GTM Turn key or tuner kit... difference?
 

What is the difference between these two kits? both would be stage 2.

From GTM's website: GTM Motorsports*::*FORCED INDUCTION*::*GTM 370Z (TURN KEY) TWIN TURBO KIT

Tuner Kit: You use your own external engine/fuel management system.

Turn-Key: Install, load tune on stock ECU, go :driving:

oh, cool.

So is the turn key the recommended option then? How are their tunes? Would an uprev tune after install be the best idea anyway?

The turn key is recommended if you don't have access to your own software/private tuning budget. It comes with a basic tune your tuner will then customize for your specific car. Tuning is usually included in a TT Install package from most dealers.

So you still have to go to a tuning shop either way?

You could theoretically install a TT or SC kit, and just run with it. But it is highly advised against taking an NA motor and making it FI without tuning it for such.

Will it mechanically run, yes...

Will it be safe... no.
Will it last... no.

Actually I just installed a GTM SC stage 1.5 and have Sam's uprev tune and put it on the dyno when my guy looked at it he said it was so close that he didn't want to mess with it,plus Sam's tunes are a little conservative so as to leave a little room to work with it,my car runs like stock but with a ton more power,so if you were to get another tune from someone else yeah you will probably need to get it retuned but don't forget Sam is the best in the business so his tunes are good.
After you install his TT or SC you log some data with your laptop and email him the info and if it needs to be changed he will adjust it and send you a new tune he also adjusted the line pressure in mine since it is a automatic.

Does that come included with the price of your original kit for him to do that, or is that something separate he's doing for you individually?

(I knew Sam had been doing things like this but didn't know if that was part of the kit price or not. I didn't want to comment saying he does it for everyone if he didn't.)

No he does this with his turn key kits,he is going a little futher checking mine since this is the first Stage 1.5 kit sold and I changed it to a smaller pulley already.

How are you liking it? Did you originally have the Stage 1 and upgraded, or went straight to 1.5? What stopped you from going to Stage 2?

I went and bought a 1.5 and went to the dyno and made 445 whp so now I changed it to a 88mm pulley down from 92mm and it should make about 455-465 whp and having a automatic and the 1-1.5 kits have better bottom and midrange power stopped me from going to Stage 2.

The turn key kit includes tunes from GTM which you can 100% safely run

The only tune known to cause problems is stillen isn't it?

yes, stillens tunes for their SC are garbage.

This is what I'm looking for, I like SC... but I'd really prefer to go TT.

450-500whp streetable. No good just having the tires smoke. :icon17:

(7AT also, so your build is really :icon08: to me.)

Sam told me that people on this site are blowing out of proportion the 7at subject if used responsible (no drifting,smoking the tires,and crazy hole shots)then the trans can last.

They are but it's understandable. You have people trying to drop from 7th gear to 3rd on the highway when an EVO pulls up next to them thinking they can beat AWD from a rolling start. :icon17:

I'm sure that it can handle the power. But for reliability and reassurance, I can understand why people are cautious and wanting to error on that side.

to load the tune, does this include an uprev licence and cable? I've been looking at the differences also and leaning more towards the SC nowdays.

Mine came with a cable and you download the software from Uprev and Sam @ GTM sends you a email with the tune and you reflash your ECU with his tune.

sweet thanks, was sure they used uprev but it doesn't specify on the site :)

For people who live outside of the USA, is there more risk going with the turn key. Are they better off and safer using the tuner version?

What's the risk?

I think he's got Tuner and Turn Key mixed up. Right? :confused:

I think he might mean because of climate/elevation changes the tune may not be good to run and need to get it re-tuned anyway? I had thought about this as well, but was going to get a custom tune done if I went this route anyway, happy to use the base map to get me to a tuner though ;)

I started with the 'turn key' tune. It was extremely well-suited. My tuner actually wished for it to be richer than supplied after we tested it. Sam@GTM made these changes.

Getting the 'tuner' version (which we have and have modified) will take someone REALLY good to improve what GTM supplied. I would not summarily say all tuners are equal (or better!) than Sam's version.

I'm fortunate in this regard, but you may actually be taking a risk to assume the tuner version will be even better.

Coop

then why spend all the money!?! 6MT FTW... :stirthepot:

B/c I can afford it.:tiphat:

I'm actually looking at the GTM turn key too if this GReddy deal falls through. What do you all think about the fuel system that comes with it tho? Could you really get something better for the same price or cheaper & have it still preform the same as the equipment they supply? Thanks for the information guys!

thats no fun...

