the SC( But would have to split the pipes( Could use two 2 inch pipes). Or at least just make the pipe to the SC pipe bigger . I have the whole front of th car off now at the dealer, Thats why I'm even thinking about do this now the car is down and will be down for the next 2 weeks waiting for the SC to be fixed,.

I would love to Vince make the pipes for this but he only returned one of 2 emails and none of two phone calls. I'm sure they are busy with their own things but.. . . .

I would just make the intake bigger and keep the maf's there right up front, that way they can read the higher volume of air. Splitting the pipes after the supercharger would be a lot of custom work. You have to use the stock manifold have equal length pipes of the throttle body's to Air to Air intercooler.Thats a bit a custom work and would take someone knowing what there doing.

Just making the intake pipes bigger is simple and keeping the maf's where Stillen designed it.

Vince wasnt going to make the pipes for me I have a friend that does this kind of work.

The car is NA from the factory so it's definitely setup as draw-through. The presence of a compressor (SC or Turbo) in the system and which side of it the MAF is on makes it a potential blow through. When the MAF is post compressor it is blow-through, pre-compressor, just like an NA car, is draw-through.

OK , Thanx man Was thinking of staying with the Stillen mani tho there is another hear exchanger on there I would want to keep, So I will look into just a larger pipe to the SC then.

BTW I know Stillen is not on here , Why seems now one is really happy with them.. I'm in the middle with them right now, They guy I'm dealing with is mad cool, and helpful but overal just EH with them in general.

OK talking to a couple of guys on making the intake pipe bigger 2.75.

That's what you would need and put the Maf's housings right in them.

:tiphat:Making the while thing tho, Just seeing If I need to send them mine to trace or not.

Ok just got the word from Stillen, Everything is covered under warrenty, :) John @ Stillen has been really great, !!!

ok COOL Vortech is also doing the upgrade, Told me I had the SCI and they will be doing the SI upgrade? Anyone have info on that? Similar to the 928? I looked around the interent and only found it on a mustang forum, guys have good things to say, Boost comes in earlier in the power band.

Congrats on that great news. And :tiphat: to Stillen for working with you.

I know the car from the factory NA is draw through .I was just talking about how the kits FI are designed.


The SI is nice mustang guys use it and the E92 M3 supercharger kit made by ESS use it as well. Glad to here everything is covered for you man.

Hey Thanx man, Yea was reading alot on the mustang forums, Guys where seeing boost earlier, 2500 or so and it was doubled, Normally would be 3PSI @3k now seeing 5-6 PSI @3k RPM, If I can get something like that I would be very happy.

BTW my Stillen air intake has been shipped off to S&R this morning for tracing a "New " Upgraded intake 2.75!!!

Warranty FTW! :happydance: I'm glad Stillen could help! If only they could help me... ;-( :ughdance:

Thanx man, What happened to you?

Nice man good to here :tup:

Any updates? Did you re-tune/re-dyno the car after the impeller change?