Risk? Well, considering that there are few tuners that even come close to Sam's abilities with respect to forced induction systems on this platform, you are taking a huge risk by going with a Tuner Kit instead of our Turn-key Kit.

See, what most people don't realize is that Sam writes each tune specifically for the car the tune is for and he also considers the environment the car will be driven in. These aren't "canned tunes".

I'm not just saying this to sell more Turn-Key kits, I'm saying it because ultimately, it's in your best interest to protect your investment with a tune that will work extremely well out of the box.

Coming from the Subaru world, I cannot tell you how many times I've seen people drop copious amounts of money on powertrain mods only to cheap out on the most critical part: the Tune. Then they cry and complain about why their piston rings are fried and/or ringlands are broken due to all the detonation they've been unwittingly subjecting their engine to.

Another thing to keep in mind is that all of our kits use the factory MAF sensors in a blow-through configuration so that the ECU knows exactly what the temperature and density of the air entering the engine is. The beauty of that, is the fact that the factory ECU is capable of automatically self adjusting and learning based on whatever atmospheric conditions the car encounters.

For example, if you buy a car at sea level and drive it up to high altitude, do you swing by the dealership to get a retune? No. Of course not...the ECU adjusts itself accordingly. As such, the same applies to our tunes as well.

One thing I will say, is that whenever we build a car here at our shop, one of the first things we do is put one of our base maps on it to verify that it works like it should...and not once have we had to make any adjustments. Can we make a little more power than one of our base maps? Sure, but that's where the question of safety and risk come in.

See, whenever you get a custom tune, the main objective is to optimize the car for maximum power. Generally, they don't make the tune safer. They advance the timing a couple degrees and voila, you make more power. The problem is that if the custom tune is too aggressive with the ignition timing, you will be relying heavily on the knock sensor to retard the timing in the event that the engine detonates. That is a risky strategy especially considering that we are talking about a motor that was originally naturally aspirated and now has forced induction. Detonation under boost is far more devastating than detonation at atmospheric pressures.

Barring any installation issues, you will not have a safer forced induction system than our Turn-Key Kit offers. Our Turn-Key Kits make great power and work flawlessly out of the box without compromising safety.

As far as the fuel system upgrades that come with our Turn-Key Kits, yes, you can do better but at greater expense. You will not be able to do better for less, however. If you don't believe me, I invite you to price out the appropriate upgrades yourself and do the math. You really cannot beat the value, safety, or repeatability of our Turn-Key Kits.

Every other turn-key kit on the market either doesn't work, compromises safety or doesn't even come close to making the advertised power. Why spend the extra money only to have to get a custom tune to get anywhere near where you were expecting to be?

If you want a low risk, sure fire, turn-key, bolt-on forced induction kit, our GTM Turn-Key Forced Induction Systems (supercharger and twin turbo) are the only kits on the market that honestly deliver.

Well said Mike:tiphat:

Amen!

Word.

My question earlier simply related to factors such as climate, altitude, humidity, right hand drive and design rules that might not exist in the USA and whether or not a turn key kit would cater for them.

:tiphat:

I am sure that most with FI experience will agree, that a canned tune is only good enough for you to get to your tuners garage...
-Getting a custom tune from a reputable tuner is always your best bet.

You obviously have not rode/driven in a car with Sam's tune.:driving:

Didn't he just get through saying that this isn't a canned tuned rather a tune that Sam customizes specifically for each car? If you needed any tweaks done to your car I'd be calling Sam, not someone unfamiliar with the tune.

You obviously have little experience with FI..Simply another:nutswinger:
I know of a 370z that threw a rod running the same canned tune....:ugh2:

There are many variables that you need to take into account, and anyone with half a brain would want to get a custom tune completed..
-It baffles me why anyone that spends that amount of money, would skimp out on the most important factor of the whole process:confused:

Obviously you have no friggen clue to what we are talking about here:icon14:

I have a Stage 1.5 GTM SC on my car now and it has Sam's tune on it now,and as we speak I log some data that Sam wants and send it to him if it is not right he changes it and then he check it again,Sam is one of the best if not the best tuner for these cars if your buddy threw a rod then the guy obviously had something wrong.
I had my car on Z1 dyno and made 445rwhp on the first pull and the tuner there check it and said that it's good and there is no reason to screw with it.

Read this you actually may learn something "Reality"